1895 45-70 Load data

[AJYaros]

Looking at working up some loads with Laser Cast or Beartooth 405gr boolits with IMR4198. Anyone in here run that combo or can suggest some good loads for the imr4198? will be used for target and hogs. thanks!

[BABore]

Surprised none of your reloading manuals list a load for a 405 gr cast boolit and IMR 4198.:confused:

[Nrut]

This is what I did with my GG/405gr/ H4198 a number of years ago..

Load up three rd's each starting at around 30grs.
Raise 1gr. per every three rds. to book max.
You'll find accuracy in at least two different loads on your way up..
Do this at 100 yards at least (after site in at 25-50yds )because sometimes a good 50yd. load may not shoot well at 100yds..
Or you can do a ladder test instead of the above..
Three are discussion threads about ladder testing on this site..

>>Learn how to cast so you can make the bullet fit your rifle, use the appropriate lube and alloy for the job at hand..

[Nrut]

Surprised none of your reloading manuals list a load for a 405 gr cast boolit and IMR 4198.:confused:
Oh but they do Bruce..
But the manuals don't list the "magic" load..
LOL

[Scharfschuetze]

I've had rather on and off results with 4198 in my 1895 Marlin. My usual goal is just target shooting with it out to 200 yards, so my accuracy requirements outweigh my velocity requirements.

At any rate, after reviewing my loading log for a Lazer Cast (Oregon Trail) boolit, I found this load to be pretty accurate with 10 shot groups hovering right at 2 MOA using a Lyman Model 66 receiver sight and a Lyman 17A front sight. Other powders have produced better ballistic uniformity, but not the same level of accuracy with this boolit. In a Trapdoor rifle or carbine, this load duplicates the old "cavalry" load for the 405 grain boolit and it shoots well in my H&R OM Trapdoor too. It's a great load for off hand shooting at reactive targets; although range estimation and sight adjustment is critical given its velocity.

405 grain Oregon Trail
WW cases (neck sized) with moderate crimp
RWS primers
25 grains IMR 4198 (no filler)*

Average: 1115 fps
ES: 50
SD: 20 1/2

As this load produced pretty good results, I also tried it with a polyester fill and also with wax gas checks, but the additional effort only produced a reduction in accuracy and no better ballistic uniformity.

In my Marlin and H&R barrels there is no leading and the powder burns fully. Cases are fully obturated with no gas blow back over the outer hull. Cleaning up after shooting is a snap.

*In the Oregon Trail loading handbook, they list 27.5 grains of IMR 4198 as maximum with this boolit in replica Trapdoors and 30 grains as max for the Marlin 1895.

[BABore]

Oh but they do Bruce..
But the manuals don't list the "magic" load..
LOL

Sure they do. It's the one in bold type or with the asteric by it.

[bigted]

I've had rather on and off results with 4198 in my 1895 Marlin. My usual goal is just target shooting with it out to 200 yards, so my accuracy requirements outweigh my velocity requirements.

At any rate, after reviewing my loading log for a Lazer Cast (Oregon Trail) boolit, I found this load to be pretty accurate with 10 shot groups hovering right at 2 MOA using a Lyman Model 66 receiver sight and a Lyman 17A front sight. Other powders have produced better ballistic uniformity, but not the same level of accuracy with this boolit. In a Trapdoor rifle or carbine, this load duplicates the old "cavalry" load for the 405 grain boolit and it shoots well in my H&R OM Trapdoor too. It's a great load for off hand shooting at reactive targets; although range estimation and sight adjustment is critical given its velocity.

405 grain Oregon Trail
WW cases (neck sized) with moderate crimp
RWS primers
25 grains IMR 4198 (no filler)*

Average: 1115 fps
ES: 50
SD: 20 1/2

As this load produced pretty good results, I also tried it with a polyester fill and also with wax gas checks, but the additional effort only produced a reduction in accuracy and no better ballistic uniformity.

In my Marlin and H&R barrels there is no leading and the powder burns fully. Cases are fully obturated with no gas blow back over the outer hull. Cleaning up after shooting is a snap.

*In the Oregon Trail loading handbook, they list 27.5 grains of IMR 4198 as maximum with this boolit in replica Trapdoors and 30 grains as max for the Marlin 1895.


my ... if i had ever seen a Cowboy with the pistol grip i would have HAD to acquire one. is that factory or did you add the grip and lower tang yourself?

[Queso Cabeza]

There are a few Cowboys with pistol grips but they were a limited run for Donaldson's. They show up every now and then on Gunbroker. You'd need to look for an 1895 LTD II. It's an octagon 24" barrel with pistol grip. Alternately there is an 1895 LTD V that is pistol grip with a 24" 1/2 octagon 1/2 round. Pretty sweet. I'm guessing Scharf's is an LTD II as it's got a checkered stock, unless he replaced the forend as well.

[Scharfschuetze]

Queso Cabeza (Cheese Head!) is all over it and must have an exceptional knowledge of Marlins. It is indeed an 1895 LTD II.

It's a sweet shooter, especially with the Lyman peep sight and the long sight radius with the 24" barrel.

[Nrut]

Sure they do. It's the one in bold type or with the asteric by it.
You are right!
I was wondering what all about those asterisks in the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook were about..
Thanks!

Scharfschuetzer,
That is a super nice Marlin you have there..

[bigted]

so my cowboy has a 26 inch barrel. looks kinda long on yours as well for a 24 inch ... is this 24 inch barrel correct or an oops ? thanks.

[Scharfschuetze]

Yes, the barrel is 24 inches long.

[bigted]

thankyou

[ArchAngelCD]

I use 32.0gr to 34.0gr for a 405gr Cast bullet in my Trapdoor load. I see no reason why it won't work well in your levergun. I also load 29.0gr AA5744 which is a very accurate load for me in both the trapdoor and my Marlin levergun.

[FergusonTO35]

I have an early 70's 1895 with the "unnamed" Micro Groove. I have a fair amount of Oregon Trail 300 grain slugs and both IMR 4198 and Hodgdon 4198. I wonder what the ideal load for deer out to 100 yards might be? Is one version of 4198 better than the other? I chose 4198 because apparently you don't have to use 50+ grains of difficult to replace powder for each shot.

[444Hal]

Hey, just came across this while searching 45-70 (BP level) loads for my 1895Cowboy. Finally got more Beartooth 405's & 325's in and I'm presently testing the 405's w/IMR4198 from the Lyman (48th edition) book. Today I've found that 35grs had put three on top of each other, but all within an inch @ 50yds. Ofcourse, I'll be retesting that soon. Lyman says it running about 1463fps, but Hodgdon says that 405cast @ 32grs run that speed so who knows. But it's promising.