Using .45GAP in Full Moon Clips for S&W 625.

[Grapeshot]

I found a small batch of .45GAP brass at the range I work at. I took them home and loaded them with a 185 JHP and using SPP and Clays powder. Some of the cases would not fit tightly in the Full Moon Clips. However once the cartridges are in the chambers, the FMC will hold them in place and eject them when done shooting. In my case, accuracy was no different than using .45 ACP cases.

Just thought I'd share this in case any of you find a batch of .45GAP and have a 1917 or 625 that you load for.

[williamwaco]

Thanks for that report.

I have a few of them but have never loaded them.

[Catshooter]

Interesting.

Since most auto pistols actually headspace on the extractor I've thought that the GAP brass would probably work in an auto too.

Never know in a pinch.


Cat

[ClemY]

I confess I haven't tried .45 GAP in my 625 but I have shot .40 S&W with moon clips in my 610. Works fine, but at least with the ammo I tried, it isn't as accurate as shooting 10mm in it.

[Westwindmike]

I have fired 45GAP in my 1911 chambered in 45ACP. I loaded them light and used a Lee 190gr SWC. They fed and cycled in my Springfield 5" 1911. The extractor held them in place and they worked fine. Don't think I'd want to shoot factory GAP though. Much higher pressures I've read.

[imashooter2]

A few of the guys over on Enos' board use the GAP brass. Hard to picture faster reloads than .45 ACP, but any edge real or imagined in racing. :)

[MtGun44]

"Since most auto pistols actually headspace on the extractor" often repeated myth.

Bill

[reed1911]

Since most auto pistols actually headspace on the extractor

Completely untrue. Most auto pistol cartridges headspace on the mouth of the case. The fact that many semi-auto will hold cartridges by the extractor is simply due to well made extractors. Never should you use a .45 GAP cartridge in a Semi-auto .45 Auto chamber. It is dangerous and at best a good way to shoot inaccurately.

[Groo]

Groo here
The correct statement would be, " Many autos CAN headspace on the extractor"
Not recomended , can cause breakage of extractor, but given the big variations in brass and chamber length may happen more often then we would like......

[Groo]

Groo here
As to the OP I have read of some shooters using 45gap in 25/625's for faster reloads or to help with a very short extractor.
The pressures are in the range of 45 +p and is no problem, some shoot 45 super in their 25"s.

[reed1911]

The correct statement would be, " Many autos CAN headspace on the extractor"

Nope. Not correct either. Headspace is (loosely defined here for ease of reading) the point on a cartridge that dictates the length from that point to the breech face. On many bottle necked cases that point is somewhere on the shoulder, roughly at the 1/2 way point, on rimmed cases it is the front to back of the rim, on most semi-auto cases it is the case mouth the base of the cartridge. The whole point of dictating headspace is to define the chamber so that my brand brass and your brand brass all fit properly and the case does not split apart due to excessive headspace. Beyond that to insure that the dies are made to fit the cartridge. And on the calibers that headspace on the mouth, to define how short you can trim them and keep it all working.

So, no, it cannot headspace on the extractor. It can be held there, but it cannot headspace there. There are exceptions here, the .38 Auto originally did headspace on the semi-rim although it was found that changing that to the mouth made a much more accurate cartridge and it was changed with the .38 Super. The .25 auto does headspace on the rim. However, even with those, you will notice, it is the rim and not the extractor.

I'm not trying to split hairs here, not trying to sound like a know it all or bully. Just trying to keep you speaking right on the subject. Many cartridges will fit into other chambers and fire. That does not mean that it has proper headspace nor does it mean it is safe. SAAMI has a long list of interchangeability and safety here:

http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/SAAMI_ITEM_211-Unsafe_Arms_and_Ammunition_Combinations.pdf

[Grapeshot]

I should have mentioned that the Moon Clip determines Headspace in the 625 using the .45 ACP or the .45 GAP. I would not try the .45 GAP in my 1911 or any other auto chambered for the .45 ACP. As far as the GAP having a higher pressure than the .45 ACP, I've never seen that in print in any of my reloading manuals or in the various Gun Magazines. My intent was to show that the cartridge can be fired in the revolver safely.

[Westwindmike]

As far as the GAP having a higher pressure than the .45 ACP, I've never seen that in print in any of my reloading manuals or in the various Gun Magazines. .
According to Speer Ammunition, the GAP is a 23,000 psi cartridge and the standard 45 ACP is 21,000. +P in the ACP is 23,000.

http://www.speer-bullets.com/pdf/45GAP%20Tech%20Brief_150dpi.pdf

[reed1911]

Grapeshot, you are correct, all my comments toward headspace deal with the semi-auto chamber.

I've also reamed out a 625 to shoot the .460 Rowland and still shoot .45ACP in it as well. No problem there with headspace. The higher pressures of full loaded .460 would be questionable, however I have all my gear for proper pressure testing and keep my loads in the sane range. I see no issue with shooting the GAP in the 625, although accuracy will likely vary from one to the other.