Front Sight Quandary Revolver vs. Semi Auto

[Silver Jack Hammer]

One of my Colt Series 70's is placing the boolits way too high so the fellas at Brownell's helped me with ordering another front sight that is going to be tall, .225". This tall front sight should dial the point of impact down to meet the point of aim. Now I'm gunna have a 1911 that doesn't have the all desirable "low profile" sights. Talking to myself about this change I am puzzled as to why a tall front sight is very desirable on the revolver, especially the single action but why is the tall front sight offensive on a semi auto? In the semi auto world "low profile" is the term addressed with a sense of desirability, but on the revolver it's just the opposite.

Background; Series 70's come with tiny sights and the slides require dovetail cuts to mount adequate aftermarket sights. I'd sent this slide into Trijicon and they mounted a Novak rear and a tritium front to my request but obviously failed to look at the targets I sent them or read my letter which instructed them to correct the elevation disparity between point of aim and impact.

So I'm going to have a 1911 with a front sight that is going to be tall and wide. I suspect it will be scoffed at by my brothers in the shooting fraternity. Not that I'm sensitive to scoffing, I've been known to offer a scoff to two myself in the past. But no one takes their Ruger single actions to a gunsmith and says can you make the sights "low profile." When on a semi auto be it a 1911 or a striker pin manufactured for sale on the current market the consumer wants low profile sights.

[oneokie]

What load/s are you shooting in this pistol?

[C. Latch]

Different tools for different purposes.

[Silver Jack Hammer]

The loads are quite a variety logged into my book including factory American Eagle, Federal HST +P, Blazer, Remington Golden Saber and Speer Lawman 230 FMJ plus my 452374 with 5.2 - 5.4 gr of Bullseye, 4.5 gr of American Select, 6.0 - 6.5 gr of Unique, and even 230 gr Sierra HP j-word with 5.2 gr of Bullseye if I'm forced to admit it.

[ole 5 hole group]

You're still behind the times Jack Hammer.

As to why the low profile sights on the 1911? probably because that's what the military contracts called for. In civilian hands the sights were "upgraded" to adjustable sights.

Today, more and more target competitors of all disciplines (where legal) and some everyday users of 1911's are going to red dots and a growing number of those switching to red dots that use the 70 series Colts (or clones thereof) are starting to go with a milled slide and a reflex red dot, such as the Leupold Deltapoint or Trijicon RMR red dots. With the milled 1911 slide and reflex red dot - I doubt the average person can draw, fire and hit a small target at 50 yards, as fast as, one can using the milled slide/red dot set-up. If you have good young eyes, the red dot probably won't help you with accuracy but speed - well, you just have to get behind a milled slide to appreciate what it can do for you using both eye open of course.

Here's a site showing what that set-up looks like and the cost.

http://www.bowietacticalconcepts.com/pictures.html

[Silver Jack Hammer]

ole 5 hole group, I don't have young eyes. In fact with rifles where I work they issued optics on AR's to about 40 of us, I did not take the issued rifle with optics but kept my iron sighted AR. We had this course where we had to run over 50 yards and put 5 hits on paper at 50 yards. When I showed up people pointed at my rifle and asked if everything fell off it but when the course was done, this old man with old eyes took first place -with iron sights.

Every qual we show up at somebody can't get their fancy new optics up and running, it's either rattled loose or suffering from dead batteries or something.

I know one guy using a reflex sight on his pistol, but he's not working the street. A manufacture gave it to him and asked him to test it. He says it's been working great. His days of facing the elephant are over, he travels and teaches and knows what he is talking about but the optic was given to him as test.

[ole 5 hole group]

Jack Hammer - Here's my Baer 1911 and my AR. I'm fairly confident you could thump your co-workers even more by using my toys. The T-1 micro Aimpoint on the AR - battery life should be close to 3 years left on continuously - not too shabby. The DeltaPoint should go 12 to 18 months - shuts off when no motion for a couple minutes, instant on when grabbed - again, works extremely well.

Notice the 1911 has backup sights that can be seen through the headsup display - just in case something would happen to that great optic - you're still good to go. I have the backups regulated dead nuts at 50 yards. Aimpoint on AR is dead on at 200 yards.

[Scharfschuetze]

Silverjack,

You didn't say how high the 1911 was shooting, so it's hard to do the math as to how much higher your new sight will be in comparison to your old sight. That said, sight changes on handguns are very small in comparison to the result down range.

For a Government Model 1911 with a 6 1/2" sight radius that is shooting 6" high at 25 yards, the correction is only .043." That's less than a half of a tenth of an inch.

I bet you'll hardly be able to notice the difference and if you can, it really won't amount too very much I bet. I seriously doubt that your fellow officers on the firing line will notice. And really, who cares if they do? You've done the right thing to zero your handgun which may be more than your comrades have done.

Another option, if you really want or need the lowest possible sights, would be to order a lower rear sight or just do some judicious file work on your current sight until it is zeroed with your duty load.

[gray wolf]

First off who cares what is scoffed and what is not ?
The problem seems to be with this V


I'd sent this slide into Trijicon and they mounted a Novak rear and a tritium front to my request but obviously failed to look at the targets I sent them or read my letter which instructed them to correct the elevation disparity between point of aim and impact.
They should have corrected the problem. Anyway, When you get done filing the new sight down it wont be to tall.
To wide ? who knows.
Low front sights are sometimes preferred so they do not snag a holster when drawing the pistol.

[Silver Jack Hammer]

The point of my OP was wondering why the tall front sight is very desirable on a revolver and undesirable on a semi auto. I'm thinking the reason for this is the revolver is used at longer range, such as in the field where we want to be able to hold more front sight over the top of the rear sight for longer range shooting which we can do with the .357 and .44 mag, but the .45 ACP is not conducive to much over 100 yards. Instinctively I just don't think of the 1911 as a long range pistol, nor the .45 ACP as a long range round so the semi auto has been fashioned into a none long range set up hence the low profile sights.

The two other Colt 1911's I own have the same Novak rear sight and the height of their front sight is the same as my troubled shooter that hits high. This one that hits high is not my primary duty pistol, nor my secondary back up but it is my 3rd tier shooter. Still I want it hitting correctly to point of aim.

The problemed pistol is hitting about eight (8) inches high at 25 yards.

[Groo]

Groo here
The tall front sight on a revolver is required because the gun rotates on firing and the barrel needs to point below the target
so that when the bullet exits the barrel is lined up.
Also many revolvers have thin barrels and the mount needs to be taller.
An auto [1911] moves back[unlocking the barrel] and moves up so needs less front sight.
The barrel slide lockup in a 1911 can effect how high or low the boolet will strike also.
A loose fit [shorter link ] will hit higher than a tight fit [longer link]

[FLHTC]

I high profile front sight will snag when it's drawn, but not too many in urban areas carry a single or double action revolver for self defense so on revolvers it doesn't matter. JMO

[DRNurse1]

First off who cares what is scoffed and what is not ?
The problem seems to be with this V


They should have corrected the problem. Anyway, When you get done filing the new sight down it wont be to tall.
To wide ? who knows.
Low front sights are sometimes preferred so they do not snag a holster when drawing the pistol.


Groo here
The tall front sight on a revolver is required because the gun rotates on firing and the barrel needs to point below the target
so that when the bullet exits the barrel is lined up.
Also many revolvers have thin barrels and the mount needs to be taller.
An auto [1911] moves back[unlocking the barrel] and moves up so needs less front sight.
The barrel slide lockup in a 1911 can effect how high or low the boolet will strike also.
A loose fit [shorter link ] will hit higher than a tight fit [longer link]

Good analysis. If the group size is similar with all three guns and the other conditions are similar, consider the fit of the slide to receiver, barrel to bushing, barrel link as well as (if a fixed sight) lowering the rear sight in addition to raising the front sight.

There are a variety of ways to reduce the potential for snagging with a taller front sight (ramping, lowering,...) which is a consideration for a duty or back-up firearm. Match sights are taller, wider, undercut, and /or adjustable.

You did not mention if your firearms are 1911A1 style or one of the other manifestations of the 45ACP delivery device. The position of your hand on the grip is affected by the various designs so this may be the simplest solution (different grip for this gun) but the most difficult to employ safely.

Good luck, and if you decide to give up, sent the gun my way, I can make it work.---:-)---

[Silver Jack Hammer]

Got the new front sight today, it does look only a little bit taller, can't wait to have it installed and tested. Called the 'smith and left a message, waiting for a call back to take it in. That tritium dot in the old front sight really distracted me and can't wait to be rid of it. I'm sure the extra height of the new front sight will help.

[.22-10-45]

By the time the auto's became popular..there was less need for pulling fence staples![smilie=1:

[Silver Jack Hammer]

By the time the auto's became popular..there was less need for pulling fence staples![smilie=1:

Great Comment!