new york militia remington rolling block 50-70

[Starvnhuntr]

I purchased a 50-70 rolling block new york militia rifle at an antique show a few years ago. does anyone have an opinion on what it is worth. it shoots a 6in. group at 50 yards. It is in really nice condition. it is complete with no major cracks or dings. wish I could post pictures or I mean figure out how to.

[boommer]

I have a NY that I picked up at a auction a few years back in same condition as yours and gave 300.00 for it . I see guys trying too get a 1000.00 all the time but i think they are dreaming. Unless its in pristine condition I would look at it as donor action or 650.00 would be tops for me (that"s me)
maybe somebody else could chime in here and seen what they go for.

[Bullshop]

When I question gun value what I do is go to one of the auction sites and put all similar auctions on a watch list. Watch over a period of time and you will see what the average asking prices are compared to the average selling prices.
Asking prices mean nothing. Selling prices are what have meaning.

[bigted]

I know nuttin bout the worth of your rifle but if it be in great shape ... it should be a super nice shooter. are you lookin to sell or just qualify your purchase?

what loads do you shoot to get those large groups? what powder? seems like it should do a bit better then that at 50 yards. if the bore is shiny and the chamber is fair ... there should be no reason not to get at least half the group size and maybe a LOT better then that.

[Scharfschuetze]

Lucky you Starvinhunter! I've considered buying a few different NY Militia carbines over the years. The ones I looked at used something like a 50/50 round in the carbines. As I didn't want to cut down any of my valuable 50/70 cases, I passed. Now in hind sight (20/20 as always) I should have picked one of 'em up.

Here is my Springfield Armory US Navy Model of 1870 rifle in 50/70. I think that other than the markings, it is pretty close to the NY Militia rifles. This one shoots pretty well, although it really throws its first shot from a clean bore. I managed to nick one of Larry Gibson's chronograph screens 20 or so years ago with a first round. Whooops!

[CanoeRoller]

Value on antiques is about three things:

Scarcity of the model in question.
Condition of the model in question.
How much someone wants to buy the model in question.

Without a qualified person checking on condition, the other two are not very important in the valuation. "Really nice condition," is a bit vague. Photos will help, but a true valuation requires someone who knows what they are doing taking a good look in person. Often very small details can make or break the value.

[missionary5155]

Greetings
I would be checking closely the real bore diameter. That rifle should easily half that group. Have a couple 50-70 muskets (Springfields) and none have the same throat diameter. Bores in mine are generaly fat. All the Rem. Roller Muskets I have all have fat throats and bores. But in all fairness a musket that will not chamber follow on rounds is just a heavy pig sticker if a bayonet is handy.
You might consider seeing if NOE still has any .515 Hollow Base molds left. I bought one just because any 50-70 with BP should shoot that boolit just fine.
Mike in Peru

[Starvnhuntr]

My rifle has 3 barrel bands and a bigger hammer spur. the hammer spur might be 1/2 to 3/4 inches taller. I shot it today and shot a 3 in. group with a duplex load using a lee boolit 5.7 gr. sr4759and 57 gr. goex cart. I think 3 in. groups are good at this point although it is not the norm. I might try another mold and straight black.as suggested here. always interesting and fun

[Ed in North Texas]

The NYSM is a little different than other models of that time period. The large hammer spur noted is one tip off, and the checkering on hammer and rolling block is in the form of a shield. When the breech block is rolled closed, the hammer drops to a half cock position and requires re-cocking to fire. The NYSM served with the NY Militia/Guard from purchase in 1872 until 1895. There is some possibility that some NY Guard troops mustered for the Spanish American War with the NYSM, but it is more likely that they were armed with US Army surplused Trapdoor Springfields.

Here's the best my old eyes can do with the NYSM, 7 shot group - Blew one and wish I had included a ruler:

99856

70 grains KIK 2f, .030 card wad, Lyman 515141 sized .515 w/home brewed lube Did not clean between shots.

[enfield]

Ed where do ya get them oval shaped boolits looks like about 5 holes ! you should have taped over that one in the black and nobody would ever know. Ha

[Scharfschuetze]

As an aside, but in keeping with Ed's post above, the NY troops in the war of 1898 generally used the Trapdoor Model 1884 and 1888 and not their Rolling Blocks. Probably due to the obsolete chambering (50/70) of the Rolling Blocks.

I have a 13th New York Infantry Regiment 1888 Trapdoor in my collection of Trapdoors. From my research on the rifle, one battalion (Companies D, F, M & L) of the 13th NY Infantry served in Puerto Rico with the 22nd Infantry under General of the Army, General Miles. General Miles, famous for the pursuit of the Souix after the Battle of the Little Big Horn and the Battle of Wolf Mountain, is often given credit for instituting real marksmanship training in the US Army in the 1880s.

[Ed in North Texas]

As an aside, but in keeping with Ed's post above, the NY troops in the war of 1898 generally used the Trapdoor Model 1884 and 1888 and not their Rolling Blocks. Probably due to the obsolete chambering (50/70) of the Rolling Blocks.

I have a 13th New York Infantry Regiment 1888 Trapdoor in my collection of Trapdoors. From my research on the rifle, one battalion (Companies D, F, M & L) of the 13th NY Infantry served in Puerto Rico with the 22nd Infantry under General of the Army, General Miles. General Miles, famous for the pursuit of the Souix after the Battle of the Little Big Horn and the Battle of Wolf Mountain, is often given credit for instituting real marksmanship training in the US Army in the 1880s.

The question came up as to whether any NYSMs were still in service in 1898. I spent hours reading an official report on the NYNG participation in the War. I never did find a definitive answer to whether any of the NYSM RBs were still in use (they are normally listed as 1872 to 1895). In fact the only commentary I found on weapons was an IG statement that the "muskets were in particularly good condition considering their age" (I might have missed a word, but that is the comment going from memory). I finally gave up on finding a definitive statement on the question, though I'm fairly sure that 1895 is an accurate end date for issue. It only made sense that they switched to the Springfield, standardization among the reserve units and cheap arms and ammo from the Army. I am amazed by the condition of this rifle, and the Swedish 12.7mm RB "Sporter" I have. Both bores are bright and shining, exteriors in great shape. They will be passed on to a Grandson or two who will keep them that way while enjoying shooting them.

An interesting read (for those interested in the history of older weapons and/or the Spanish American War) is History of the Gatling Gun Detachment Fifth Army Corps, At Santiago, With a Few Unvarnished Truths Concerning that Expedition. By John H. Parker, 1st Lieut. 13th Inf. (Late) Commanding Gatling Gun Detachment, Fifth Army Corps, at Santiago.

A Project Gutenberg EBook under the short title The Gatlings at Santiago Some of his "truths" are par for the course for an army mustering from under 29,000 soldiers and run like a super-sized company*, to just under 210,000. At least one other is not easily understood.

* As an example all unit supply requisitions had to be personally approved, with signature, by the Quartermaster General.