45 acp questions,

[9w1911]

Up to bat for me this month is 45acp, will be running all types of powder bullet/boolit combos, my question for you fine gents tonight is:
I found some in my bench, they are 180gr RNFP .452 lead boolits, these are professionally cast, these have a crimp groove, is this any issue for 45acp? should I just seat to the crimp groove and go from there?

*get this, I have slugged the barrel last summer but had not measured it yet LOL dohhhhh !!

[Cmm_3940]

Depends on the boolit profile. When seated, there should only be a couple hundredths of shoulder showing, or they won't chamber properly.

[9w1911]

ok I will make a few dummies and see how they feed, the more I look at these the more the look like they would work great in a 45lc lever lol

very low shoulder, almost no shoulder

[ShooterAZ]

Only way to find out is load em & shoot em. Play with seating depth as needed.

[9w1911]

if its feeding issues I am not too worried I have had a lot of work done to the 1911 by a very good smith named Gene Shuey, that 1911 will eat about anything I have tried
I was questioning whether trying to seat to the groove or just above or below, I taper crimp my acp loads

[Pb2au]

You will have to sneak up on the correct seating depth. As stated above, there won't be much shoulder showing or it won't chamber.
Taper crimp. Just pull the barrel out of the shooter and drop the catridge in. It should plunk right in there.

[scattershot]

If it was me, I'd start by seating just over the crimp groove. That should get you close to the start of the ogive, which is where you want to be.

[geargnasher]

Find initial seating depth using the plunk test. Then make two dummies per that for manual cycling from magazine. After passing those two tests, research load data, load, and do the paper test.

Gear

[Old School Big Bore]

The first thing is to see if your 'start' seating depth will fit in a mag, much less feed. THEN dismount the barrel and do the plunk test to determine whether you have shank running into the chamber ledge...because if all you do is a chamber check, grinningly load a grand at that length, and it's too long for your magazines, you'd have an awful lot of single-shooting to do.

[Springfield]

IMHO since bullets with crimp grooves usually get some sort of roll crimp and the 45 acp is designed for a taper crimp, the crimp groove doesn't matter unless you get carried away with the crimp die and make the front of the brass too small and it won't seat properly. I have used bullets with crimp grooves in my auto and they work fine, as long as the cartridges seat properly, fit the mag, are the proper length to feed, and the bullets fit the diameter of the barrel. The crimp groove itself didn't really matter.

[9w1911]

so far the dummies fit in the case gage, I will do the plunk test soon, had to vacuum, the old ladies mother is coming into visit. off the top of my head the oal came out to about 1.184 with the bullet seated right at the bottom of the groove, this oal is not crimped yet and dropped into the case gauge no problem, looks like these loads will get imr PB for a test

[Larry Gibson]

9w1911

If you are going to load dummies for a feed test load a magazine full. The 1st couple rounds, especially with short stubby bullets, under full spring tension/compression will feed differently than the last couple rounds under minimal spring compression. The 1st couple out of the full mag most often dive nose down into the feed ramp/frame junction. If they don't feed most often that's where it will happen.

With "modern" magazine lips sometimes the short rounds also pop out of the mag too soon w/o the rim catching under the extractor. That also usually occurs with the 1st couple rounds under full spring tension.

Additionally on unthroated barrel/ramps and barrels with integral ramps the angle of feed can be too steep for the short stubby rounds. The bullet jams in the top of the chamber and hasn't the leverage to cam the rim up under the extractor. That too most often occurs with the 1st couple rounds out of a full magazine.

Larry Gibson

[Outpost75]

Some old design .45 ACP bullets have a crimp groove for loading ammo intended for use in revolvers. In an autopistol you can ignore the crimp groove other than perhaps as a visual reference to judge seating depth, and as a place to put more lube if you want to. If your dies size cases properly and you do not expand the case excessively, you only need enough crimp to remove any mouth flare, which would impede free feeding and chambering.

Always make a few dummies and perform a "bullet push" test. Do this my measuring overall length of six dummy rounds, then keep one as reference and compression testing five, holding the dummy round in the shell holder, pressing its bullet nose against a bathroom scale, holding a minimum of 40 pounds compression for 5 seconds. If the round does not shorten more than 0.005" you are OK. It the bullet does telescope into the case, adjust for a heavier crimp. If the bullet telescopes easily, then you need to change your expander plug. The straight portion of the expander should be 0.002" less than bullet diameter, i.e. .450" for cast bullets or .449" for jacketed bullets in .45 ACP, and .452" for .45 Colt and US M1917 or S&W M1950 and M1955 Target revolvers when using larger bullets to fit cylinder throats.

If you are loading .45 ACP for use in a REVOLVER, I recommend getting an old-fashioned roll crimp seater. This works best with .45 Auto Rim brass, but can be used with ordinary ACP brass, adjusting seating depth so that the rounds actually headspace on the front driving band of the bullet impinging in the chamber. In the old, old days, (1960s) we used to load for autopistols that way too. Taper crimp dies for the .45 ACP didn't become common use in standard dies until the 1970s. Before that you only saw them on the Star and Phelps loaders, or custom made.

[9w1911]

great thanks guys!!
will do LarryG

plus I never even considered the 45acp pistolas another: derrrrrrrrrr