Bat-Guano crazy - 22-250 Contender barrel on evilbay...

[ohland]

Ladies and gentlemen, I have wondered about a number of odd interpretations of suitability, but never really tried to find the ragged edge. I saw it today.

One auction was for a .223 barrel re-chambered into a 22-250. Barrel stamped 22-50, seller clearly states reduced loads only, and that the seller is offering this barrel "as-is". Sparing you-all from math, that works out to a chamber wall of just under .170", which is way more muy macho than I will ever be....

Over many years, I have never seen or heard of T/C providing anyone with case head / pressure limits, and there are sprung frames from those looking for the edge. In this case, the .223 is a .378 case head, with a max pressure of 55K psi (cup or psi, thats a bit of pressure). The 22-250 uses a .473 case head, with normal loads also churning up 50-55K or so. Not a good feeling, here.

So if you like to roll the dice with every shot, this is your opportunity. Lets play "Fire Marshal Bill" and use some Barnes TTSX bullets with a quirky powder, with a low loading density.

:popcorn:

[williamwaco]

I have one word for you

Encore.

[ohland]

I have one word for you - Encore.

Yup. My dad has an Encore 22-250AI barrel and that would be a way to do it.

Quoting from the auction-
"I have received a couple questions about using full power factory loads in this barrel. I stated in the original description that full power loads are not recommended, and this was designed for reduced landings within Contender pressures. If the winner uses full power / factory loads it will be at their own accord. I do not make or suggest anyone to utilize any load without knowing the limits. "

To which I wonder, what pressure levels of reduced loads are safe? If I bought this barrel, it would be to stub it, and have a number of mild caliber barrels for it, 25-20 or so.

And just to show that I'm not pulling a part of your anatomy, here is a pic from the auction -

95194

[williamwaco]

If I bought this barrel, it would be to stub it, and have a number of mild caliber barrels for it, 25-20 or so.


95194

Do the math.

I expect you could buy a new 25-20 bbl for less money than buying this one and modifying it.

See:

http://www.bullberry.com/contender_barrels.html

$299.00

[357maximum]

"Where's the Earth shattering ka-boom?...I was expecting and Earth shattering Ka-boom"


wow....just.....WOW. ....now I remember one of the reasons why I cancelled my account and quit going to that site when the feminazi gun haters showed their evil intentioned little hand.

[JHeath]

They teach you in engineering school that anything is okay if you stamp it "AS-IS." That is engineering jargon for "fool-proof."

The seller was supposed to stamp the barrel, "22-250 AS-IS." Lots of guns are rechambered to AI or as-is calibers, it is a product line from a guy named Achey who gets a royalty on them.

I am not licensed to have an "as-is" stamp. So when my equipment is in dangerous condition I have to chop it up and throw it away rather than selling the next guy a grenade.

[ohland]

"Where's the Earth shattering ka-boom?...I was expecting and Earth shattering Ka-boom" wow....just.....WOW. ....now I remember one of the reasons why I cancelled my account and quit going to that site when the feminazi gun haters showed their evil intentioned little hand.

Ebuy is like atomic energy, it can be used for good or evil. BUT... if you are looking for a KABOOM, get this barrel, use something a wee bit faster than Trail Boss, say an old time powder like Green Dot (faster than SR4759, thanks for the info), go for about 16 grains with a 63 grain bullet, and pull the trigger on excitement...

I have used Gun Broker some, and find the 15 minute rule annoying. If something is not worth enough to bid on 15 minutes and one second out, then why give the clock another 15 minutes for a bid within that final 15? Ebuy is better for bidders to a point, but I have seen plenty of bids in the last minute of an auction. If the item is worth it, toss a reserve on it and get rid of that blasted 15 minute rule.

v/r,
Fellow Servant to the Plumbous Calf

[ohland]

They teach you in engineering school that anything is okay if you stamp it "AS-IS." That is engineering jargon for "fool-proof."
The seller was supposed to stamp the barrel, "22-250 AS-IS." Lots of guns are rechambered to AI or as-is calibers, it is a product line from a guy named Achey who gets a royalty on them.

Maybe if I have As-IS tatto'd on my buttocks that would make me qualified for just about anything

Not sure of the royalty, I do believe Ackley Improved (AI) cartridges are mostly SAAMI spec. IIRC, the 6.5 Grendel was not spec'd (at the start) and therefor proprietary, er, royalty payment.

[leadman]

Trail Boss is much faster than SR4759. It would probably do just fine with 16grs. I had a 223 Rem barrel rechambered to 225 Win. and had problem with sticky extraction with loads that produced less velocity then the 223. Too much taper to the case.
This barrel would probably do better but it would be difficult to determine the top loadings. If loaded with slow powders like 4350 as in some of the SSK loads it might be safe.
Problem is you do not know how many times it has been loaded tooooo hot and what has happened to the metal.

I do know a guy that has a 257 Roberts on a Contender frame.

[JHeath]

Maybe if I have As-IS tatto'd on my buttocks that would make me qualified for just about anything

Not sure of the royalty, I do believe Ackley Improved (AI) cartridges are mostly SAAMI spec. IIRC, the 6.5 Grendel was not spec'd (at the start) and therefor proprietary, er, royalty payment.

I think you misunderstood. An "As-Is" tattoo would not make your buttocks physically stronger, it just means nobody could complain if they fail under what should be a normal load.

When I said "royalties," I meant P.O. Ackley was a kind of royalty, like the Charles, Duke of Winder, Baron Browning, or the Earl of Gunsite. I do not see the AI calibers listed on the SAAMI site but might be looking in the wrong place. But if you have an AI reamer and re-chamber 10 or 20 rifles, it makes no difference. His lawyers will not inventory your gunsafe to see how much you owe him.

I recall some intellectual-property squabble about the Grendel, and (I think) about 9x25 Dillon. Not sure of SAAMI's role in the release of the IP when one company sells catridges marked with another company's name e.g. .327 Federal but I think the issue has prevented some wildcats from becoming off-the-shelf cartridges.

To return to topic, many SAAMI pressure specs are based on the weakest gun likely to be encountered, like a Trapdoor. Handloads are not assumed to be safe for every .45-70, so it is okay for me to to load up to a Ruger No. 1 if I am lucky enough to own one. My loads, my rifle, my neck.

But not the other way around: not okay to re-barrel a No. 2 Rolling Block to .300 RUM and sell it with the magic words "as is" and to "load down" for it. Constructing something like that for an experimental Cream-of-Wheat projector is one thing. But when bored with the project, you chop it in half and bury it in the dumpster.

I have destroyed/discarded many thousands of dollars of used rigging equipment instead of selling it to bargain-hunters. Cost of doing business.

[ohland]

I think you misunderstood. An "As-Is" tattoo would not make your buttocks physically stronger, it just means nobody could complain if they fail under what should be a normal load.

I was hoping that there was an easier was to stay fit than exercise, just get the "as-is" and done! Suppose I can stop trying to call the FDA and complain that the tattoo method didn't work... But hey, wait up! That is a great idea for the Home Shopping Nutswork... Sell "as-is" temporary tattoos for three easy payments of 19.99, and say results guaranteed after four sets of applications over two months, then discontinue the product after a month. Reminds me of a South Park episode....

[seaboltm]

I think experiments like this were popular. I think it was Mike Bellm talking about experimenting with 300 Savage in Contenders. He found a way to safely do it, as I recall. I personally don't see the point. I mean, if you download a 22-250, doesn't that put it back in the vicinity of the 223 Remington? What did you accomplish other than creating a barrel that may eventually make it into an idiot's hands.

[ohland]

I mean, if you download a 22-250, doesn't that put it back in the vicinity of the 223 Remington?

If only more people thought of that, we'd all be in better shape. I think an interesting rechambering for a 223 is the 22-204, which has the shoulder a little past where a 222 Rem mag has it's shoulder, but same length. Or just a 222 Rem mag, or the 222 Rem Mag Improved.... Nice, well behaved cases that can be bought or safely fireformed with normal loads. I >assume< the 222 Mag Improved is akin to the Ackley Improved chamberings, where the shoulder and body tapers are close to the parent case...
:coffeecom

[35 shooter]

No way i would sell a contender bbl so modified, nor would i give it away. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night worrying what the guy that got it might try to do with it. Nor do i understand making that particular modification to start with unless i'm missing something?
Wow, just wow!

[crazy mark]

I had a 300 sav barrel for my contender. I bought it used and it was a MB barrel. I did sell it as it was a pain to seperate ammo for my Model 81 and contender. It was accurate and I did download for it.

[cheetah]

Those people don't appreciate how the four scope mount holes present a fissure starter where the chamber peels open like a banana.

[wallenba]

I doubt an old Contender or even a G2 for that matter would take the breech face thrust of a 22-250. Even with the caveat, it could someday be tested by someone.
Just a look at MGM's chambering offerings and where that round is, gives one the shudders. http://matchgrademachine.com/Chamberings-Available.html

I'd bet that opening the action, even if the gun survived, would be difficult.

[mongoosesnipe]

I saw that barrel for sale and was very amused as I didn't see much point and rechambering a 223 to 22-250 only to download the 22-250 to 223 levels.....