Lead came

[dokcop]

I'm a newbie to casting and looking for some info about "lead came", the channel lead used in making stained and leaded glass windows, lamps, etc. I have 2-300lbs of the stuff, which has white oxidation in places and is unusable for its original purpose.

The came is in the form of 36" long "H" channel strips and is very thin, very soft and very malleable. A lee hardness tester is useless, as it penetrates clear through the material. It melts almost instantly when a hot soldering iron is applied and flows very easily and evenly - much like 50/50 solder.

An internet search was of no help. One entry vaguely stated that came is "is made of lead, zinc and copper", but is not specific as to whether it is alloyed or not.

Given the extreme softness I think it is probably pure lead or lead with a tin content.
I'd like to know for sure before I use it for casting. Do any of you folks have experience with this stuff? Much obliged in advance for any info. Dokcop.

[Hickory]

I found some about 16-17 years ago, you are right about it being very soft.
I tested it with my LBT hardness tester and could only get it to read 2-3 BHN.
Cast up a few round ball and have taken deer with them, only recovered one
round ball so far, flatten out nicely.
I still have about 30 lb left for muzzleloading boolits.

[bobthenailer]

Be very carefull of the white oxidation its very TOXIC ! if your body touch it or it gets on your clothing ! WASH them now !!!!!

[William Yanda]

Lead came
I opened this thread hoping to read that USPS or some other entity had delivered your order and that you were now ready to cast some boolits

[jsizemore]

Most of the came I've smelted has been soft which can be from straight Pb and tin used to solder the joints. The white stuff is from the caulking used which is traditional putty (whiting and linseed oil) or new putty (DAP glazing compound, linseed oil, and whiting). It usually forms a grainy layer on the surface that fluxes as it goes. It also acts as an insulating layer on the surface and temps can go high pretty fast if you don't keep an eye on the melt. I label it seperate from straight Pb because of the tin solder used. I have run up on new came used for repair that is made from zinc. With the thermometer stuck into the melt you can keep the temp low enough to not melt zinc.

[cali4088]

If your lead came has an H form it is most likely pure lead. If it is star shaped its most likely a lead/tin solder alloy 50/50. What you have despcribed is most likely pure lead.

[fredj338]

There is no zinc in it, far too soft. I seems nearly pure, maybe a tiny bit of tin to make the crisp edges. My wife makes stain glass, I get all the little scraps. It's too soft for most bullets w/o adding something else to sweeten it.

[fryboy]

glance at a stained glass supply site sometime , the softer stuff is usually pure but they make some in zinc ( used mostly to help stiffen up large pieces ) tin content in new stuff is usually nil , even in used pieces it's fairly low as it didnt take much to stick it together altho some umm craftsmen used solder to fill small gaps

[dbosman]

Came may contain a small, trivial, amount of zinc. Generally no tin.
Some weather resistant came has a layer of zinc folded around the lead. Some have copper, brass,or bronze coatings.
If you use a sharp knife - to cut a cross section - you can, in my experience, see the layer on top of the lead base.

Lead oxides are dangerous. There are many colors and they are all dangerous.
They aren't going to soak into your skin, but can easily become air borne. Wash up well after handling. Don't use a vacuum to suck them up if you have kids in the neighborhood.

[bangerjim]

I have a lot of this stuff. Call it 5 bhn. You will never know until it is in ingot form. You cannot use any of our standard hardness testing methods on stuff that thin and weird shaped. As said-------- if it is old, there will be caulking compound, lead-based paints, and all kinds of crapola in and around the channel.

You will know if it is Zn.............hard to bend.........melts at WELL over 700F.

Just melt it down and mark it "pure lead" and mix with know alloys to get to the bhn when you want to cast.

banger

[dikman]

If you cast some of it into test-size samples you should be able to get a reading with a hardness tester. I whipped up a mold from the bottom foot section of a gas-lift chair. The bit that the support tube sits in is slightly tapered, so I cut everything off except the central bit, which gave me a tapered core, cut a disc to block off the bottom and it casts 2"x1/2" discs (good size for testing).

['74 sharps]

The came I've found worked fine without adding anything to the mix.

[41mag]

I got about 30# of it from a fellow after Hurricane Ike came through. I added it to the mix with COWW as pure and it did well for the purpose.

I will add it had all sorts of crapola on it as well but I fluxed it several times and kept the temp low and it came out pretty and shiny.

[RogerDat]

Old thread but on the same subject so keeping the information together.
Found some new, shiny lead that looks like came so soft and thin I can almost tie it in knots. However on reading I find that there may be about 1% alloy in modern came, and then there is slightly stiffer #2 alloy version (undefined composition), and 3-6% Sb versions called "bright" that imparts even more strength. Now this stuff is shiny and bright, but thin enough that twisted around and stuffed in a 1/2 full 5 gal. bucket only weights 16 lbs.

Anyone ever come across any came that was not pure or nearly pure lead?

I will be melting tonight and see what temp it transitions at but as far as I know Sb won't impact that very much, or at least not nearly the way a small % of Sn would.

[bangerjim]

Tin Sn imparts fill. Sb antimony imparts hardness.

It takes a LOT ot Sn to increase hardness even a couple ticks. But 2% Sb will jump it up a bunch.

All the came I have ever found was soft Pb. Except for a great big bundle of it that was covered with a nice soft jacket of brass! I will use that stuff in my antique and hobby crafts! No boolit melting there

[leadman]

I got some in the H shape from a scrap yard about 3 or 4 years ago that was bright and shiny. Reminded me of lead free solder. There was also some of the pure lead came in another bucket that had the usual dark oxidation on the surface.

[big bore 99]

Been doing stained glass for years. I'd call it pure (very soft). There is zinc came too, but it can't be mistaken. It won't bend, just kinks.

[RogerDat]

Thanks there was more and it was a lot cleaner than the lead sheeting or pipe. $1 a lb. for "plain" lead but this stuff sounds and looks should turn easily into nice clean ingots and that is worth something. Oddly enough WW's are only 35 cent a lb.

[Defcon-One]

Probably Pure Lead!

Best way to tell is melt some by raising the pot temp slowly and watching the temp closely. If it is High in Tin like 50/50 solder, it will melt under 500 deg F. If you have to got to 650 or so, I'd say it is Pure Lead. That is a big enough gap to get a good reading on what you have.

It is a bit of work, but it is good science and your result will be worth the time spent since you have so much of it!

DC-1

PS: I am assuming this is new and unused so the white powder is not likely a sealer, but just Lead Oxides. Not "Highly Toxic" but I wouldn't eat it either. Use normal precautions (wash hands after handling, etc.)

Also, you might want to check out what it is worth to a glass shop. It may be worth a lot more for its orginially intended use..

[RogerDat]

Thanks for the info, did not get to make ingots out of it last night. Too darn cold! Supposed to be warmer this weekend, will as suggested watch the melt temp to see what that indicates. And I'm going back for another 35# or so. Little high on the price (plain is .70 at another yard) but very clean and since I use scrap I like to have decent size batches that are the same so when I find a good mix for some source I can make a useful amount from it. I'm fussy about "plain", like things that are really plain and close to pure like x-ray wall liner or this stuff. COWW's are less of an issue because of the large batch sizes.

50# of this + 50# of COWW's should yield some nice sub 1000 fps revolver ammo material.

[bangerjim]

Thanks for the info, did not get to make ingots out of it last night. Too darn cold! Supposed to be warmer this weekend, will as suggested watch the melt temp to see what that indicates. And I'm going back for another 35# or so. Little high on the price (plain is .70 at another yard) but very clean and since I use scrap I like to have decent size batches that are the same so when I find a good mix for some source I can make a useful amount from it. I'm fussy about "plain", like things that are really plain and close to pure like x-ray wall liner or this stuff. COWW's are less of an issue because of the large batch sizes.

50# of this + 50# of COWW's should yield some nice sub 1000 fps revolver ammo material.

You will be very shy on Sn with that mix.......COWW's are only 0.5%.....and you are diluting that even more! Add some Sn to get the % up closer to 2% for the best mold cavity fill-out. I run 2% in everything I cast.

banger-j

[RogerDat]

You will be very shy on Sn with that mix.......COWW's are only 0.5%.....and you are diluting that even more! Add some Sn to get the % up closer to 2% for the best mold cavity fill-out. I run 2% in everything I cast.

banger-j

Yeah I left the tin out of that alloy "recipe". But I would bring to at least 1% and maybe up as high 2% if it was needed for good fill out. Otherwise I shoot for not more than the Sb percentage which would be 1.5% in that 50/50 mix. And even a little less if I can get away with it, I'm cheap.

I have a pretty good supply of Sn but not enough that I'll use any more than I have to. Now if I happen to nail a few hundred lb. tin score like some folks.... I might get a bit more generous with the tin ;-)

[bangerjim]

Have faith........Sn is out there. I just hauled over 400# of it home a couple months ago!

Ya gotta ask at those salvage yards for more than just stupid COWW's. There IS life after WW's.

banger-j

[RogerDat]

Have faith........Sn is out there. I just hauled over 400# of it home a couple months ago!

Ya gotta ask at those salvage yards for more than just stupid COWW's. There IS life after WW's.

banger-j

Who do you think I was talking about scoring a few hundred lbs. of tin?
It should have gone to someone more deserving like me! :kidding:

[mold maker]

Old leaded windows had some stiffener bars that might have been zinc or an alloy that contained zinc. They were mainly used in large windows to keep the whole thing flat and straight.