Lee .44 Russian dies

[dek]

This is my first set of Lee dies for handgun. I've always used RCBS in the past. I recently went to a progressive press (RCBS 2K auto) and discovered many of my (1978 vintage RCBS) die sets won't work with the progressive since they're not chamfered. I hate shelling out approx $50 a set for new dies so I decided I'd try the Lee. The dies are set and I'm loading starline .44 Russian cases for use in cowboy action events. The boolit is a hardcast 200 gr RNFP with 4.0 gr of Bullseye and a Tula lge pistol primer. All is well except the crimp. I have the seater adjusted and bottomed but can't get a pronounced crimp in the crimp groove. The cartridges chamber without a problem in every revolver and the boolit is solidly in place. Maybe it's just me but the crimp looks parallel to the case without the pronounced roll I expect to see in the cartridge mouth. Is there any other adjustment available on the seating/crimping die or a secret way to
to set up the die? I know I can buy a separate Lee crimping die but I really hate to do that with a roll crimp. Thanks Dennis

[enfieldphile]

Dennis, Is this one of the Lee "carbide factory crimp" die? I like Lee dies, with the exception of that one.

For revolver ammo, I switched to the Redding Profile Crimp die as the last die on my Lee Classic Cast Turret press (using a 4-die set). For .45acp, I use a Lee Taper Crimp die.

[dek]

Yes, it is a Lee "Carbide" seater/crimp die.

[WILDEBILL308]

I hate to say this but that is why I only use Reding dies. Well if I can't get Dillon. Well lets see if I can help. Have you tryed to seat the bullets before crimping? Sometimes this will give better results. Yes it is more work but better results.
Bill

[44Vaquero]

It sounds like you are describing a taper crimp?

When you say you have the seater bottomed out. Do you mean the die body or the plug it self? The factory crimp die is to be adjusted against the shell holder just like the sizing die and backed off slightly.

[dek]

The die body is just touching the shell holder. I know there are ways to give me the desired crimp. I was expecting to obtain it with the tools provided rather than purchase a separate crimp die. Since the 44 Russian is a rimmed revolver cartridge, I would assume it would be a roll crimp rather than taper. The crimp it currently produces appears satisfactory. I won't be able to test these loads till better weather. Thanks for the responses and suggestions. Dennis

[9w1911]

Ok this is what i do, and I use the Lee FCDs, both types, and the best for the 44 mag is their collet style I just picked up, I do also use the Redding profile or crimps dies and i LOVE them.
For the Lee FCD to get better crimp just turn the crimp adjust to the right to get a deeper desired crimp, sometimes I put a finsihed round in the die and then tighten the crimp adjust as the round is inside the die, I turn the adjuster till it stops, then I take the round out and turn the crimp adjust one half turn or on full turn. Then I am ready to crimp.

[44Vaquero]

9w1911, plus 1 on the collet style crimp die, I have also had good luck with lee's stand alone taper crimp only die.

[dek]

How well does the taper crimp, as opposed to the roll crimp, work on 44s with lead boolits, for cowboy action? And, would this also apply to other rimmed pistol cartridges as well?

[WILDEBILL308]

I think it will work as your loads for cowboy action are light. I would load a few and go test them as long as the bullets don't pull from the recoil you should be fine.
Bill

[44Vaquero]

I use a taper crimp die on all my .45 ACP's including the ones I shoot in my 1858 Remington Kirst Konversion. I have never noticed any bullet jump due to recoil with 165 to 230 grain lead bullets, 750 to 850 FPS being my target velocity for most loads. I also use a taper crimp on the .44 Specials for my Vaquero.

I would not be too concerned about the .44 Russian. One advantage to the taper crimp is that you are working the brass much less than if a role crimp is used. It is rare to split a case mouth!

96356

[dek]

That's what I wanted to know. Taper crimp will do. Thank you all for your responses and suggestions. Dennis

[44Vaquero]

DEK,

Where in Michigan are you located? I am in Warren.

[dek]

I be in Okemos. (Lansing/East Lansing/Okemos corridor)

[dek]

Lee only lists a taper crimp die for 44spec/44mag. How do you use it for 44 Russian?

[44Vaquero]

Dek,

The Russian .97 in length and the special is 1.16 and the magnum is 1.285 in length. Using the "Taper Crimp Only" die, cartridge length is not issue. You only seat the bullet in station /OP 3 crimp in station/OP 4.

At most you might have to grind/adjust the taper crimp die shorter to allow the Russian to enter the die far enough to crimp? I will have to check my .44 TC only die for dead length to the crimp.

[dek]

Dek,

The Russian .97 in length and the special is 1.16 and the magnum is 1.285 in length. Using the "Taper Crimp Only" die, cartridge length is not issue. You only seat the bullet in station /OP 3 crimp in station/OP 4.

At most you might have to grind/adjust the taper crimp die shorter to allow the Russian to enter the die far enough to crimp? I will have to check my .44 TC only die for dead length to the crimp.

Did you happen to measure your .44 TC only die for "dead length" to the crimp? Thanks, Dennis

[44Vaquero]

Oh,

It looks like you will have trim about 2/10's of an inch off the die. No big deal really.

[dek]

Thanks for checking. I'll cut it.