Interesting take from my dealer why powder is not available!

[sig2009]

......

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

Is it April 1st already?

[338RemUltraMag]

I am starting to believe that "dealers" are playing the "lets throw **** at the wall and see what sticks" game.

WE, US, YouIns, and shooters in general are feeding the craze. If everyone held 2 cans of powder and that was *plenty* pre panic then everyone "needs" another 12 cans "just incase" the demand placed on the powder is NUTS!

Now due to the stupid Govt it is not easy to open a new explosive plant to meet demand, hence the shortage.

[338RemUltraMag]

In no way am I slamming people who are buying powder when they find it, I do the same thing, but it seems a lot of people want to believe this kind of rubbish because they do not want to look in the mirror and say "I am partially responsible for the madness"

I AM a part of said madness and really dont care, it is what it is.

[uscra112]

Is it April 1st already?

I wish. I'm sick of snow.

[Outpost75]

My LGS here has both Alliant and IMR powder in stock, both 1 lb. canisters and caddies. Selection is somewhat limited, but they are getting powder.

[jonp]

Well I'm not saying he is making an excuse as to why he does not have any powder but I bought 8lbs of Promo from Powder Valley last week and just got 8lbs of Unique from Third Generation a few minutes ago.

Me thinks a little fib is involved here somewhere.

I have in mind the amount of powder I need in stock to last as long as the current shortage has lasted and after that I will replace only what I use. I've passed a couple of lbs of Unique on already at my cost to people that can't find it.

['74 sharps]

"If you like your powder, you'll be able to keep your powder"..............If you can't believe a LGS, who can be believed????

[mdi]

I always consider the source of these wild accusations. How many local gun shop owners truly have inside info from ammo and component manufacturers? Do LGS buyers deal directly with the factories or do the buy from a whole sale dealer? If I can buy a spray can of paint or flammable materials on line and have it shipped to me via truck, or train, then the EPA is asleep, or mebbe the EPA ain't involved in shipping powder...

[10 ga]

The dealer I buy powder from was told directly by Alliant that they can no longer sell him any powder. He was told that the EPA has gotten involved with the reloading componets and the powder manufacturers can only sell to the ammo manufacturers.


It's true it's true!

I just got a home equity loan and plan to buy ALL THE POWDER! If you need any you better hurry, I'm filling the cart up as we read and type! 10

[cheetah]

I'm more inclined to believe that as soon as the truck pulls into Cabela's five clerks call fifteen buddies who gather their friends from Jersey and wipe the place out in two hours.
That was kinda silly to have a show in Allentown and Philly at the same time.

[dragon813gt]

I AM a part of said madness and really dont care, it is what it is.

I am the same way. I don't care what others think. They need to realize they are the problem as well.


"If you like your powder, you'll be able to keep your powder"..............If you can't believe a LGS, who can be believed????

I never believe anything I hear in the shops. I equate the talk there to TMZ reporting on celebrities.


That was kinda silly to have a show in Allentown and Philly at the same time.

Wasn't the one an antique type show. I don't bother w/ any of them anymore. And Oaks isn't Philly ;)

[youngda9]

It is in your "dealer's" best interest to fuel the paranoia so he can continue to inflate his price and keep his profits high.

[dondiego]

Keep your powder dry!

[cbrick]

The dealer I buy powder from was told directly by Alliant that they can no longer sell him any powder. He was told that the EPA has gotten involved with the reloading componets and the powder manufacturers can only sell to the ammo manufacturers.

He only told you that because he could see that you forgot to wear your tin foil hat and body armor.

If there were the slightest truth to that how come to this day all of the online outlets and most all LGS's are still getting powder? It's selling out as soon as they get it but they are still getting it, still selling it, still getting more.

I hope you returned his nonsensical answer to you with a hearty belly laugh just to show him that you don't need no stinking tin foil.

Rick

[waksupi]

Any "news" I hear from someone in a LGS, I saw here six months earlier. By that time, we usually have the truth ran down.

I'm just sick about George Soros buying Doe Run to manufacture Taurus firearms.

[762 shooter]

The only silver lining I can see to the ammunition/component shortage thingy is that there is a lot more ammunition/components in the hands of the citizenry than there were two years ago.

That can only be a good thing. Some don't have enough, but a lot have some.

Talked to a Marine not on active duty the other day, I have heard they never retire. We were speaking of the shortage and people waiting in line at Walmart at 6 in the morning, and he said," That's Me". Four of his buddies like to shoot 22LR and they go every Wed to wait on ammo. I asked him if he sells it. His response was He** No, I shoot it.

762

[Doc_Stihl]

I'm just sick about George Soros buying Doe Run to manufacture Taurus firearms.

Ya know, I think I heard about that.
But I think George is building internment camps at Doe Run.....And Taurus is a code word for the U.N. law saying that primers need to be made inert after 14 days...

[NSB]

The Environmental Protection Agency has nothing to do with Interstate Commerce. Was the guy you were talking to smoking a funny smelling cigarette or wearing a tinfoil hat?

[dondiego]

Any "news" I hear from someone in a LGS, I saw here six months earlier. By that time, we usually have the truth ran down.

I'm just sick about George Soros buying Doe Run to manufacture Taurus firearms.

Does that mean that Smith and Wesson will start copying Taurus revolvers?

[dudel]

Got a bridge for sale.

[Gunor]

EPA, Just one little change in the laws could shut down the alot of guns being shot. How much has everyones shooting decreased, because of lack of reloading components or 22LR.
Any many of these changes could be only 'regulatory' changes - some GS employee....
Have not seen much 22LR or Powder around here for a long while...

[tygar]

In no way am I slamming people who are buying powder when they find it, I do the same thing, but it seems a lot of people want to believe this kind of rubbish because they do not want to look in the mirror and say "I am partially responsible for the madness"

I AM a part of said madness and really dont care, it is what it is.

I have always kept a lot of powder since I shoot or have shot & reload for most all American, all Wby & some European calibers but I learned my lesson last time with the primer/powder shortage & had multiple 4,5 & 8#s & cases of what I use most & several cans of lesser used powders & primers in multiples of 5k for all & 10-15k for some.

Bullets were another matter. Didn't buy as many as needed but had a good stockpile but not enough ks of 223 & 7.62 put away. Getting match stuff has not been a problem 210 Bergers etc but price has gone up.

That's why I got into rifle casting. Tired of the BS & figured I'd make em & use them for play.

[sig2009]

......

[sig2009]

......

[mold maker]

Run Doe Run.
See Doe Run.
Doe gone.

[Leslie Sapp]

I'm just sick about George Soros buying Doe Run to manufacture Taurus firearms.

Great one! Thanks, I needed a good belly laugh!:grin:

[MtGun44]

What a bunch of bull hockey. Hope you don't believe his other BS stories.

Bill

[jonp]

Run Doe Run.
See Doe Run.
Doe gone.

Whats Doe Run?

[dragon813gt]

Not really. As I said in my original post he was told this by the manufacturer Alliant!

So you believe everything he tells you? And who told him at Alliant? Please provide this person's name and job title. W/out this, it sounds like the guy is blowing smoke up your proverbial backside. Distributors and retail stores are still getting powder shipments on a daily basis. Maybe this is stock that's been on the wholeseller's shelves for some time? I'm not buying this for a minute.

[2AMMD]

I know it's a worthless point, But-I fail to understand why Powder, and primers are subject to the HAZMAT fees when loaded ammunition with both of these components aren't subject to the fee. Doesn't make sense to me. Will comply with the law, It is the law until we can change it.

[cbrick]

How much has everyones shooting decreased, because of lack of reloading components or 22LR.

None, nada, not in the least.

But then I was prepared aside from the fact that I have bought powder three times in the past few months and I bought another 22.

Rick

[dudel]

I know it's a worthless point, But-I fail to understand why Powder, and primers are subject to the HAZMAT fees when loaded ammunition with both of these components aren't subject to the fee. Doesn't make sense to me. Will comply with the law, It is the law until we can change it.

Neither is primed brass subject to hazmat.

[462]

Goebbels is smiling.

The EPA and gun powder? Really?

[Hannibal]

3 year old thread. Wow. Some theories just will not die.

[KYCaster]

Any "news" I hear from someone in a LGS, I saw here six months earlier. By that time, we usually have the truth ran down.

I'm just sick about George Soros buying Doe Run to manufacture Taurus firearms.



He's going to build Taurus with good parts and put all the reject parts in Marlins.

Jerry

[357maximum]

I heard that all the rifle powder is going into top secret government research to open the 280 remington into a 30 caliber round....just what I heard.

[338RemUltraMag]

3 year old thread. Wow. Some theories just will not die.

This thread was started today, IDK where ya got 3 years

[cainttype]

Neither is primed brass subject to hazmat.

I recently had USPS refuse to ship primed brass to me. If they don't classify it as "hazardous" I'd be interested in their reasoning.

[Moonman]

LIES-LIES-all he tells is LIES.

[leftiye]

This thread was started today, IDK where ya got 3 years

'Sbin dun befor.

[hickfu]

I can say that I have not been part of the problem to this point.... BUT, I am going to be, I have been out of certain powders for too long now while I wait for the panic to die down... Well I need powder so I am going to start getting it when I see it available. I wont be hording it and trying to wipe out a stores supply though.


Doc

[Baryngyl]

Not counting the surplus powder I bought a year ago the last time I bought a LB of powder was around 3 years ago, I just have not been shooting enough the last few years.


Michael Grace

[ubetcha]

Not to change or stray from the subject, but what ,may I ask, is LGS? I have seen this logo mentioned a lot, but I don't know what it is, and web site address.

[cbrick]

what ,may I ask, is LGS?

Local Gun Store. :mrgreen:

Rick

[btroj]

Local gun store.

In this case the local erratic rumor mill. That guy needs more foil on his hat.

I need to see the taxidermist today and that takes me by the largest powder selection in Omaha, wonder what is coming home today.......

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

I've never stock piled primers, or powder even after / during the Clinton era.
Now, I buy what I use, when I find it. I was dangerously low on 5744 for a long time.
I have 3 pounds now, I dont think that makes me a hoarder. What I hate, is when you
see adds in the local thrift paper for 22lr for 80 bucks /brick- you know they bought it
to resell at outrageous prices, but since folks are paying it, is it outrageous?

[woody1]

I heard that all the rifle powder is going into top secret government research to open the 280 remington into a 30 caliber round....just what I heard.

Nope. Wrong......They are looking into opening the 7mm/08 up to .30 and looking at calling it the .30-08 or mebe that was .308, I disremember.

[woody1]

I recently had USPS refuse to ship primed brass to me. If they don't classify it as "hazardous" I'd be interested in their reasoning.

USPS won't ship it or ammo, but others will w/o hazmat fees. Regards, Woody

[RogerDat]

Me thinks your "source" believes any forwarded email they get from a "trusted" source. Body of said email claims to be press release from Alliant there you go "I got it from an Alliant representative".
Almost as annoying as people that lack integrity are those that put their own on the line to spread unsubstantiated rumors as fact without verification.

And no I DO NOT mean the OP here that was bringing the subject up for discussion and verification.

[ubetcha]

Local Gun Store. :mrgreen:

Rick

Ok. That makes sense. I thought it was a store similar to Powder Valley or Graf's or Cabela's or something like that. Thanks

[btroj]

I just got a 5 pounder of RE 19. Got that instead of the 8 of I4831 or I7828.

Not a huge selection but I had some options.

[Blackwater]

I don't know who else may feel this way, but guys, when I see/hear shooters casting dispersions at the very people and businesses that make our sport possible, I wonder just how much longer we'll HAVE our sport! Such assertions reek of paranoia, and are NEVER supported with even a single fact! Got some facts to support your whines? Post'em! Bereft of facts, it's best to count 10, as recommended by Mark Twain, before bellyachin'.

The way to deal with problems, when they arise, is NOT, IMHO, to cast aspersions on the folks who manufacture our tools. But then, I'm just another dumb redneck down in the swamps of south Georgia, so .......... who cares, right????

[Tatume]

Washington, DC --(Ammoland.com)- Without ammunition, our firearms are just awkward clubs, and our cherished right to Keep and Bear Arms is worthless – literally worth nothing.

Let me explain this threat.

To the best of my information, there are only two plants in the United States that manufacture smokeless propellant to load ammunition for our firearms. All else is imported, from Canada, Scandinavia, Europe, Israel, and Australia primarily.

These two plants are both owned by giant defense and government contractors for whom sales of powder for civilian ammunition consumption is but a tiny fraction of their business.

One is the General Dynamics plant in St. Marks, Florida, which produces for Hodgden, Winchester and others, and the Alliant plant in Connecticut which produces for the Alliant family of companies and for the Lake City Arsenal (currently under Alliant management).

If Obama were to instruct his appointed Secretary of Defense to quietly lean on these defense contractors to quit selling smokeless powder for civilian consumption or put their next contract for an aircraft carrier at risk, I believe they’d bail on civilian powder sales in a heartbeat. And, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton could end smokeless powder imports tomorrow with a stroke of her pen.

Sure, some people in the U.S. have a fair amount of ammunition and reloading components squirreled away, but those supplies won’t last forever. Actually, at the current rate of consumption, ammunition in supply chain and in individual possession would last between one and two years, although many lightly-inventoried people would run out in days or weeks, not months or years.

That’s why the Montana Shooting Sports Association has crafted a bill for the 2011 Montana legislative session to encourage the production of smokeless powder, primers and brass on a small scale, a scale that should be reproduced on a state-by-state basis.

Many of the small countries of central and eastern Europe have their own in-country powder production. However, because of scale issues in manufacturing, these small-scale plants can only survive with significant state subsidy.

In the U.S., the incentive and legal infrastructure are a bit different. According to our novel U.S. system of political thought, the primary purpose (maybe only valid purpose) of government is to protect the liberties of the people. One essential and well-recognized liberty is the Right to Keep and Bear Arms. Since the RKBA is worthless without ammunition, it may be validly argued that supporting supplies of ammunition components is a legitimate government function.


Thus, state subsidy of ammunition component manufacture is worthy of consideration, even by minimalist libertarians.

The bill MSSA will have before the 2011 Montana Legislature offers four incentives:
1.Provides a general, 20-year tax amnesty for any new business established in Montana to manufacture smokeless powder, primers or brass. This gives up no current state revenue because no such manufacturers exist in Montana now. And, it may stimulate new jobs in Montana. Terms for qualification and manufacturing are defined in the bill;
2.Provides product liability shelter for manufacturers;
3.Makes any such manufacturers eligible for any existing economic development programs in the state; and
4.Asserts Tenth Amendment prerogative to regulate exclusively with state regulation any chemicals used in the manufacturing process (many of the best powders are made overseas and are good because they are made using chemicals banned by the federal EPA).

The MSSA draft bill for this effort is located at: www.progunleaders.org/lcq2010/powder.html

As Montana has been the source of other trail-breaking initiatives (e.g., the Montana Firearms Freedom Act), this idea is available for implementation in other states. MSSA believes it would be healthy if every state had in-state production of ammunition components sufficient to meet the needs of the state’s consumers.

Gary Marbut, president
Montana Shooting Sports Association


Read more: http://www.ammoland.com/2010/10/loss-of-smokeless-powder-the-greatest-threat-to-keep-bear-arms/#ixzz2t3BqKkEr
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution
Follow us: @Ammoland on Twitter | Ammoland on Facebook

[GabbyM]

Government must be clamping down. That's why they only sold 1.2 million AR-15 rifles last year alone.

[RickinTN]

USPS won't ship it or ammo, but others will w/o hazmat fees. Regards, Woody

UPS will ship primed brass IF it is shipped by a certified hazardous material handler who has a commercial account with UPS. I was told by UPS this is a Federal regulation. I was also told that if someone without the Hazmat certification or commercial account were caught shipping primed brass it is punishable by up to 5 years in Federal Prison. I can't see it to be worth the risk.

[GabbyM]

UPS will ship primed brass IF it is shipped by a certified hazardous material handler who has a commercial account with UPS. I was told by UPS this is a Federal regulation. I was also told that if someone without the Hazmat certification or commercial account were caught shipping primed brass it is punishable by up to 5 years in Federal Prison. I can't see it to be worth the risk.

That may be new or something. First lets not confuse USPS with UPS.
I shipped a twenty five pound box of loaded ammo. 30-30 and 9mm. To my daughter a few years ago by UPS.
Had to take it 22 miles down the road to the UPS depot. Or I may of been able to schedule a home pickup if I knew how. UPS store at Office Depot IIRC would not take ammo. It was on there list of things they didn't take. Along with any haz-mat or other flammables. List was two pages long. But it shipped UPS with no haz-mat fees. I think they label it ORMD-2. But yes If I was in Chicago instead of Central Illinois I don't think it would work at all. Or Mitt Romney's old state of Massachusetts.

[fredj338]

Yeah dealers & gun shops, gees. SOunds like usueal, LGS folks know little to nothing about reloading.
If you want a conspiracy theory, how about this. The largest powder manuf in the US do huge defense contracts for the govt. Their powder sales to the public wouldn't pay the annual lunch money for the CEOs there. So the Obama admin calls them up, says reduce the sales or maybe you don't get that next $40B contract for this or that system. It would be cheaper to shut down the powder plant & move workers around than keep it open & pissoff your biggest client?????
FWI, primed brass has NEVER needed HM fees for shipping. Ships just like loaded ammo, also no HM fee, why the USPS won't ship it.

[RickinTN]

That may be new or something. First lets not confuse USPS with UPS.
I shipped a twenty five pound box of loaded ammo. 30-30 and 9mm. To my daughter a few years ago by UPS.
Had to take it 22 miles down the road to the UPS depot. Or I may of been able to schedule a home pickup if I knew how. UPS store at Office Depot IIRC would not take ammo. It was on there list of things they didn't take. Along with any haz-mat or other flammables. List was two pages long. But it shipped UPS with no haz-mat fees. I think they label it ORMD-2. But yes If I was in Chicago instead of Central Illinois I don't think it would work at all. Or Mitt Romney's old state of Massachusetts.

US Postal service will not ship ammo or primed brass. UPS will ship ammo with just a label, No Hazmat fee. They will not ship primed brass unless the above two conditions are met. I went round and round on the phone with the lady with UPS. I argued that if they would ship ammo, why not primed brass? The reasoning behind the regulation she gave me was in the primed brass the primer was exposed and in the loaded ammunition it was not. She said it was federal regulation and I made the assumption it applied to Fed Ex as well although I did not contact Fed Ex. I did de-prime somewhere in the neighborhood of 1,000+ cases and then shipped them by the US Postal service.
Rick