How Good is Good Enough?

[aprayinbear]

I know this might seem like a simple question but....

I cast for all my handgun loads (.380, .357/38, .44, .45) and use a good mix of wheel weights for each. I quench my bullets as well. Whatever I cast seems to shoot without problems in my handguns and my loads do not seem to produce any leading. Accuracy seems good.

My question is.... How perfect are the bullets you cast? Unless mine have a significant void or dent I just size, load, crimp and shoot. I do not weigh my bullets either. That means I load a lot of imperfect bullets. Ironically, I measure every powder load on a scale, keeping the powder for each round as uniform as I possibly can.

I am an informal target shooter and shoot at 10, 25 and 50 yards. Other times I just plink for cans and steel plates.

I wish there was a way to know how much a certain imperfection impacts the path of a bullet.

I shoot for enjoyment, not for perfection. So how perfect are your bullets? How perfect do they need to be?

Happy shooting!

[perotter]

Mine are perfect enough to do what I expect them to. I expect them to shoot better than standard store bought, in multiple guns and at a lower cost. I don't remelt very many back down. Only those that for whatever reason didn't completely fill.

[Taylor810]

If they fly straight and hit hard, that should be good enough.:Fire:

[Shiloh]

I used to be really fussy about perfect boolits. I stopped with pistol boolits. If it has good fillout and a good base, it gets loaded and fired.
I was spending way too much time fretting over the boolits. Rifle boolits are more critical. I spent an afternoon once testing boolits, perfect boolits and not so perfect boolits got fired from a rest at 50 feet. I had groups that were near identical. Sometimes the targets with perfect boolits were the best, and sometimes it was the other way around. At 25 yards, the boolits with flawed bases were a bit more obvious.

flawed boolits from the '03 Springfield had biggger groups at 100 yards. At 200 yards it was obvious. Better boolits obviously shot better.
This is with open iron sights and my 57 year old eyes.

SHiloh

[rockrat]

I usually wasn't too fussy as I won't claim to be a crackshot. Did weigh my boolits and inspect them and went and shot them to see if things got better. Nope

Some of my rifles, I will visually inspect them when sizing, but thats about it.

[NSP64]

Handgun- cast, visual for obvious imperfection. Lube size shoot.
Rifle- cast, visual inspection, check diameter, weigh, lube size shoot

[josper]

I don't get crazy weighing boolets. If I can see a defect it goes back in the pot other wise I shoot them. They must be all wright as I get groups I'm satisfied with. If I was shooting competition I would start weighing them.

[Echo]

I'm sorta fussy, but not anal. My boolits have to have good, square bases, even the GC ones. They need good fillout in the loob groove area. And I would be embarrassed if anyone were to see one of my loaded cartridges whose boolit had folds showing, so those get recycled. But.
I don't weigh my boolits, nor do I weigh my powder charges. Once I have the measure set, and checked, the charges go from measure to case, to be covered immediately with said boolit. I throw my pistol charges with a Pacific/Hornady Pistol Powder Measure, if I'm not using the Dillon.

[dbosman]

Sadly all my work is capable of better accuracy than this shooter can achieve.
I'm very near sighted in one eye. Using open sights on a rifle I can just make out a paper plate at 100 yards. I need to try using my off eye.
I have benign essential tremor so good enough for hand gun is a paper plate at 50 yards. Tin cans are in danger though.

[Jack Stanley]

If it's good enough for what you're doing then it's good enough . I tried to get fussy with an old Cramer hollow point mold for a thirty caliber rejecting any minor flaw then weighing the rest . The I tried shooting the "scraps" at reduced range with a minimal load ....... Accurate enough for pest control to fifty yards or so with "scrap" . I still do save the really nice ones for faster speeds and longer range .

Jack

['74 sharps]

Unless the base is totally out of whack, for my pistol rounds, it goes down the tube. My Sharps bullets are scrutinized more; however, they are not bench rest rifles but I do load only the ones that are very good.

[**oneshot**]

Square bases and bands are required for me. I only weight sort my 22cal boolits, it shows defects that I miss in visual sorting alone and got rid of my fliers.

[tyeo098]

If it comes out of the mold and it boolit shaped I shoot it. Dents in the driving bands are just more crevices for tumble lube :)

[Hickory]

When you're satisfied it's good enough.

[Bullshop Junior]

I'm pretty picky. They need to look exactly like the inside of the cavity or I'm not happy.

[southpaw]

If it is blasting ammo and it resembles a boolit then it gets loaded. For the non blasting ammo the only ones that I have weighed have been the 22's. Not sure how much it help cuz I got side tracked durring that project. The rest of the boolits go through the visual inspection and then sizing lubing. I started casting so I could shoot more. Maybe some day I will see if I can better my groups but for now 1.5-2" at 100 yards for rifles is fine with me. I am mostly shooting them freehand anyway.

Jerry Jr.

[swheeler]

I've always said perfect is close enough!

[pls1911]

NSP64 summed it up well.
Don't distress much over run of the mill pistol bullets... if they're well filled out and bases square, you're good to go.
I am more fussy about my rifle bullets , giving them the inspection noted for pistol bullets plus weight segregating +/- .5 grains then combining mini-lots into logical +/- 1 grain quantities to maximize yield.
I also size and lube .002 over bore, the finish with JPW/LLa tumble lube.
OCD over kill, yes... but with great accuracy and NEVER a trace of leading...
I also clean and treat with Ed's Red (with acetone and lanolin) after each session, and again before eash session.
Micro Groove and Ballard rifling shoot equally well, so long as the alloy is hard enough and the velocity reasonable.

[aprayinbear]

Thanks for your responses. I don't feel so bad now. Most of my shooting is 25 yards or less with my handguns and honestly I didn't think being anal about the perfect boolit would tighten my groups or increase my scores that much. I think I'll just spend more time shooting, enjoying myself!

Shoot Often, Shoot Safe & Enjoy!

[Love Life]

Pistol: If the blob of lead falling out of the mould sort of resembles the cavity then I load and shoot it.
Rifle: Haven't matched jacketed performance so the cost savings is nowhere near worth the time spent working on it.

[dragon813gt]

Pistol, good base, no voids in the hollowpoint with no major flaws then they get shot. Rifle and hunting bullets get an inspection that is more meticulous. I still don't weigh them. I'm looking for minute of deer so I have a lot or room to work with.

[Leadmelter]

Ditto to the above:
Fill out,flat base and a good lube.
Leadmelter
MI

[lonewelder]

Sharp drive band and base filled out gets shot or stored over primer and powder.life is to short to fuss over pistol boolits.if I were shooting a match with rifle boolits that's different.if someone can show me a wrinkle makes a difference in a pistol at 25 yrds I would like to see it

[meece]

I inspect the boolits carefully and any flaws or rounded bases go back into the pot. I weigh my boolits and divide them into batches, IE 167.5-168.5 get batched together 168.6-169.5 get batched together, once I have enough of each weight I will then load say 100 from the same weight batch and shoot them next batch might be a grain lighter or heavier.
funnly enough 167gr seems to be the most common weight (about 60%) from our 7.62x39 160 grain Lee mold

[Fishman]

I have become more picky as my casting skill has improved. I have boolits from 15 or more years ago that I am still loading and rounded bases are common on the pistol boolits. It doesn't seem to matter in low pressure plinking loads.

In higher pressure loads like 9mm I am having to be much more careful or I get leading. My policy now is to reject any boolit with a rounded base, defects in the driving bands, or obvious wrinkles. I have not weighed rifle boolits but suspect I will do so when I have a need for more accuracy.

[6bg6ga]

Pistol bullet molds are Magma and the caster is a Ballisti-cast Mark IV. Bullets come out fine. I do inspect the first 100 or so to check temp and throw back any that are cold. Bullet quenching....used to think that it helps but not after reading an article that told me there was nothing to be gained. Now I use water simply as a means to be able to handle the bullets sooner.

I use a Magma / Star sizers with Lathesmiths dies and the result is a quality sized lubed bullet.

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

when I started casting, I culled anything that didnt look perfect.
Now, if the base is good and the nose is good, I load and shoot.
I find that weight sorting seems to be a waste of time for me.
the other day, I loaded up some "culls" for my new to me 45-70,
and was switching to a new lube, so I had a small lot of mixed lube,
voids, carpy bands etc, I thought, shoot them to get the old
lube out of the barrel and get the new lube settled in.
Those 8 rounds produced the best group of my day[smilie=1:
I find myself wandering why bother being to picky -short of
"saving face" with my friends at the range by showing
off purdy boolits

[mdi]

Depends on your personal standards. I don't differentiate between "plinking", SD, target, or "hunting" ammo I reload, and I know that's just me. I got the time and don't mind making each round the best I can whether the target is an old beer can or trophy blacktail. But, if you use "looser" tolerances the "Reloading Police" ain't gonna knock down your door and confiscate your "inferior" ammo. It's what you are comfortable with. I don't weigh my bullets anymore (I have taken samples to weigh to find out what the molds produce with a certain alloy, but I don't sort by weight). All my bullets "look" good to me and I mic them, other than that, I don't do much with my cast lead stuff other than lube and shoot...

[MT Gianni]

Under 25 yards gets minimal inspection, 25-75 a closer look and over that a hard look.

[hickfu]

Oh I wish I wasnt so OCD!!!! I weigh every single boolit I cast and if it does fall into a certain weight group it goes back into the pot..... Dont laugh but I take a drill bit to the flash hole on the inside of every case to make sure that it is perfect... you would be surprised how many companies dont care about how crappy a job they do on flash holes.... Stop laughing! LOL

I have always been a perfectionist and it does get annoying to both me and the wife.


Doc

[dromia]

As the range and velocity increases so does the quality controls.

For 25 yrd plinking most will get shot for long range over 600 yrds, then boolit choice, weighing, measuring, single cavity casting, known alloy, choice of lube, careful concentric sizing and exact case prep, reloading and neck tension are all applied.

So really it depends on what you want but each boolit needs to just perfect enough for the task.

[jeepyj]

I can only comment on handgun boolits. Starting out with good lighting over your casting area will help cull nicely as you cast. I look for a crisp boolit with sharp edges with no wrinkles. I find an occasional misfit as I'm sizing.I do not weigh them prior to loading. At 50' and a rest they will group very nice. I think they look and shoot good but I'm sure they aren't perfect.
Jeepyj

[newmexicocrawler]

I'll shoot ugly boolits without a second thought......if it looks filled out I'll load it. I don't weigh every boolit.

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

As the range and velocity increases so does the quality controls.

So really it depends on what you want but each boolit needs to just perfect enough for the task.
This is my process, higher demands means higher quality

[Garyshome]

Hey if you are happy i'm happy for you!

[dverna]

As the range and velocity increases so does the quality controls.

For 25 yrd plinking most will get shot for long range over 600 yrds, then boolit choice, weighing, measuring, single cavity casting, known alloy, choice of lube, careful concentric sizing and exact case prep, reloading and neck tension are all applied.

So really it depends on what you want but each boolit needs to just perfect enough for the task.


Exactly!!!

If you are shooting 3-400 rounds a week for IPSC or CAS where accuracy is not critical, weighing bullets is a waste of time. Same for rapid and timed fire in Bullseye.

Don Verna

[Blackwater]

I confess, I began casting back when I was in college - couldn't shoot for the money on hand without it - and back then, I was much more concerned with quantity than with quality. However, I WAS rather picky within my demand for quantity, and by experimentation and experience, I cast some pretty darn good bullets. However, I was NEVER so picky as when I got a BPCR, and began casting for THAT! Now those big, heavy bullets got my goat at first - voids & all manner of faults, and the bullets wouldn't shoot worth spit! Well, there ain't a lot of quit in me, so I began researching, and found that if I used straight lead/tin mixes with NO ANTIMONY, I got pretty darn good bullets. Why it's this way, I'm still not entirely sure, but I know by the results what'll work and what doesn't, and THAT is the important part. I love a mystery anyway, really.

Now, if I want to REALLY bear down and shoot my absolute best, I use what I've learned about casting those BPCR bullets, and they're better (more consistent and accurate) than ever. So ..... if you're just getting started, or haven't been doing it for very long yet, don't be disheartened, and never, Never, NEVER get to thinking you know all there is about casting. The hallmark of any REAL pro is that he's always anxious to learn, and he'll learn from anyone - even tyros, sometimes. That's the way it's worked for me, at least. Never think you're too busy to take the time to wrap up some newsprint in pasteboard boxes to check out penetration, expansion, etc. Accuracy is crucial to any shooting endeavor, but performance of the bullet when it reaches its target is equally so. Wisdom creeps in slowly when you do this fairly regularly, always varying something to see what the actual effect is vs. what you were trying to achieve. If you cast hollow points, you'll need the newsprint tests to REALLY get to know your bullets and loads. After all, the bullet's behavior is part of its performance, too, right?

[44man]

Been casting so long I can empty a 20# pot without a reject. Heat up the mold and the first boolit is perfect. I just cast a pile of .44 boolits without a reject.
I don't weigh boolits, BIG waste of time.
I HATE to cast, put on checks and lube, boring as boring can get but what else can one do to shoot?
Truth is that I hate to load ammo too!
Started casting sinkers as a kid, then jigs and boolits but back then they were bullets. So I have fooled with lead for about 66 years.
Age didn't matter back then so I was buying guns with paper route money, could get revolvers through the mail too. Good times were ruined by liberals.

[largom]

This mostly depends on what the individual enjoy's doing. As for myself, I truly enjoy handloading and I make each loaded round as perfect as I possibly can. Most all of my loading is for rifles and I use single stage press's. I sort my brass by head-stamp and weight. Debur flash holes, ream primer pockets, trim, chamfer, and polish.
For my cast boolits I visual inspect then sort by weight for no more than .2 gr. +- variation or less. I weigh every powder charge.
Is all of this necessary? No but it's what I like to do. My goal is to shoot all boolits in the same hole. Have not done that yet but my fun is trying.

Larry

[44man]

I like the shooting. I like accuracy so it takes work. But it is work. I like the work, not the repetition.
Every morning I take the honey bucket and a shovel into the dog pen, it is large, 70' by 40'. I clean up poop for a reason. My dogs do not stink and are healthy. I hate the job. It must be done.
Repetition is EVIL.

[Walter Laich]

I used to fly radio control. My idea of fun was to fill the tank, or plug in the battery, and fly.
Some of my fellow flyers were engineers. They would record the temp, humidity, wind speed, cloud cover, length of flight, etc.
Turns out we both enjoyed the hobby to about the same extent.
.
Sort of the same in casting--do what makes you happy and satisfied

[nighthunter]

Personally I probably shoot a few handgun bullets that someone else would cull. I try to use uniform bullets for target work but my blasting ammo uses some definitely defective bullets. Now with my rifle bullets I get more picky about defects and weight variance. Every bullet we cast isn't going to be perfect. We have to make the judgment call as to whether the blemish is still usable for some of our purposes. Its all part of the fun.

Nighthunter