32acp bore you to tears thread ?

[Boaz]

Ok, ok I'v not even cast a bullet yet and trying to figure out something that I'm sure has a simple answer so bear with me , never claimed to be very bright . I have searched for a 32 acp mold in 71 grain witch is seemingly the factory standard , I cant find one . I have read a lot and don't find mention of one in the material I have read , granted I might be reading the wrong 'stuff' or do not know where to look . I have found 'in between' grain 32 molds , do the mold folks just try and make a 'universal' mold that covers revolver and auto 32's ? Looks like the powder charge would be hard to determine without much experimentation . Please go for the throat, don't make me suffer !
Boaz

[pworley1]

Go with the lyman 311252. It will drop a bullet around 75g depending on the alloy. It works very well in all my 32 acp's.

[Good Cheer]

313249 is a winner in the .32ACP.

[turbo1889]

Jacketed vs. Cast.

71-grains is the standard for FMJ ball round standard for the 32-ACP if you were to make a cast lead bullet of the exact same shape it would be a heavier bullet unless you sufficiently compensated with a large lube groove (yah right, on that little pill?) and/or very hard low density alloy, as in like type metal straight up. Also, a jacketed bullet is slicker in the feeding and not as slick going down the bore (assuming exact same or close enough nose shape and bearing length). Also, cast often need longer bearing length to obtain top accuracy compared to jacketed and initial throat fill is far more important.

All that put together means that often the best jacketed bullet shape and weight does not translate straight across to the best cast boolit shape and weight. Also, load data does not go straight across either, because cast is "slicker" in the bore with less bore friction all other things being equal substituting an exact same weight and seating depth cast boolit in load data for jacketed bullets will result in slightly lower pressures (provided you don't get a SEE which although extremely unlikely in such a substitution is not theoretically impossible). Then of course cast boolits often can't take full on jacketed load stresses, thankfully with the 32-ACP that one isn't much of an issue.

Long story short, cast boolits are a whole different world and should be treated accordingly.

I personally am using an AM#31-087T for almost all of my 32-ACP loads now. Of course I'm partial to the design since its my own but that pill seems to give me enough bearing length and fills the throats sufficiently with its long shallow nose taper and feeds without jamming due to its forward nose curve profile while still having a little bit of a flat on the nose for terminal performance (combined with its relatively high but not ridiculous weight for the cartridge). It doesn't shoot quite as fast as a European spec. jacketed 71gr. FMJ ball load but it out shoots American spec. 71gr. FMJ ball loads throwing more weight with what seem to be better accuracy at the same muzzle velocity. As to what I'm using for load data, I tweaked some load data for 90gr. cast lead pills in the 32-S&W-short using that for start loads. That by the way is a good trick to know, 32-S&W-short cartridge is a revolver cartridge with about 5% or so smaller internal case capacity loaded with heavier bullets at lower pressure levels then the 32-ACP so load data for it is a good source for knowing where to start if loading heavier cast bullet weights in the 32-ACP.

[Outpost75]

Most of the pre-war pistols were set up to function with a heavier 73-74 grain bullet at about 900 fps. Heavier cast bullets up to about 80 grains work better to generate sufficient recoil impulse to cycle the guns reliably. Heavier bullets to to 100 grains can be used safely with suitable loads, but velocity will be lower and they may not shoot to the point of aim with fixed sights. It depends on the gun. I have had good results with the RCBS 32-90CM with 1.7-1.8 grains of Bullseye at 0.975" OAL in a variety of guns, and that load is worth trying.

[Boaz]

You know you guys have made me realize that although I have a a lifetime of understanding of factory ammo applying the accumulated know how dealing with factory ammo does not count here , cast is a another animal ! Got to get the right mind set and lay aside the 'looking at the end of the box ' idea to check the specs . Thanks

[Reverend Al]

I've used the RCBS #82214 (77 grain nominal) with reasonable success in several .32 ACP's ...

[Old Caster]

It completely depends on which 32 ACP gun you are talking about. Bores vary quite a bit with the Pardini probably being the largest at around .3137. You can check on the Bullseye part of Target Talk because it is covered there more than anywhere else with loads of several different powders and their velocities.

[Good Cheer]

I just use the old Lyman manuals for data.

[woody1]

I just use the old Lyman manuals for data.

Yup! Get yourself a Lyman manual and be happy. FWIW, I shoot Lyman's 311252 with 2 grains of Bullseye in my 32 ACP's (a book load right outa the manual). Mine casts at about 81 grains.

[Boaz]

Old Caster I shoot several diffrent 32 acp's , kind of been collecting them a while . FEG's , Franz Stock , Colt 1903's , etc . Mainly shoot the Colts though , always liked the 03's .
Some of my 1903's .

http://i1097.photobucket.com/albums/g353/chuckr1952/1903COLTS002.jpg (http://s1097.photobucket.com/user/chuckr1952/media/1903COLTS002.jpg.html)
Franz Stock is on top left , my dad gave that one to me about 45 years ago , he bought it new in the early 30's .

http://i1097.photobucket.com/albums/g353/chuckr1952/franzstockand1903colt001.jpg (http://s1097.photobucket.com/user/chuckr1952/media/franzstockand1903colt001.jpg.html)

Good Cheer and Woody1 you give good advice with the Lyman manual recomendation . I have one and have read much of it but I enjoy interacting with other members and hearing their experiences and opinions , thanks for your input ! Boaz

[kywoodwrkr]

Others have modified Lee double cavity molds for the 71 gr boolit. Do search in projects forum.
I'd post link but I always have trouble finding it by topic.
http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/7749 is the one I worked with.
Lee also made a single cavity mold many years ago which gave a 71ish grain boolit.
Had/have one, but not sure of its existence now.
Have modified the DC mold, affixing a new sprue plate this week.
Being old, and retired, I'm able to attend vocational classes for cost of books only so milling, drilling, tapping etc is as time it takes

[Old Caster]

Boaz, I have a Colt just like yours and it is in pristine condition. My dad had it back in the 30's and carried it to keep people from stealing the bag of coins that our family would have from the income each night from a movie theatre. He shot someone in the stomach and they still got the coins and never got caught. He immediately bought a 1911 (which I also still have) and started blaring to everyone about the bigger gun he got. There was never another attempt. You have a neat collection. If you are in to molds, I have an Accurate and Lyman 85 grain 32 mold that I no longer have any interest in using since I got a 60 grain for the 32 ACP. Give a Pm if you are interested

[JWFilips]

I also have a collection of the 32 acps : 1914 Mauser, 1917 Savage, 1922 Ortgies, an Nazi occupation MAB and a new (lowly) JA-32 (carry gun)

Absolutely all love the Ranch Dog 75 gr bullet Sized .314" in soft alloy ( just wish I had bought one when they were available from RD)
Jerry from Carolina has been my source for a few years however my friend has had some troubles of late and is not casting for now, I just hope the best for him and soon he will be casting again! That boolit in these little guns give a startling performance !
The MAB (French) has the tighest bore at .309" but it spits these out accurately just need to lower the powder charge a bit

[mikeym1a]

I read the thread on modding the Lee mold, and gave it a try. I got a new version of the .32 100gr Lee mold. I should have cast a few with this mold before starting. After my machinist friend milled down the top of the mold about .125, and I shortened the sprue plate screw, I cast a few. The rear cavity throws a ~76gr boolit, while the front one throws a ~74gr boolit. The boolit out of the rear cavity is .005 taller then the front. Time for some careful filing. AND, this was apparently a friday manufacture. The cavities are oval, .310X.313. I'll have to try and lap them out, and try and get them round(er). Wish me luck!

[wistlepig1]

Mikeymia, I order the mold that you have 3 days ago and don't have it yet. My question is why did you mill it down to 74 grs? Do you think that its to heavy for 1903 acp or did you have a special need? Thanks Martin

[Old Caster]

wwistlepig1

Any bullet over or even of 85 grains is pretty heavy for the 32 ACP because the case starts to get much smaller not very far in and if the bullet is soft, the back of it will get smashed and if hard might buckle the case. If accuracy isn't real important you might get away with it. If the base of the bullet has to go in over .300 (already in the taper) it could be a mess. Make sure you get a chance to load one of the bullets you want to try first so you don't wind up with a mold that won't work for you.

[wistlepig1]

Thanks Old caster, good advice about the mold, I wise I had asked the question Before I order it. If needed I can trim it down as I have a mill. I did that to a very old and abused Lee 158 swc (my first mold) and before I learned a lot on this site. A little and I do mean a little Bull plate and dressing up the sprue cutter goes a long way on AL molds.

[Old Caster]

I wasted a lot of time learning this also. I was using a Lyman 313249 85 grain bullets and didn't catch on until I pulled a bullet to look at it. I noticed that the case was bulged a lot but didn't know that I was still messing the base of the bullet up. I got a 60 grain Accurate mold and problem was solved. This problem will less for you since you are not shooting the bullets at .314 like I have to in my Pardini. If yours are in the .312 area, you probably will be able to seat them deeper before you experience the same problem.

[JWFilips]

IMO if you are using these in a .32 acp keep i'm at 75-80 grain... Slug your bores but don't fear over bore by a few thousandths when shooting soft lead unless you are shooting old French autos & even then just back off your charge a bit and leave the boolit large ....... at least this has worked for me I wouldn't think of running a 100 grain boolit in a .32 acp that is not what they do! again IMHO I have shot a lot of cast in 32 acp. Heck that is one of my favorite calibers ( challenges)!

[Old Caster]

I am able to shove a .315 sizer into the case around a 1/4 inch and they will still chamber in my Pardini but I don't know if the typical 32's would have a chamber this large or not. I will have to try it in my Colt to see. I'm not sure about the other 32's but in the Pardini when the 60 grain loads get below around 850 fps the gun will alibi but an 85 grain bullet can go as slow as around 600 and it will still cycle.

[turbo1889]

I use as fat as the gun and the cases will allow, for me that's 0.314" as cast from my mold whenever possible. Some of them though I have to size down, one gun won't chamber anything larger then 0.310", chamber is too tight, thankfully the bore is also tight at 0.309" so it still works okay. That gun is weird, will only chamber about half or less of factory loads as well. I've considered lapping out the chamber till it will at least consistently digest factory jacketed loads but just haven't "got around to it". Got it really cheap though for that very reason, previous owner hated its picky eating habits being that it wouldn't even chamber half of the factory stock and bind up with the slide not in full forward battery the cartridge only part way seated in the chamber.

[Bulldogger]

Thanks for reviving my interest in .32ACP fellas. I have a few surplus CZ70's I bought over a year ago, but they were cheap because they were mag-less. I found out that Triple K has them back in stock, and while pricey, I assume these production mags will work a darn sight better than the Walther PP mags I modified (poorly it seems) to fit.
Now to cast and reload!
Bulldogger

[Old Caster]

turbo 1889, It might be possible to run the finished product back through the sizer without the depriming pin in it or it might be possible to run them through an FCD also. While an FCD might ruin anything larger, maybe there is a use for it in this case.

[jonk]

I'm shooting the 84 gr Lyman round nose with either 1.5 gr bullseye or 1.6 gr of red dot, no issues. Outshoots my new SIG 238 in the PPK, Ortgies, and Browning 1910/22.

[turbo1889]

One of the really cool things that can be done with the 32-ACP as well is that if you chamber a long gun for it, it's almost as good as having a silencer only without all the legal hoops to jump through.

As to running them through the sizer without depriming pin or using a Lee carbide ring factory crimp die. First one does work (tried it), second would require a custom special die from Lee (32-ACP not standard available carbide factory crimp die). But it still messes up the case mouth tension because brass has more spring back then lead. I have used the trick though to ensure factory loads are consistengly compatible with that tight chambered gun. For cast loads for it I just size the boolits all the way down to 0.310" and use just barely a touch of the expansion plug powder through die on the cases. Slightly annoying to have separate loads for that gun but its blow-back action likes a different powder charge then I use for my other 32-ACP guns anyway.

I just find it amazing how much variance one can find in guns especially ones of certain calibers which the 32-ACP certainly is in many ways as far as I've seen, I've seen barrels as tight as 0.307" in the groove and as loose as 0.313" and chambers that were nice and tight (and even that one that is too tight) all the way up to being so loose that you could rattle a cartridge around in the chamber with the tip of your finger on its base and fell the side to side movement. Long story short, a whole lot depends on your gun and there is rarely one answer that will work in all of them.

It is a wonderful little cartridge to collect guns in though, and usually not very expensive to do so either. I don't really go for the little 25's and only have two or three 380's but excellent to decent little 32 autos just seem to be able to be picked up so readily and for such low costs. Dime a dozen so to speak. In-fact, I honestly don't know exactly how many of them I have, would have to go actually round them all up and count them not to mention a couple of them I have given away to ladies who had more need of them then I did and they were the perfect starter guns for them, that especially tends to happen to the Tomcats since I find those to be to the least of my personal liking and often best suited for a beginner who needs something reliable and simple and only intends to shoot factory in it, tip up barrel being the main selling point allowing easy loading without having to rack the slide on such a small gun with such a stiff blow back slide spring and issue that some of the little 32's can have for someone that doesn't have strong hands.

[Old Caster]

If you need a longer die to do the work, just get a 32 long.

Although I had a Benelli in 32 long quite a while I never thought about having much to do with 32 ACP until I got the Pardini so I didn't even hand load for it. Since I am now quite involved maybe I should check into some of these guns since I have several molds now and a lot of brass. -- Bill --

[turbo1889]

If you need a longer die to do the work, just get a 32 long. . .

Actually, 32-long sizing die with the de-priming pin removed is what I have been using !!! Great minds must think alike.

[Old Caster]

Yikes, I just checked how much my 32 Colt was worth and was shocked. I had no idea it was worth anywhere near that much money.

[Boaz]

Yea Old Caster they are a little pricey now . I'v quit collecting them , nice little pistols though .

[GT27]

I bought the Lee(311-93-R1) Titan# 90300=$19.49 +shipping,took it to a friend that's a machinist.He took the top of the mold down to have 1 lube groove only,re-drilled, and tapped the hole for the sprue plate. Drops boolits at 72 grains/.3126.Shoots great with 2 grains of Titegroup in all three of my FEG AP 32ACP's!

[Outpost75]

In the group buy discussion area JT and I were discussing a light. 30 cal. plainbase plinker. Our original intent was for rifle use, but to expand the appeal, I modified my original post to suggest some ideas for something around 87-100 grains which would useable in the .32 ACP, .30 Luger or Mauser, or the 7.62x25. This would also have a bevel base to avoid the case body bulge when heavier bullets are loaded in. 32 ACP. Feel free to add to the discussion.

JT would need about 20 committed orders to make this go. Design is NOT engraved in stone, but a drawing is there for comment and to stimulate discussion.