TC Hawken Trigger

[duck hollow pete]

First post in this section, did'nt know what I was missing.Here it goes, I got my 2nd ML in 76 in kit form,45 hawken flinter for our new deer season , the dealer had to look for it turns out it was a little older one, as the front trigger was adjustable. I had him get a 50 a couple months later for my dad,kit also, his front trigger is not, my ser. no. is 12th and some his almost 26th. Does remember when TC removed that feature.

[pietro]

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AFAIK, every T/C sidehammer's double set triggers were adjustable - most of the one's I've seen problems with turned out to be mis-adjusted by someone that didn't know how to do it properly, and "adjusted" them so the set trigger wouldn't "set".


The T/C owner's manual is available online, and contains the adjustment procedure & diagrams on pp43, for any who have need of such:

https://www.tcarms.com/pdfs/uploads/manuals/Hawken_Manual.pdf



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[duck hollow pete]

Not talking about the set trigger adjustment, the front was adjustable also on the older ones like mine. My manual stated that his didnot.There was a small set screw that lessened the sear engagment.

[Omnivore]

Duck; I'm not comprehending that last comment. My understanding was that all adjustable double set triggers have a set screw that adjusts the resting position of the front trigger, thus adjusting the amount of sear engagement with the rear trigger when set, i.e. they're all "front trigger" adjusted. I am certainly open to the possibility that you're talking about something I've never seen nor heard of though.

If the screw is not there, one could certainly be added and it would be a simple matter of drilling and tapping a hole in the right place under the front trigger bar.

[duck hollow pete]

OK here is what it was,I had my front trigger adjusted to about 2 1/2 -3 pounds nothing to do with the rear set, that puts it in the oz. range, I seldom used the set mode while hunting.On the bottom of the thumber there was a small blind hole with a .050 allen screw that was exposed by pulling the hammer further back past the full cock notch adjusting it out lessoned sear engagement.This was the weak link in the design if you pulled the hammer all the way back with oilly fingers and it slipped it hit the notch on a dead run and broke it. When I took mine to the smith he said this is a old one and your not going to like what I'm going to tell you now.I was just wondering what yr they made the change.I see the reason he said he fixed alot.

[gkainz]

bought my TC Hawkins .50 kit in '75 or so ... it only has the adjustment screw for the set trigger...

[duck hollow pete]

My ser. no. is 12thou and some, yours higher or lower?

[Omnivore]

Ah; now I understand. That's pretty neat. I was not aware it was a commercial feature. I did a mod to a Pietta Remington Army revolver which does the same thing. No doubt it could be added by drilling and tapping, but some of the tumblers are pretty hard. The Pietta hammer was pretty soft, so regular HS steel tools did the job easily.

There's no reason why the tumbler necessarily NEEDS to be able to go back too far, so long as you don't mind taking out the lock to make the adjustment. On the revolver you just remove the one trigger guard screw, lift off the guard, and the little adj screw is right there accessible when the hammer is down. I've changed the adjustment once in two years so it's not something you need constant access to. The main idea is that it's a totally reversible adjustment that requires no stoning and it absolutely guarantees you aren't going to go too far and have to start over. You want to go back to the factory trigger, you just crank the screw in, or remove it.

[gkainz]

My serno is higher - K263xxx ... so I wonder if the serial numbers had different sequences? I believe the leading K is for Kit, but from 12 thousand to 263 thousand is a pretty big jump.

[duck hollow pete]

No. K is for kit its stamped in the barrel channel of the stock also.That adjustment was factory not modified.When I took the lock to the gun shop the owner said thats theolder style, I said I got it new in kit form in 76 he said that it was sitting somewhere for a good while as it was mybe 2-3 yrs older than that.I also noticed on my dads 50cal.,his ser. is in your range,that once the hammer hits the full cock notch there is very little rearward movement it pretty much stops there.On mine I could keep pulling the hammer back to uncover that allen screw.What would be the best way to lighten that front trigger now that I no longer have that feature?

[gkainz]

My hammer pretty much stops at full cock, too. No idea how to rework your trigger... Sorry.

I did find another forum that seems to have a lot of activity and might be if some help "Traditional Muzzleloading Forum" at www.muzzleloadingforum.com

[Omnivore]

Drill and tap an adjusting set screw hole a little bit below the full cock notch. You may need to temper the tumbler before, and re-harden it after. Test the hardness with a file on an unimportant part of the tumbler. If the file skitters off the steel without taking a bite, it’s too hard to drill with regular high speed steel. If it’s reasonably possible to file the steel, you can probably drill into it and tap it OK if you go slow.

To soften (temper) the steel, clean the tumbler steel on one unimportant surface so it's nice and clean and shiny, then heat the tumbler slowly with a torch, waving it in and out of the flame, until the shiny spot turns dark blue. Let it cool slowly. It can now be drilled with a HS steel drill and tapped with a HS steel tap. When done and everything is working. Have a magnet handy. Harden it by heating it past the transition point (when it just stops being magnetic), then quench it immediately in oil. That’s “full hard”. It will be brittle, but some of them appear to have been left in this condition. You ca temper it slightly by dipping it in lead briefly, and it won’t be so brittle. Experiment on an old file and you’ll see how it all works.

Do as I did and have a new tumbler on hand in case something goes horribly wrong (but it won't if you take your time).

Otherwise; the process of adjusting a trigger by stoning is a very, very well established process. It takes some practice and skill to you end up with good contact area and the proper engagement angles. I like the screw method because it's totally reversible, and a very light trigger that works well on the range in June may be altogether too light when hunting in winter with gloves. Then again; this is exactly what a set trigger is made for. It's just that if your unset trigger pull is really nasty, you should have it worked on, or do the screw installation thing. I used a tiny dab of medium Loktite on the screw, which keeps it in place very well while still allowing adjustment using the teeny Allen wrench.

One “bubba” method I’ve read about is to place a layer of epoxy under the full cock notch, and file the epoxy down (fit and try, fit and try) until you have the sear engagement you want. This is essentially the same thing that the adjusting screw does, but less sophisticated. With a double set trigger, there’s no need for an unset trigger pull that’s super light— you have that already when using it set.

[duck hollow pete]

Thank You