Smithy
03-13-2014, 07:34 AM
Pardon me first if I've yet doubled up again on previous posts. (my age, health, and yes I've been known to do this before). After all of that and a load of black powder loading for 45 LC both rifle and pistol and the very same grind of black (FFF) to load brass 12 gauge hulls to shoot in SASS matches. Now I'm sure I won't get any complaints using FFF in the 45's as that caliber being somewhat on the fence between FFF and FF as powder granulation's to choose from for the 45, but 12 gauge? That came straight from the shell manufacturer, MagTech themselves. So with MagTech saying FFF is OK in 12 gauge brass hulls I then chose it to be the granulation of choice for the 45's as well. I had the same exact load for both rifle and pistol so it made loading and reloading a simple operation. I've seen way to many SASS shooters with pink labels on their revolver loads to keep rifle and pistol apart. I personally would have chosen a different caliber altogether rather than have the same caliber, yet different loading's for rifle and pistol. Well I no longer do SASS and my caliber's have changed somewhat, but I still am a fan on one powder, one primer (if size allows), as few different cases as possible between chamberings, you get the idea. If I had my ruther's I'd choose just one caliber and have that be good for all of my weapons, but it just didn't end up happening that way as I merged into a Post SASS situation and going to smokeless rather than black. Black is just fine for my mortars and gear that I bring out every fourth of July to make a bang or two, but my now limited to indoor range tends to frown upon black as it kind of stinks up the place and obscures targets and such. They don't know a good thing when they have it I guess?
So as I morphed after SASS I chose among other things 44 magnum as one, had to keep the 38 special since my wife's very first anniversary gift was an engraved, ported, signed, factory done up Lady Smith. (this was before S&W figured out that the model 60 could be maid to digest 357's). So the gun is a keeper as well as the chambering. No worries though as even though I have a number of 357's and 38's all I've ever shot or load is 38 special. No ammo mix ups that way and less ammo to load for. And sure I have been known to shoot some really blast-worthy 44 mag's, it's not necessarily my personal cup of tea. In fact when I was loading black powder 45's with a 200 grain hand cast Lee boolit and having just a ever so slight compression load, that was all that I ever needed. Many a post has indicated that such a load would be more than just fine if called upon for a home defense load and I agree. So I'm not looking for hairsplitting performance out of either the 38 or the 44. Just a moderate, easy to load cartridge that will let you know that you've shot something and it will still put a nice sized hole in anything that needs to be shot. Home defense, cans, nice circular holes in a piece of paper, you also get that idea.
Well, now enters in another chambering of 410. Not to pick up a used MEC 600 jr. and load away with a sack full of Winchester AA's, no I've grown accustomed to loading brass hulls and like the steps at the bench to do just that. Lee Loaders in 410 are hard to come by (don't know how well they'd work with brass hulls anyway), and expensive if you do find an old one out there. Between my son and I, we've made a good assortment of specific dies as well as commercial ones to do some nifty loading of these 2.5" MagTech hulls. Also doing a bit of math I've figured out what was needed to turn the pellets from a 18 cavity Lee #000 buck mold into swaged disks of around 67 grains to place four such disks into a Ballistic Products Stretch wad, over shot card it and using a different caliber factory crimp die, compress the top of the otherwise un-sized hull around the wad package and then a quick pass into a 7mm sizing die for the hull to just kiss the shoulder area to impart a slight roll crimp on the shell. The rounds look absolutely perfect, don't rattle, chamber easily, will work in a tube magazine, and drop into the cylinder of a Rossi Circuit Judge like nobody's business. I just do not have the whole powder thing figured out?
After all of that History (If I haven't lost you yet?), I'd like to get a smokeless powder that will take care of all three loadings to a doable level not necessarily excelling in any one caliber or the other. Oh by the way, the intended projectile for the pistol rounds will be a Lee 158 grain tumble lube boolit for the 38's and a Lee 240 grain tumble lube boolit for the 44 (which easily can be of 44 special power, just included in a magnum case). I was suggested to try Hodgdon's Lil Gun, but finding any information of that for the three is next to impossible. Also I've gotten the "Only Black Powder" warning for the brass 410 hulls or any of the MagTech brass regardless of gauge. I know that that is bum information since I've seen plenty of smokeless loads in the SASS bunch with MagTech brass.
What does everyone think of Trail Boss as a possible powder to do all three tasks? I've seen it used a lot in SASS as an easy to use powder that is smokeless and bulky so that double loads are next to impossible to have happen. This powder is great for Cowboy type loads in both 38 special and 44 special as well so It's only a matter of the extra 44 magnum case space and if or if not being able to use it in my 410 defensive loads? Anybody have any information of this powder or on its use in a 410 hull? I'd think that if they showed some lighter loads for the 45-70 or 444 Marlin that I'd be headed down the right powder direction with this powder. That way I'd have my one powder, easy and forgiving to load with, and smokeless so that I could resume shooting at the indoor range. As well as having a hole maker should any creepy thing in the night happens to need a hole in it sometime? What's you-all's thoughts? Smithy.
So as I morphed after SASS I chose among other things 44 magnum as one, had to keep the 38 special since my wife's very first anniversary gift was an engraved, ported, signed, factory done up Lady Smith. (this was before S&W figured out that the model 60 could be maid to digest 357's). So the gun is a keeper as well as the chambering. No worries though as even though I have a number of 357's and 38's all I've ever shot or load is 38 special. No ammo mix ups that way and less ammo to load for. And sure I have been known to shoot some really blast-worthy 44 mag's, it's not necessarily my personal cup of tea. In fact when I was loading black powder 45's with a 200 grain hand cast Lee boolit and having just a ever so slight compression load, that was all that I ever needed. Many a post has indicated that such a load would be more than just fine if called upon for a home defense load and I agree. So I'm not looking for hairsplitting performance out of either the 38 or the 44. Just a moderate, easy to load cartridge that will let you know that you've shot something and it will still put a nice sized hole in anything that needs to be shot. Home defense, cans, nice circular holes in a piece of paper, you also get that idea.
Well, now enters in another chambering of 410. Not to pick up a used MEC 600 jr. and load away with a sack full of Winchester AA's, no I've grown accustomed to loading brass hulls and like the steps at the bench to do just that. Lee Loaders in 410 are hard to come by (don't know how well they'd work with brass hulls anyway), and expensive if you do find an old one out there. Between my son and I, we've made a good assortment of specific dies as well as commercial ones to do some nifty loading of these 2.5" MagTech hulls. Also doing a bit of math I've figured out what was needed to turn the pellets from a 18 cavity Lee #000 buck mold into swaged disks of around 67 grains to place four such disks into a Ballistic Products Stretch wad, over shot card it and using a different caliber factory crimp die, compress the top of the otherwise un-sized hull around the wad package and then a quick pass into a 7mm sizing die for the hull to just kiss the shoulder area to impart a slight roll crimp on the shell. The rounds look absolutely perfect, don't rattle, chamber easily, will work in a tube magazine, and drop into the cylinder of a Rossi Circuit Judge like nobody's business. I just do not have the whole powder thing figured out?
After all of that History (If I haven't lost you yet?), I'd like to get a smokeless powder that will take care of all three loadings to a doable level not necessarily excelling in any one caliber or the other. Oh by the way, the intended projectile for the pistol rounds will be a Lee 158 grain tumble lube boolit for the 38's and a Lee 240 grain tumble lube boolit for the 44 (which easily can be of 44 special power, just included in a magnum case). I was suggested to try Hodgdon's Lil Gun, but finding any information of that for the three is next to impossible. Also I've gotten the "Only Black Powder" warning for the brass 410 hulls or any of the MagTech brass regardless of gauge. I know that that is bum information since I've seen plenty of smokeless loads in the SASS bunch with MagTech brass.
What does everyone think of Trail Boss as a possible powder to do all three tasks? I've seen it used a lot in SASS as an easy to use powder that is smokeless and bulky so that double loads are next to impossible to have happen. This powder is great for Cowboy type loads in both 38 special and 44 special as well so It's only a matter of the extra 44 magnum case space and if or if not being able to use it in my 410 defensive loads? Anybody have any information of this powder or on its use in a 410 hull? I'd think that if they showed some lighter loads for the 45-70 or 444 Marlin that I'd be headed down the right powder direction with this powder. That way I'd have my one powder, easy and forgiving to load with, and smokeless so that I could resume shooting at the indoor range. As well as having a hole maker should any creepy thing in the night happens to need a hole in it sometime? What's you-all's thoughts? Smithy.