Please help with wadcutter problem

[truckmsl]

Hi all

Been pulling my hair out with this one. I'm loading .357 with my own cast and sized (.358 Lee TL 148gr) wadcutters. I'm using a Dillon Square Deal that I've pushed over 35,000 rounds through, mostly .40 S&W but also many .357 jacketed.

What's happening is that in both .357 and .38SPL I'll be loading these wadcutters just fine, with the bullet set just a hair over flush with the case and a minimal roll crimp, and then randomly have a bulged band show up after seating the bullet.

This bulge is localized near the bottum of the seated bullet, and is large enough to prevent the round from chambering. The bulge is not the full length of the seated bullet, as in an oversized bullet. It looks as if the case may have buckled just enough to create a bulge.

I've tried more and less bell, checked everything I can think of with the dies, to no avail. The non-buckled rounds look perfect, with minimal or no "coke bottle effect", and all bullets were run through the same sizer. This is happening to about 20 to 30% of the rounds.

Hopefully someone else has had this problem and can clue me in as to what the heck is going on. Thanks in advance for any help.

[felix]

It appears you have too much slack in your seater die. If the boolit starts out at a small angle, then the angle will increase when boolit is pushed into the case. You need a die that will not let the angle increase at minimum. Ideally, you want a die tight enough to make the top punch and boolit align to each other before the boolit enters the die any more than a fraction. For excellence, see if you can borrow a straight line seater, like the newer Hornady's, for a verification. ... felix

[Scrounger]

Can't use other kinds of dies on a Square Deal, Felix, they are not at all like normal dies. I suggest call Dillon.

[fishhawk]

might be case length problem when the thing crimps it maye be pushing the case back and bulging havn't had that problem with my SDB......yet

[9.3X62AL]

You mention an apparent "buckling" effect.......apart from that, any chance that the boolit base is encountering inside case wall taper and swelling the case? Factory 38 Special wadcutter loads are put up in cases made with straight casewall interior profiles that run more deeply before the head taper commences. Target shooters eagerly seek out these cases for this reason.

[S.R.Custom]

Sounds to me like the base of the bullet is encountering the gradual thickening of the brass case sooner than you would like. Are you segregating brands of brass?

If so, and this is still happening, look at Remington or Federal brass. These two brands seem to be immune to this more than the others. Winchester and a few off-brands seem to be the worst.

[truckmsl]

Thanks for the quick response guys.

Felix - it doesn't appear that the bullet is crooked, as the bulged section is uniform around the case diameter.

fishhawk - I thought it might be the seater plug contacting a case mouth, but I've set up the die so that the wadcutter is not quite flush with the case. I would think if the offending rounds were a result of seater plug contacting the case, that would show up as the wadcutter ending up flush with the case mouth. Also, the crimping happens in a separate die, after seating.

All - I keep thinking it might be a brass problem, It appears to be happening mainly with Winchester and R-P nickel cases. Even if it was the brass I still don't understand the failure mode. I'll eliminate these headstamps and see if the problems goes away.

[S.R.Custom]

Also, if you're shooting a .357, try using .38 cases and seating the WC out of the case far enough to just kiss the entrance of the chamber throat when loaded in the .357.

[truckmsl]

Wow - you guys posted more before I could respond. Thanks!

9.3 and Super mag - sounds like you may have seen this before. Being new to wadcutters, I was not aware that some headstamps are not wadcutter friendly. I need to become more educated on this topic apparently.

It sounds like some .357 and .38spl cases are too tapered internally to accept wadcutters. Maybe that's what I've got going on.

[standles]

Check your case lenghts. IF some are long in the OAL it could be pushing those down when you crimp.

Steven

[BruceB]

Since this problem is occurring with both .357 and .38 brass, I doubt that it's cause is the same as what I encountered many years ago in .38 brass. However...???

In a certain make of .38 brass, the available airspace in the case was less than what existed in other makes. As a result, an expansion ring was produced right at the bullet's base when seating NON-hollowbased wadcutters. This was a consistent effect in all cases of that brand, and I believe its cause was overcompression of the air in the case..

My question here is this: does the bulge effect show up in ONLY ONE BRAND of .357 or .38 cases? If so, then it's probably an air-capacity problem, and can be solved by only loading wadcutters in the other brands which don't bulge. It would seem that a short test run may be in order, if it looks like only one brand is bulging.

[JMax]

When I was shooting PPC 10 years ago I used only WW brass and no nickel plated cases ever due to this problem. I found if the brass case was marked WW it was OK but if it was a +P or Winchester marked case I had similar problems. Perhaps newer brass has this problem with those head stamps but I keep my PPC WC brass separate for that purpose only. I used cast for practice and hollow base for matches.

[Crash_Corrigan]

My last die in my Dillon 550 is the Lee FCD. It resizes down the case to ensure chambering in my revolvers.

I do not know if you can use in you Dillon Square Deal press but it is a thought.

[shotstring]

Sounds a lot like a case wall thickness problem to me. That would make sense why +p cases are giving problems. Sometimes can be coupled with brass elasticity problem for thicker cases as well, as some brands of cases just seem to stretch more easily without bulging.

[truckmsl]

Thanks for the help everyone. Problem solved. weeded out some unfriendly brass and started loading .38's long for the .357 gun and all is well again.