Ok so here's the next wheel gun thread on my part……...

[Fire_Medic]

First off as always, let me start by saying, I am in no way trying to start an argument. Wheel guns is fairly new to me as far as using them and I am just looking for opinions and insight from the good folks here who have come through with solid points of view in the past.

I am considering working a wheel gun into my CCW rotation as I have a new circumstance with a new PT job where I believe a wheel gun makes more sense than lugging around my G22.

I was curious on caliber selection between the 44 Mag/Special & 38 Special/357 Magnum, and then mid size revolver versus small/compact size. I have purposely left brands out of my question, because this will/should net me more responses from different folks. The gun in question is to be carried and shot A LOT at the range. If such an animal exist that could cover both of these bases AND IDPA that would be even better.

I'm not tiny, I easily hide a G22 IWB currently with just a loose t shirt or a polo but I'm not a giant either, my build just lends itself for carrying larger guns which I prefer for grip and feel.

I will say, that I have ZERO interest in any lightweight/scandium offering form ANY manufacturer. I just don't find them pleasing to shoot and I am of the belief that anything you carry should get shot more than the rest of your guns when possible.

So fire away guys, let's hear it.

FM :Fire:

[44MAG#1]

Yesterday I carried a Ruger Flat Top Blackhawk in 44 Special 45/8's loaded with the Speer 200 gr Gold Dot Special bullet with 9 gr PowerPistol.
I didn't have any trouble with it.

[454PB]

One of these if you can find it......S&W Model 19 .357 magnum.


94396

[Outpost75]

Any 2-1/2" to 3" six-shot .38 Spl. or .357 steel frame, round butt, heavy barrel with full-length ejector rod and fixdd sights which will positively extract +P+ .38 Special in one " spank the baby" motion.

My carry was 3" Ruger Speed Six .38 Spl. with Olin Q4070 110-grain +P+ at 1050 +/- 30 fps from 3" barrel.

[shoot-n-lead]

I have one...:drinks:


94397

[TCFAN]

I carry most times a Ruger SP101 with Crimson Trace laser grips in a Crossbreed inside the waist band holster.Caliber is 38 special.Mine is the 3 inch model.The holster and belt make the difference in how easy a revolver carries.......Terry

[Jupiter7]

Depending on caliber choice. Lots of pistols to consider. I think the IDPA use narrows it down and 6 round capacity is a must. If .357mag isn't required, S&W model 10 is very hard to beat. After that it moves into larger frames, gp100, s&w 586/686. I've never carried a large D/A revolver, but have carried a s&w model 10-11, it conceals easy but I find a full size autoloader easier to carry.

[Petrol & Powder]

Any 2-1/2" to 3" six-shot .38 Spl. or .357 steel frame, round butt, heavy barrel with full-length ejector rod and fixdd sights which will positively extract +P+ .38 Special in one " spank the baby" motion.

My carry was 3" Ruger Speed Six .38 Spl. with Olin Q4070 110-grain +P+ at 1050 +/- 30 fps from 3" barrel.

/\ I cannot improve upon this advice! As for caliber, the 38 Special would be my top choice for reasons that are best left to other threads. I really like 44 Special but that selection puts a crimp on available guns and consumes more lead. The larger chambers also impact the size of the cylinder required or the rounds it can carry.
The 3" S&W K-frames like the model 13/65 meet the needs rather well, have fixed sights and can chamber .357 if desired. The Ruger Speed Six / Service six series were excellent choices as well.
The model 19 shown above by 454PB is an excellent gun and was once the choice of the Secret Service. I prefer the fixed sights of the model 13 or 65 but the 2 1/2" barrel option of the 19 may be considered a plus.
For a daily carry revolver I would have to go with stainless steel or something similar to Robar's NP3. A bobbed hammer and DAO operation would be on my list. Having single action capability is just not that desirable in a fighting gun that has to be drawn from concealment. That hammer spur is more trouble than it's worth.
Having said all of that, I again agree with Outpost75's assessment and advice.

[Petrol & Powder]

I'll add that if the size and weight are acceptable for daily carry, a 3" GP-100 with fixed sights and a bobbed hammer or a 2 1/2" barreled 686 would be an option. The GP or L-frame would be a better choice for the IDPA use but heavier for daily carry.

[Fire_Medic]

I'll add that if the size and weight are acceptable for daily carry, a 3" GP-100 with fixed sights and a bobbed hammer or a 2 1/2" barreled 686 would be an option. The GP or L-frame would be a better choice for the IDPA use but heavier for daily carry.

P&P as always thanks for your advice. I have been thinking really hard between a 3" GP 100 or a 2/14/3" SP 101 DAO……….

[Larry Gibson]

I got one too!

Larry Gibson

94413

[Petrol & Powder]

For the strength available, I would lean towards the GP-100 if the extra weight was not an issue. It's the toughest thing out there in that class. However, that's not to imply that the K-frames are weak. If .357 magnum is not required, then the K-frame or Speed Six starts to look very promising and again the Rugers are stout designs.
If you REALLY want to cheat then this is an option:

94415

[Fire_Medic]

For the strength available, I would lean towards the GP-100 if the extra weight was not an issue. It's the toughest thing out there in that class. However, that's not to imply that the K-frames are weak. If .357 magnum is not required, then the K-frame or Speed Six starts to look very promising and again the Rugers are stout designs.
If you REALLY want to cheat then this is an option:

94415

What's that an SP 101 with a larger grip?

[Petrol & Powder]

Nope, it's a GPNY.

A 3" barreled, DAO, GP-100 with fixed sights chambered in 38 special.

[Fire_Medic]

Nope, it's a GPNY.

A 3" barreled, DAO, GP-100 with fixed sights chambered in 38 special.

Oh wow never seen that one before

[Petrol & Powder]

They were made for the NYPD in the early 90's right before they stopped issuing revolvers. There's also a 4" version and an accompanying SPNY (the SP101, DAO model for NYPD)

[Fire_Medic]

They were made for the NYPD in the early 90's right before they stopped issuing revolvers. There's also a 4" version and an accompanying SPNY (the SP101, DAO model for NYPD)

Interesting the DAO only doesn't bother me for this purchase as I'd rather not have the hammer digging into me.

[Petrol & Powder]

You could duplicate that setup with a 3" Stainless GP100 with fixed sights. It would have a .357 magnum cylinder and a bright finish. Bob the hammer, remove the SA notch and bead blast the finish (or not) and off you go. The front sight is pinned to the barrel but removable with some minor gunsmithing; so a front night sight would be feasible with a little work.

[bedbugbilly]

You mean people actually CC something besides a revolver!? :-)

My vote, given your size, would be a good Smith K frame snubbie . . . but then I'm partial to Smiths . .

[thumb bum]

94459I like my sp101 so much it turned my glock into the night stand gun. Only thing I did to it was switch out the front sight for a xs big dot my eyes are starting to age.

[John Allen]

I like the Ruger SP101 or my Smith Model 60 with boot grip.

[Maximumbob54]

Have you seen the soon to be released S&W M69? It's supposed to be a 5 shot .44 magnum on the L frame.

[Fire_Medic]

Have you seen the soon to be released S&W M69? It's supposed to be a 5 shot .44 magnum on the L frame.

I saw a promo video but who knows when it will hit the streets.

[Fire_Medic]

Well today was a day filled with ups and downs on thinking I was close to a decision then back to square one and so forth.

I went to the local fun shop I frequent to look at a SP 101, GP 100, and Ruger alaskan……..

They did not have a GP 100, the SP 101 is small and stout as I remember, and they did not have an alaskan but I did hold a Redhawk with 4.25" barrel. The Red hawk is a BEAST (at the recommendation of a gunsmith I was entertaining that idea).

Then my buddy behind the counter also showed me the S&W Governor and was showing me ballistics on the Winchester PDX 410 shot shells.

Man I'm all over the place here, but taking a step back and being practical I think the decision will be between a 3" SP 101 or a 3" GP 100. Will have to see next week when I can visit another shop that might have a GP 100 for me to get my hands on.

FM

[bhn22]

S&W 649 Bodyguard in 357 magnum, the barrels are slightly longer, and so is the ejector. Get an older, pre-lock version. Pachmayer "Grippers" fit me best.

94521

[357Mag]

Fire Medic -

Howdy !

I have more than $ .02 to say, so please bear with me......

For great controllability when shooting a .357Mag, have you considered use of a S & W "N"-frame ?

Yes I know.. these are larger than the "K" & "L"-frame .357's.

My thoughts:
Say you put custom grips on an "L"-frame for your use, and these feature 1/4" of wood behind the backstrap. This might not provide any further distance from your palm to the trigger; than say an "N"-frame w/ grips that feature an open view of the backstrap. Since "L" & "K"-frame backstrap to trigger distance are the same
( or so I've read ), then what I just said about the "N" vs "L" dimension is likewise true for "N" vs "K"-frame.

My point: Maybe an "N"-frame w/ the correct grips, could work for you ?

I've shot a short-barreled ( " snubbie " ) M-19 w/ full-tilt Mag loads, and it wasn't all that much fun. My hands fit the "N"-frame much better, and in my circumstance.... the square butt's grips ( mine are custom ) feel better to me; than the round butt's.

My custom Herrett's " Jordan Trooper " stocks ( square butt ) have notable wood thickness behind the backstrap. That's what fits my hands.

" HB "N"-
So, in my case.... I'm not going to $$$ for any of Jerry Mikulek's RB grips, which ( I believe ) feature an open backstrap.

For recoil moderation, good muzzle vel, sensation of gun balance et al.... I much prefer use of a 4" heavy barrel. So much so, that I had a custom 4" heavy-straight barrel put on my M-520. It is so large in diam, that a small flat had to be machined on the barrel's underside, to allow clearance for the ejector rod.

The difference between shooting a short-barreled M-19 vs a 4" "N"-frame .357Mag is.... a bunch ! It's 2 different animals.

I used to carry first a 6" M-28 in a stretched-out Bianchi ( for M-19 ) " pistol pocket ". This I positioned in the small of my back. I kept wearing holes in my pants, just above the... well...... you know. I then switched to carry of a 5" M-27 carried the same way, and my pant lasted longer.

The 4" HB M-520 provides me w/ the balance of a 5" M-27 ( ideal ), in a more-concealable overall gun size.
This has been my carry gun, for 25+yr.

For wear under a light shirt in warmer WX, I use the pistol pocket. When more desirable, I can wear the -520 in my custom Ken Null ultra hide-ride
strong side holster; which features pronounced fwd muzzle rake. Ken fashioned the holster to keep the revolver's fat cylinder positioned above the belt's upper edge. Even though living in an " open carry " state, I'll wear an open leather vest; to conceal the weapon. "Hang" and cut of the vest help to provide an envelope of space just off my right side, for the revolver to "live" in.

I had my gun treated w/ manganese phosphate, as the small-of-the back " under-shirt carry environment is brutal... especially during hot-humid WX.
This metal finish has worked superbly, for me !!!

If you really must have a short/shorter barrel, they look just plain weird; when.... they are of the tapered style used on the older M-27s.
( I believe Richard Jaekel carried one in the movie " The drowning pool " ). The look is a little better on a shortie M-19 ( IMHO ).

Lastly... a .40 S & W revolver might deserve at least a passing look. You'd wanna get around 425ft lb out of whatever you shoot, for baseline " stopping power "
in the defensive role'. That might be a reach, for a short-barreled .40 S &W-chambered REVOLVER.

Best of luck in your endeavors !


With regards,
357Mag

[Fire_Medic]

357 Mag,

If I didn't know better you were watching me and another member PM back and forth.

I am not a fan of small guns, and have bought and sold many when "trying" to make them work. Like I said in my post I'm no giant but no tiny. I wear XL gloves to give an idea of hand size and I just prefer having a full grip on my guns. This has been my issue if you will since I first got into firearms. Learning how to shoot with a 1911 spoiled me, lol.

I was holding the 3" Ruger SP 101 today and while it will conceal easily (especially on me) I just keep thinking I'm gonna end up selling it (like I did last time)

To me there is a give and take one way or another with most any handgun one will use for any given reason. And I have always chosen to bear the responsibility of hiding a larger pistol to have a full grip. I know many have told me get the smaller gun you get used to it, but I don't. I'm no expert but have put my fair share of lead down range over the years with various guns and when I buy small guns they don't get shot much and end up getting sold.

So as I have told a couple of people today, I find myself in a familiar debate, smaller pistol for easier conceal ability or larger gun and dress around it but have the grip size I prefer……… I find myself at this cross roads A LOT.

I will look into your suggestion and I appreciate your feedback.

Thanks
FM

[Piedmont]

My two cents. I love snubbies and revolvers in general. A 642 is my regular carry. I only go larger when on my walks around the neighborhood in the colder months of the year when I'm wearing a jacket. One of my guns is 2" M64 with a spurless hammer. It won't get sold, but it never gets carried. Neither do any of my 4" medium frames. The reason is the cylinder makes them bulky and they are relatively hard to holster without it looking like you are carrying around a turtle. The J frame goes in a pocket, anything bigger goes on the belt. Autos carry easier on the belt, being flatter. A question I ask, too, is why carry a medium frame revolver when I can have 2-3 times the capacity, in a lighter, flatter gun? If I were woods walking, that would be a different story, but we are talking about concealed carry for self defense from who knows what.

It hurts to say that since I am a revolver guy at heart.

[jonp]

SP101 2.5 barrel in 357Mag. A little heavy but very stout. Full house 158gr 357Mag is a handful in this gun.

[Airman Basic]

Yesterday I carried a Ruger Flat Top Blackhawk in 44 Special 45/8's loaded with the Speer 200 gr Gold Dot Special bullet with 9 gr PowerPistol.
I didn't have any trouble with it.
Bet you would if you carried it 40+ hours a week. I've noticed the older I get, the lighter my duty weapon gets. I'm down to a Colt Cobra 38. Been carrying it for ten years now. Started out with an N-frame Smith, ha.

[HeavyMetal]

Tough call here, I am a died in the wool auto loader guy, I do own wheel guns but am a lefty so must auto simply work better for me.

For CCP I have a Star Firestar, mines a 9 but I am looking for a 40 if I had to pack a wheel gun I might round butt my 4 inch Police Positive and put a set of Pachy's on it or carry my Charter arms 44 target bulldog, 4 inch 44 special with adjustable sights.

7 grains unique and a Lyman 429348 wad cutter makes a very usable defense load.

Truth is for the payload versus actual power the snub 357 are either to hard to handle, or to heavy to pack.

A 4 inch barrel is no harder to conceal on a wheel gun than a 2 inch, it is the cylinder bulk that causes hiding problems!

Just putting my point in prospective, I'd rather have a 9mm auto with a spare mag than a 357 wheel gun: more ammo easier to hide faster to reload. same with a small 40.

If I absolutely had to carry a wheel gun Police Positive 4 inch RB or a Charter 44 target.

[357Mag]

Fire Medic -

Howdy !

Yeh..... I'm right there with ya ! I have pretty good-sized hands ( size 10+ gloves ), my own self.

Like you, I opt for the " full grip ", and feel I have more consistent DA pull & better recoil mitigation; by going that route'.

To get the desired grip' ergonomics ( for me ) w/ a "K" or "L"-frame gun, the grips would be fairly monstrous in size; and thusly out-of balance w/ the rest of the gun... " appearance-wise " ( IMHO ).

I tried the smaller rubber Pachmeyers on my M-28, but went on to use of the larger rubber Pachmeyers ( no finger grooves ).
However... once I $$$ for a set of Herretts " Jordan Trooper " "stocks", it was all over for the rubber grips.

Outside of " practice-practice-practice ", the best thing I EVER did for my revolver shooting; was screw-on those Jordan Troopers !

Interestingly... when I had Herretts make me a replacement set, the second set was a bit thicker still... over the backstrap.
And, the second pair also was a bit more generous @ the bottom of the grips.
Based on my trigger hand size these days, what Herretts basically did was.... make my new set BIGGER.
That's consistent with my approach to fast DA work, that being = make use of a " full grip ".

In pinch I could use the factory S & W target grips, but those are not even close competition for the custom Herretts.


With regards,
357Mag

[357Mag]

Fire Medic _

Howdy !

Say... if you want, you can send me a PM.

With regards,
357Mag

[cwheel]

I'll pack my model 66 Smith round butt with a 2 1/2" barrel sometimes. More often though, the Springfield XDs 45 seams lighter and easier to hide and it ends up winning for normal carry. That 66 thickness is more uncomfortable to carry inside the WB, 1" thick for the Springfield.
Chris

[MtGun44]

Does Smith still sell the Night Guard .44 Spl? This is a 396 with beefy fixed sight
replacing the adj rear and a big night sight on the front. 5 shot .44 Spl on the
L-frame, very light and powerful. My primary complaint is that it is set up for
200 gr Jbullets, and shoots about 14" high at 25 yds with my preferred .240
Keith load. Also, too thick for CCW for me in the summer.

Bill

[Lonegun1894]

All my revolvers are Rugers, so I am a bit prejudiced, but would say that you can't beat the GP100 for your use. I pocket carry a SP101 as my back-up, and my main is either a 4" Security Six or a 5" 1911, but for this purpose, lets focus on the SS. I also have a GP100, but mine is a 6", and I have been seriously thinking about replacing the SS with a 4" GP100, just because the 4" .357 is about perfect for most uses. I was reading this thread thinking that a 4" Redhawk might be good for you with your hand size and desire for possibly a .44, but you already shot that down. My 4" Redhawk is a .45 Colt, and carries very well, but the grip is about the top limit for what I can use well and comfortably. It does carry well though, and shoots just as well as the other Rugers, so may not be a bad idea.

[Fire_Medic]

All my revolvers are Rugers, so I am a bit prejudiced, but would say that you can't beat the GP100 for your use. I pocket carry a SP101 as my back-up, and my main is either a 4" Security Six or a 5" 1911, but for this purpose, lets focus on the SS. I also have a GP100, but mine is a 6", and I have been seriously thinking about replacing the SS with a 4" GP100, just because the 4" .357 is about perfect for most uses. I was reading this thread thinking that a 4" Redhawk might be good for you with your hand size and desire for possibly a .44, but you already shot that down. My 4" Redhawk is a .45 Colt, and carries very well, but the grip is about the top limit for what I can use well and comfortably. It does carry well though, and shoots just as well as the other Rugers, so may not be a bad idea.

Nothing wrong with a Redhawk at all, it's just an Alaskan easily weighs double what my Glock 22 does, lol. The one I held at the local shop was a 4" model. It fit my hand great, but felt like a boat anchor. Not because I've been an auto guy for so long but before I CCW something twice as heavy as my current pistol I'd just as soon stay with what I have.

I'm gonna try and see if I can locate a range that has a J frame, a GP 100, and an SP 101 to rent. Been finding one or two at the same place but not all three.

[Fire_Medic]

Does Smith still sell the Night Guard .44 Spl? This is a 396 with beefy fixed sight
replacing the adj rear and a big night sight on the front. 5 shot .44 Spl on the
L-frame, very light and powerful. My primary complaint is that it is set up for
200 gr Jbullets, and shoots about 14" high at 25 yds with my preferred .240
Keith load. Also, too thick for CCW for me in the summer.

Bill

Howdy Bill,

Not sure on the availability of the night guard would have to look into it. From what I have seen locally and online the Smith wheel guns are not exactly in abundance on the shelves right now. At least not he models I have been looking at.

[tygar]

Howdy Bill,

Not sure on the availability of the night guard would have to look into it. From what I have seen locally and online the Smith wheel guns are not exactly in abundance on the shelves right now. At least not he models I have been looking at.

As we have discussed before, if you are looking for a big bore revolver, & considering the 396, the 325PD in 45acp should be at the top of your list for a couple reasons. 45acp, enough said, but the speed of reloading is much easier & faster with the moon clips than any other revolver & it compares to loading an auto.

Nightguards are available on the auctions, not cheap, but worth it. There is also the 625 in 3 or 4" but they are heavier to carry.

At 25+ozs they are light enough to carry all day & heavy enough to shoot comfortably.

One thing I did was remove the hogues & put on a set of smooth compact wood grips for even more concealability. The recoil is harder but it doesn't bother me at all since I shoot boomers all the time but someone else may want to put the hogues back on if shooting a lot.

[Fire_Medic]

As we have discussed before, if you are looking for a big bore revolver, & considering the 396, the 325PD in 45acp should be at the top of your list for a couple reasons. 45acp, enough said, but the speed of reloading is much easier & faster with the moon clips than any other revolver & it compares to loading an auto.

Nightguards are available on the auctions, not cheap, but worth it. There is also the 625 in 3 or 4" but they are heavier to carry.

At 25+ozs they are light enough to carry all day & heavy enough to shoot comfortably.

One thing I did was remove the hogues & put on a set of smooth compact wood grips for even more concealability. The recoil is harder but it doesn't bother me at all since I shoot boomers all the time but someone else may want to put the hogues back on if shooting a lot.

I would love a 325 PD problem is finding one, lol……..

[Airman Basic]

Haven't seen anybody mention the Ruger LCR. I'm pleased with the little thing. Bought one for the wife and liked it so well I traded my KelTec 380 for another. I use it as my backup/off-duty piece. Think it's more reliable than the small auto, plus handloading's a breeze with the 38s. Lots more practice time w/o chasing brass. Wife and I have gotten rather good at self defense distances. Recommended.

[Fire_Medic]

How's it going guys. Hope everyone is well and happy holidays. I'm reviving this old thread to continue the conversation.

I have been absent due to a disability that is new to me, and now starting to pick up (somewhat) where I left off.

I am definitely looking to move to a wheel gun for CCW due to varying strength in my hands from day to day, sometimes cn't work the slide as easy on the Glock........

I am really liking the GP 100 for this role with an SP 101 as a backup to it or for lighter clothes carry.

Can anyone offer any input to me on the difference between carrying and shooting a 3" vs a 4" GP 100.......?

I am looking to get the GP first........

Thanks

[Markbo]

The ONLY wheelgun I ever carry CCW is my SP101. For reasons unknown to me it is the single best "pointer" I own, period. Practicing at home (safely unloaded and triple checked) I can point that little 5 shooter at anything in the house and its like pointing a finger. Sighting or from the hip or any other position. Its weird. But it works!

[Fire_Medic]

The ONLY wheelgun I ever carry CCW is my SP101. For reasons unknown to me it is the single best "pointer" I own, period. Practicing at home (safely unloaded and triple checked) I can point that little 5 shooter at anything in the house and its like pointing a finger. Sighting or from the hip or any other position. Its weird. But it works!

Yes I miss my previously owned SP 101 and will have another in the near future. Just squaring away the GP 100 first as it will be the pricer of the two. I use to have the 2 1/4' DAO model and it was a nice shooter. Was my go to for CCW on the Harley back when I had it. Felt better riding through the everglades with a magnum "just in case" lol.......

[Bill*B]

What's wrong with a plain old 4" S&W model 10 in .38 Special?

[Fire_Medic]

What's wrong with a plain old 4" S&W model 10 in .38 Special?

Absolutely nothing but my model 10-6 with the bull barrel is a really nice range toy

[DerekP Houston]

Haven't seen anybody mention the Ruger LCR. I'm pleased with the little thing. Bought one for the wife and liked it so well I traded my KelTec 380 for another. I use it as my backup/off-duty piece. Think it's more reliable than the small auto, plus handloading's a breeze with the 38s. Lots more practice time w/o chasing brass. Wife and I have gotten rather good at self defense distances. Recommended.

Ive got the LCR as well, I don't think the OP wanted a lightweight snubby though. I carry mine on an ankle holster for the days I need my shirt tucked in.

[Fire_Medic]

I don't care for the lightweight guns for 357 mag just personal preference.

[dubber123]

As you don't have a problem concealing a bit larger gun, I would suggest a 4" 586/686 S&W. More durable than a K frame, but still has excellent handling characteristics and trigger action.

[Fire_Medic]

As you don't have a problem concealing a bit larger gun, I would suggest a 4" 586/686 S&W. More durable than a K frame, but still has excellent handling characteristics and trigger action.

After some back and forth with a fellow member I have decided the 4" is the right way to go. So either 686 or a GP 100.

Thanks for your input.

[Preacher Jim]

i have carried a custom 3" 1917 smith with rounded grip and bobbed hammer. been with me 45 years and never failed in its duty. the half moons are easy to carry and fast to reload. jmho.

[Fire_Medic]

i have carried a custom 3" 1917 smith with rounded grip and bobbed hammer. been with me 45 years and never failed in its duty. the half moons are easy to carry and fast to reload. jmho.

This is good to hear as my GP 100 whenever I get it will be going to get some tweaks and be on my "forever" gun list. Which means never sold no matter what, only reserved for the cream of the crop, the rest are just toys.......