Any way to size or roll out balloon 45 Colt cases?

[Walter Laich]

Saw another thread that dealt with balloon headed cases.

One time I put just the body of a sizing die in a HF one ton press and was able to press the case all the way into the die.
Then took a dowel rod in the top and pushed (actually banged) the case out.
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It worked but wasn't worth it time-wise.
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Was wondering if anyone had worked on an idea for rimmed cases?
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walt

[Char-Gar]

Walter...Are you talking about older cases that don't have the extractor groove and won't fit into a press shell holder? If you are, I reload a number of those in 45 Colt. They continued to produce cases like this after the move to solid head cases, so some may be balloon head and some may be solid head.

I posted a thread about this a couple of months back;

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?220913-Old-School-45-Colt-loading

Once the cases are full length resized and fired in a sixgun, you can continue to reload them with the Lyman 310 tool and just neck size with the die in the tool set. They will fit back in the cylinder of the sixgun they were fired in with no problem.

Below is a pic of the tools used.

I know no other way of dealing with these cases. If you have some and this is too much hassle for you, PM me and maybe we can work a deal on the cases. I like doing things the hard way...I am just weird that way.

[bhn22]

Try a Lee Loader, or perhaps you can find one of the ancient Ideal drive-in type sizers for 45 Colt or ACP. I would think that a well lubed case would be more than pleased to size down if you used one of these sizers in a respectable sized bench vise. Then just drive them out with a rod & hammer. This sort of thing worked in "the olden days".

[dudel]

Roll sizing will take care of them.

[jmorris]

Casepro will make non standard dies for their machine.

[SWANEEDB]

I have an old Herters, forget the #, kinda the H type, little work on the bottom bar and now I do all my 9's, 40's and 10's, would work for all types as the brass goes into a carbide sizer all the way to the rim and is then pushed out and down with a punch 'rod', Had a pic on this forum awhile back, if interested I can take another pic and list.

[jmorris]

Do you have a measurement of how far you have to go down or is it too wide all the way to the rim?

[SWANEEDB]

Do you have a measurement of how far you have to go down or is it too wide all the way to the rim?
It's accually all adjustable, 40's and 10's go all the way thru the die, a punch is used to raise rimmed brass and 9's all the way (do not use a shell holder) up into the size die then pushed back out, 40's and 10's are really fast.

[454PB]

Here's an old post I started that may give you some insight......not very practical but it does work:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?29103-45-ACP-to-44-Special-Special

[Walter Laich]

454PB,
thanks for the link--sounds like what I would do
Amount of work may keep this as a 'when I have nothing to do' project

[Mike Kerr]

Walter Laich the OP posted:
"Amount of work may keep this as a 'when I have nothing to do' project"

After reading this secondary post it seems possible but hardly time feasible. Dunno though we have some creative problem solvers on this site.

[Walter Laich]

If I don't have things to mess around with I tend to get into trouble ;)

[KCSO]

DON"T USE THEM !!!! Most of them were loaded with mecuric primers and if they wern't properly cleaned they wil seperate. When a baloon head seperates it doesn't go 1/2 way up the case it splits off at the base where the primer salts have weakened the brass. End result is the shoter gets a LOT of gas coming his way. I have had this happen to me twice over the years and don't like it much at all. It just isn't worth the cost savings to use the old balloon heads any more. Remember they havn't made these in about 70 years now.

That said in my younger days i had an old Ideal press in die that would size all the way to the base and when the cases wouldn't fir in a shell holder anymore I would use this die to size them up for more shooting.

[Char-Gar]

It is not likely that you will encounter any commercial 45 Colt cases that used mercuric primers. The government stopped using mercury in priming compounds about 1898 and most commercial ammo never had it. For many years ammo was marked "Non-Mercuric ", just because many old timers had heard stories of the damage mercury did to cases, not because it had been used in decades.

Folks tend to confuse primers with mercury and primers with potassium chloride. The potassium chloride primers were used by the govt. up until 1950. Some of the commercial makers ditched them before WWII, but because they were so stable the govt continued to use them.

Balloon head cases like folded head cases are not as strong are the newer solid head cases. Which is why they went to solid head cases. If a fellow keep the loads on the low to medium side, balloon head cases won't be a problem. I am aware that Elmer Keith loaded his hell-for- leather 44 Special loads in balloon head cases, but lots of things he did were unwise, even in his day.

It is easier to have head separations with balloon head cases, but the cause is not mercuric priming, the cause is a weak case head.