AA 4064 in .30-30

[Bill*B]

Playing around with Quick Load this evening, I plugged Accurate Arms 4064 powder into a .30-30 with a 178 grain cast - and nearly fell over when I looked at the pressure curve. A full 2" of bullet travel before maximum pressure is reached! Seems almost too good to be true for a fairly stiff load (30 grains). If the computer simulation is accurate, this may be the ultimate gentle start. Any thoughts/experiences? Regards, Bill.

[35 shooter]

Don't know about the 30/30, but i just tried something kind of like that in the 35 whelen with imr 4350 for a gentler send off compared to 4895. Worked great and accuracy improved where it was already good with 4895 to fantastic so far with the 4350. Wound up with the same or a little better speed with even better accuracy. I tried it based on some older posts by 357 maximum and it worked great. If 4064 gives you the speed you want to attain in the 30/30 it might work along those same lines? Slower powder theory for gentler start of the boolit sure worked for me.....good luck, hope it works for you.

[rhead]

4350 is my go to powder in my 30-30. 4831 is more accurate but not enough more to offset the unburned powder granules that are leftover.

Your mileage may vary. With a tighter chamber or bore you may get better combustion. with mag primers the load is no longer more accurate.

[Bill*B]

Thanks for the thoughts/reports. When I can locate some of that AA 4064 I'll give it a try. Bill.

[FergusonTO35]

How similar is Accurate 4064 to IMR 4064? I picked up some of the latter to try in .30 WCF and .257 Roberts.

[MT Gianni]

The two are very similar per AA on load usage.

[Bill*B]

The powders are reasonably close, but not identical. Western's burn rate chart shows A 4064 to be a little slower than the IMR powder - but the interesting thing to me, if Quick Load is right, is that the Accurate 4064 powder has a marked "progressive" burn when it is first lit, with pressure building much slower than most powders. Now, is this real, or an artifact of the computer simulation? I've put a pound on order, and am about to find out if it makes any real life difference. Bill

[Shuz]

Years ago, back when Accurate was in Tn, I inquired of them the difference between their AA4064 and the IMR 4064. I was told by their head ballistics guy, that Accurate's lot to lot variation was less than IMR's. I do not know if that is the case, just what I was told. I bought an 8 lb jug of it and have been using out of it for years in my .35 Whelen with a 280g 358009.

[jaysouth]

The powders are reasonably close, but not identical. Western's burn rate chart shows A 4064 to be a little slower than the IMR powder - but the interesting thing to me, if Quick Load is right, is that the Accurate 4064 powder has a marked "progressive" burn when it is first lit, with pressure building much slower than most powders. Now, is this real, or an artifact of the computer simulation? I've put a pound on order, and am about to find out if it makes any real life difference. Bill

Bill, please keep us posted on this. I am very interested in this kind of new finds that crop up here on a regular basis.

[Bill*B]

My order is supposed to arrive tomorrow, so hopefully I can check it out by next weekend. Hope springs eternal! So far, my "best" powder for 30-30 accuracy is H 4198. 19.8 grains (the odd weight is what my Little Dandy measure throws) under any of my bullets (176 to 182 grains) is a winner, at about 1600 fps from my short 16" barrel. For a "field" load, IMR 4895 seems just a tad more accurate than 3031, but they are close! I'm hoping that AA 4064 will be the same sort of stand out that H 4198 is at target levels - hey, who knows! We'll find out.

[Bill*B]

I have the powder - it looks and handles like IMR 4895. Twenty cartridges loaded - but work and family obligations are preventing me from firing them! When I get some range time I'll report my findings. Looks like that will be a week or 10 days away.

[Bill*B]

Jaysouth, I haven't given up on this - but a perfect storm of events has conspired to keep the carbine in it's case. I'll post results when I have them. Bill

[jaysouth]

Jaysouth, I haven't given up on this - but a perfect storm of events has conspired to keep the carbine in it's case. I'll post results when I have them. Bill

I gotcha'. Life has been getting the way of too many of my pastimes. I can't figure out how people have time to work anymore. I scored a pound of AA4064 and anxiously await your range trip.

[runfiverun]

if nothing else it works very well in the 8 mauser with jaxketed bullets.
anyway the aa 4350 does rather well with cast boolits in many applications, it's much preferred over the other 2 because of it's easy ignition characteristics.

[Dutch4122]

Going to a powder with a slower burn rate than normal for a particular cartridge is a trade off. You get a gentler start and better case fill, but at the cost of higher muzzle pressure which can negatively affect accuracy. If your .30-30 had a 24 inch barrel I would be more inclined to say it would work fine; as a longer barrel gives you a lower muzzle pressure. Since you say that you have a carbine I'm assuming you mean a 20 inch barrel. You may find that the starting loads are actually more accurate than the near maximum loads with AA4064. If so, I'd suggest that you drop down in the burn rates to 3031 or maybe H322 and work up to the desired velocity.

Good luck and let us know how it shoots,:mrgreen:

[Bill*B]

I finally got to the range, and was a bit disappointed - with a 178 grain bullet, the little carbine wasn't happy with the 28 grain load that I tried first - marked vertical stringing, heavily smoked case necks, and a lot of unburned powder. A 29 grain load fared better - the group tightened up, and case neck obturation was O.K. - still more unburned granules than I like. Based on this, for 170 - 180 grain bullets in the .30-30, I'd advise starting with 29 grains of AA 4046 and working up.

My 94 is the "Trapper" version with a 16" barrel, and the tradeoff Dutch mentions is probably why it shoots so well with 4198. The faster power spanks the bullet harder to start, but has a much lower muzzle exit pressure.

I never thought of it before, but this "balance" is probably why I've struggled to get accurate loads with other slow burners like H 414 which other shooters (who are likely using longer barrels) shoot with satisfaction.

Jaysouth, I hope you have a 20" or longer! I'd love to hear your experiences with AA 4064. I haven't given up on it yet, and will try 30 and 31 grain loads to see how they work out - but I'm afraid that Dutch is on to something.

[Bill*B]

Shot a 30.5 grains AA 4064 load today - the burn was cleaning up, and velocity was impressive, but accuracy poor. Sadly, selecting a powder to give the softest launch was a failed experiment, in my 16" barrel. I'm heading back to the faster burning stuff that the little gun likes better.