BP and Ruger Single Actions and Colt Variants in 44-40 and 45 Colt

[Just Duke]

We spoke with some local folks here and they informed us that shooting Black in these guns locks the cylinder up after 12 rounds.
Is this correct?
Can one assume that one would get higher velocity with Black than the 8 grains of Unique in the 44-40 and the 10 grains of Unique with the 45 Long Colt I normally use?


I have for several years had these on our wish list.
1875 Army
http://i921.photobucket.com/albums/ad54/LEVERACTIONSHOOTERS/1875%20ARMY/1875_army_outlaw_nickel_lg.jpg~original (http://s921.photobucket.com/user/LEVERACTIONSHOOTERS/media/1875%20ARMY/1875_army_outlaw_nickel_lg.jpg.html)

[retread]

I shoot BP in my 45 Vaquero on occasion. After a dozen the cylinder does start to get sticky. I wipe it down after ejecting the spent brass. This seems to help a lot. I can shoot what I usually bring (box of 50) without having to do a thorough cleaning. May have to remove the cylinder during the run to do a better wipe down.

[bigted]

I shoot bp all the time in my new model vaquero. it likes it a lot and if you do a very simple thing ... you can shoot it a lot before it gets so sticky you have trouble cocking the hammer and revolving the cylinder.

this little thing is this ... just smear the chamber front full of Crisco as you would in a cap-n-ball revolver. this keeps the fouling soft and allows plenty of rounds before needing a face clean on the cylinder. then I take a wet rag and with the loading gate open ... I hold the wet rag against the cylinder face and rotate the cylinder till all the gunk is off the face ... then a dry towel in the same manner and then its all about keeping the thing red hot with shooting round after round.

the Ruger is very accurate and fun with the black powder rounds. the thing that gets them tight with bp is the cylinder gap between the cylinder and the barrel forcing cone. it needs to be .010 inch + or - .002. I have not done this to mine as I like the way it shoots smokeless very well but if I were to ensure my fondness for blackpowder only ... I would skiff off the barrel forcing cone so as to ensure the bp performance.

my conversion 1860 revolver is opened up to .012 inch and it shoots very well with either bp or sp and does not throw lead from the larger gap. I think that this is key to how many cylinder fulls it will devour without any fouling control on the cylinder face.

[Don McDowell]

Get a hold of a can of Goex's Olde Eynsford powder in 2f, lube the bullets with a good blackpowder lube and a thin card wad under the bullet. Use a case full of powder to help keep the fouling down.
I ran 50 rounds thru a 38-40 Bisley clone, the cylinder was still free, the accuracy was still as good on shot 50 as shot #1. It took about 3 cleaning patches to clean the barrel..
Even using regular goex 3f I have ran 25 rounds thru my new vaquero 45 colt. The cylinder was starting to bind a tad, but all you need do is wipe the face of the cylinder off and your good to go again.

[Springfield]

Use a bullet with enough (soft) lube and most single actions will work fine. I have been shooting BP in my guns at CAS matches for 7 years now, using 6 different sets of Ubertis, and all are stock and all work fine. I never clean my cylinders during a match. On a couple of occasions I have shot a match, put the guns away for a week and shot another match and still never had a cylinder fail to revolve. Lubing the front of the cylinders will work too, just messier.

[Just Duke]

Thanks guys that helps a bunch.
What about velocity difference? Black vs. Smokeless.

[bigted]

you can readily overload a 45 colt or 44-40 with smokeless powder. both these cartridges were built on black powder and the original loads were both powerful and did their job very well. the colt 45 was the magnum of its day and power wise didn't give up anything to anybody till the 357 magnum came on the scene.

you will not overload with black powder BUT ... you can get way more speed and power with smokeless. nuttin wrong with a black powder powered 44 or 45!

[Just Duke]

you can readily overload a 45 colt or 44-40 with smokeless powder. both these cartridges were built on black powder and the original loads were both powerful and did their job very well. the colt 45 was the magnum of its day and power wise didn't give up anything to anybody till the 357 magnum came on the scene.

you will not overload with black powder BUT ... you can get way more speed and power with smokeless. nuttin wrong with a black powder powered 44 or 45!

Thanks Ted. With the two loads I use listed it's at it's peak as far as powder in either cartridge goes.

[Holeinhide]

100489

This is a converted New army that I hunt with. I feed her a steady diet of .45 LC with 37.2 grs of Swiss 3f BP.
The cylinder will clog up and not want to rotate after about 25 rounds. I just keep a rag wet with moose milk and wipe the cylinder pin every 10 reloads or so, you can feel it starting to gum up so you will know when its time to wipe. As for colt .45 with black powder it will drop a white tail in its tracks at 25 yds. Could go out to 50 yds no problem, but I don't like to chase game so I keep it close.

[Wayne Smith]

Duke, I'm getting 750fps out of a 7.5" barrel on a Cattleman 44-40 using the 200gr Max big lube boolit and a modified Emmerts. I have shot 50 rounds loaded with 36-37gr FFG with only a little cylinder drag. As has been mentioned this can be easily fixed. That's all I need.

[John Allen]

Duke, I keep some old cotton cloths soaking with windex with vinegar. I just do a quick wipe to the front of the cylinder every couple cylinders full.

[chsparkman]

I can shoot a box of 50 through my Vaquero without sticking at all. I guess the tolerance is greater than some. I have 100 rounds ready to shoot during Spring break in just 3 weeks!

[GOPHER SLAYER]

Duke, I too have long wished I had bought an 1875 Remington in the 1960s when they were really cheap, like a hundred dollars. All I could think of were Colts. I bought and sold them for very little profit. To me the 1875 is a better design and the grip is much superior. In the old movie, Ride the High Country, L.T. Quinn carries one with mother of pearl grips. Randolph Scott takes it off his body. A friend of mine has an 1890 which belonged to his father who was a Policeman on the Apache reservation. I like it even better because of the sights.

[MaLar]

I used a grease cookie in my Ruger BH 45 Colt. Shot a full Cowboy action match that way.
Never had a problem, except that when the guys tried to put pastes over my bullet holes from close range shots. They wouldn't stick from all the grease on the target. They made me go last after that.

[Buffalo Barbie]

We spoke with some local folks here and they informed us that shooting Black in these guns locks the cylinder up after 12 rounds.
Is this correct?
Can one assume that one would get higher velocity with Black than the 8 grains of Unique in the 44-40 and the 10 grains of Unique with the 45 Long Colt I normally use?


I have for several years had these on our wish list.
1875 Army
http://i921.photobucket.com/albums/ad54/LEVERACTIONSHOOTERS/1875%20ARMY/1875_army_outlaw_nickel_lg.jpg~original (http://s921.photobucket.com/user/LEVERACTIONSHOOTERS/media/1875%20ARMY/1875_army_outlaw_nickel_lg.jpg.html)

I'll get your matching Vaqueros cuz they don't fit your hands still right?

[Just Duke]

I'll get your matching Vaqueros cuz they don't fit your hands still right?

You found my hide-y hole.

[Just Duke]

Duke, I too have long wished I had bought an 1875 Remington in the 1960s when they were really cheap, like a hundred dollars. All I could think of were Colts. I bought and sold them for very little profit. To me the 1875 is a better design and the grip is much superior. In the old movie, Ride the High Country, L.T. Quinn carries one with mother of pearl grips. Randolph Scott takes it off his body. A friend of mine has an 1890 which belonged to his father who was a Policeman on the Apache reservation. I like it even better because of the sights.

Thanks for the heads up.

Here's the full movie.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVsWGhsfXTg

[Just Duke]

OOPS! Wrong movie

[Just Duke]

http://www.tcm.com/mediaroom/video/284078/Ride-the-High-Country-Movie-Clip-My-Daughter-Elsa.html

[TXGunNut]

My 3rd gen Colt cyl gap (.002-.003) was probably too tight for smokeless, BP was almost impossible. A friend let me borrow his forcing cone cutter and we opened the gap to .007. No problems now. My replica guns measure about .007-.009 amd never had a problem.