Taurus - lie lie lie to keep warenty

[jsheyn]

This isn't the first time this gun has been back to Taurus....it has never fired well or reliably...today when called Taurus I was told something that i feel is absurd. I was told that I had voided my warranty cause I took the firing pin and Extractor out. Apparently anything beyond a field strip voids the warranty

Yep, I will get this gun shooting with Wilson combat parts and sell it and add Taurus to companies that will never see one of my dollars again.

I've owned 4 Taurus handguns and 3 have failed catastrophically.

Today's complaints;

FTF
FTE
Can squeeze trigger when safety on
Hammer falls to half cock intermittently



http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/vymuru6y.jpghttp://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/ve4asypu.jpg

Sorry to rant but I have battling with this guns since the day I got it....my first Father's Day present.

[clownbear69]

Your not the first to experience bad stuff from them and wont be the last. they are not worth the time or effort in the long run.

[starmac]

With that kind of record, I just can't understand why you would give up on the company now. lol

[Recluse]

I bought a Taurus 92 back in 1987 and still have it and it still operates flawlessly and has had tens upon tens upon tens of thousands of rounds fired through it. I had one issue with it ten or so years later when the locking block broke, which I've had the same thing happen with the Beretta 92 as well. I called Taurus up, sent them the broken piece and had a new one delivered to me within seven days. Beretta did the same thing.

I also have an old original model 85 in stainless that is solid and perfect and aside from a trigger job I did on it upon buying it in 1989, I've done nothing but shoot it and clean it. Could not be happier.

And then. . . there's the Judge.

Love the concept, but I had to do so much work on that thing right out of the box it wasn't even funny. I actually wrote Taurus a letter and asked them if they were sharing Lee's quality control inspectors. The response I got back indicated that they (Taurus) didn't find much humor in my query.

My experiences with Taurus from over twenty-five years ago were superb. The lone recent experience of a few years ago soured me forever like it did with a certain reloading equipment brand.

If I want a "kit gun," that is, one in which upon receipt I have to take it apart, finish polishing and fitting and matching fit together, replace cheaply made parts with quality parts, reassemble, test, disassemble and continue polishing and fitting, then by all means Taurus is my brand, same as Lee is with so much of their recent equipment.

But as I get older and time becomes far more valuable, I prefer and appreciate a product in which the pride of workmanship and finish is evident when you receive the product and take it out of the box.

And finally, I refuse to ever again argue with top execs at any company when I have one of their products and it is not as advertised, not finished, I have pictures and video of it coming out of the box, and said execs argue with me on the phone saying there is nothing wrong with the product I purchased and returned to them.

I understand the OP's frustration completely.

:coffee:

[btroj]

I have to ask- of you have had 3 that failed catastrophically why was there ever a fourth? Slow learner?

I own no Taurus firearms. I haven't heard many bad things about them but haven't heard great things either. Makes me glad I have stuck with Ruger except for a Told cup and a CZ 75.

I love the fact it voids to warranty to disassemble the gun. What a joke.

[bhn22]

They should not have voided the warranty for that. The point could be made that you did it as part of an annual cleaning because you were seeing what you believed to be light firing pin strikes, and you also replaced the firing pin spring as a potential safety issue. Anyway... Let's start at the beginning, does the gun have the stock recoil spring still in it? What ammunition/load were you shooting? Do you have any experience working on 1911s? BTW, I already suspect extractor tension from what you're describing.

[jsheyn]

I have to ask- of you have had 3 that failed catastrophically why was there ever a fourth? Slow learner?

I own no Taurus firearms. I haven't heard many bad things about them but haven't heard great things either. Makes me glad I have stuck with Ruger except for a Told cup and a CZ 75.

I love the fact it voids to warranty to disassemble the gun. What a joke.

I acquired them all in a fairly short period of time... Then they started to fail. As they failed I sent them back, got them repaired and sold them....but I am a slow learner :-)

[jsheyn]

They should not have voided the warranty for that. The point could be made that you did it as part of an annual cleaning because you were seeing what you believed to be light firing pin strikes, and you also replaced the firing pin spring as a potential safety issue. Anyway... Let's start at the beginning, does the gun have the stock recoil spring still in it? What ammunition/load were you shooting? Do you have any experience working on 1911s? BTW, I already suspect extractor tension from what you're describing.

The gun is bone stock....no experience working with 1911 except some reading and YouTube video. I have ordered a new Wilson combat ejector and extractor.

[richhodg66]

I only oown two Taurus guns, a model 85 snub .38 and a 431 in .44 Special. I haven't had a problem with either, but I haven't put thousands and thousands of rounds through either one. I hope I don't start having trouble with either one as I like both guns.

[ColterB]

Catastrophic failure- as in the guns blew up? I hate Taurus... but if you had three in a row blow up, it isn't the guns that are the problem.

How did they tell that you took out the firing pin and extractor? Why did you do that?

And, from the business point of view- if you were qualified to take it apart beyond a field strip, then you are also qualified to fix it yourself. Nothing is more annoying than going through a pistol trying to figure out what the initial problem was, while also trying to figure out everything the customer screwed up trying to "fix" it.

I service my own firearms... but I also don't have any expectation of there being factory service as a result. I thought that was common knowledge.

[MBTcustom]

Ruger makes a 1911 now. That must be a knife in the heart of every company that ever made a 1911 ever.
Never, never, never will it fail to function or they will fix it for free and pay shipping both ways, and I'd lay you ten bucks it will be back in your hands in less than 10 days.
I used to hate on Ruger sometimes. Never again. If Ruger makes it, then that will be my first choice especially if we are talking about a handgun. They treat their customers better than any other company I have ever seen.
I am a gunsmith, and to date, the only thing I have done to ruger guns is in regards to the finish/rebluing. Other than that, there's no reason for me to ever turn a screw on them.
The only company that rivals their customer service policies is Dillon Precision.
I support Ruger wholeheartedly because the only reason they are still that way is because they are still under original ownership.
Buy a Ruger. They have earned my business as long as they keep doing what they are doing .

[bhn22]

First look at your extractor. I suspect that it's not tensioned properly

http://www.blindhogg.com/gunsmith/extractor.html

[jsheyn]

Catastrophic failure- as in the guns blew up? I hate Taurus... but if you had three in a row blow up, it isn't the guns that are the problem.

Catastrophic as in the gun was no longer safe to shoot without gunsmith attention. I shoot a couple hundred rounds with a group every Friday night. None of the smiths, springfield or rugers failed and they get shot a lot .....just an FYI I shoot mouse fart loads.

How did they tell that you took out the firing pin and extractor? Why did you do that?

I told them...next time I call a company with a problem I will lie my teeth off

And, from the business point of view- if you were qualified to take it apart beyond a field strip, then you are also qualified to fix it yourself.

I don't agree.

Nothing is more annoying than going through a pistol trying to figure out what the initial problem was, while also trying to figure out everything the customer screwed up trying to "fix" it.

I know I was a mechanic and you shade tree mechanics used to piss me off with your jerry rigging craps, but we still fixed your car under warranty

I service my own firearms... but I also don't have any expectation of there being factory service as a result. I thought that was common knowledge.

Taking a gun apart tondo deep cleaning should not void a lifetime warranty


I guess I can say I have learned several valuable lesson here... Once I get rid of this one... I only have one taurus left in my collection...and when it needs cleaning I will take it down my self and if it ever need warranty work, well I'll lie though my teeth.

[Recluse]

I am a gunsmith, and to date, the only thing I have done to ruger guns is in regards to the finish/rebluing. Other than that, there's no reason for me to ever turn a screw on them.

:)

I take it you've yet to work on any of their mid-model Mini-14s or long rifles manufactured in the mid/late 70's/early 80's or pulled the (double-action) trigger on first and second run GP100s and SP101s?

I am definitely not hating on Ruger, but lemme tell ya. . . WHEW! They had their years in which some of their guns were a bit, let's say "challenging" to love until you got them "properly conditioned."

One of my partners back in the badge & gun days got a four-inch GP-100 and it flat wore him out pulling that trigger fifty-times going through his first box of ammo. Our regional armorer spent an afternoon doing THE slickest trigger job on that thing, and afterwards, you couldn't trade the fella outa that GP-100 for anything. He got him an SP-101 and same thing again with the trigger--and again, back to the armorer and when finished, that was the sweetest shooting little five-banger I'd ever shot.

There is no saving the old Mini-14s and Mini-30s so far as accuracy is concerned. I have one left (Mini-14) and will probably always have it around. It's reliable as the day is long and about as accurate as a politician's campaign promise. I've only owned one Ruger bolt-action rifle and the problems I had with it scared me off for years.

Ruger had their dark years, to be sure.

But, I agree with you about today's Ruger. Fan-damn-tastic company with world-class customer service and they are flat cranking out some mighty fine firearms. Today's Ruger is giving us Taurus like production numbers, Glock style innovation, Dillon's version of no BS customer service and doing it all while vastly upping the quality, fit and finish of their products. . . and keeping their products affordable.

What is not to like?

:coffee:

[dtknowles]

If Ruger makes it, then that will be my first choice especially if we are talking about a handgun. They treat their customers better than any other company I have ever seen.
I am a gunsmith, and to date, the only thing I have done to ruger guns is in regards to the finish/rebluing. Other than that, there's no reason for me to ever turn a screw on them.
The only company that rivals their customer service policies is Dillon Precision.
I support Ruger wholeheartedly because the only reason they are still that way is because they are still under original ownership.
Buy a Ruger. They have earned my business as long as they keep doing what they are doing .

I also like Rugers but even though they have never broken on me they do lack for accuracy sometimes. Sometimes the fit and finish are not the best either. I would not have considered either a warranty issue but still disappointing. I do consider them a good value and reliable. I own a single six, a #3, a 77 MKII, a 10/22 and an MKII .22 auto. The two 22 semiautos have aftermark triggers and other such stuff and are nicely accurate, the two centerfire rifles really should be more accurate. The Single Six's grip frame was not a good match to the frame. I also owned a .357 Blackhawk that was nicely accurate and well put together, should never let a friend talk me out of it.

Tim

[Mk42gunner]

This isn't the first time this gun has been back to Taurus....it has never fired well or reliably...today when called Taurus I was told something that i feel is absurd. I was told that I had voided my warranty cause I took the firing pin and Extractor out. Apparently anything beyond a field strip voids the warranty

Yep, I will get this gun shooting with Wilson combat parts and sell it and add Taurus to companies that will never see one of my dollars again.

I've owned 4 Taurus handguns and 3 have failed catastrophically.

Today's complaints;

FTF
FTE
Can squeeze trigger when safety on
Hammer falls to half cock intermittently



http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/vymuru6y.jpghttp://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/ve4asypu.jpg

Sorry to rant but I have battling with this guns since the day I got it....my first Father's Day present.

Since when is pulling the firing pin and extractor out of a 1911 going beyond field stripping????

I was taught that anything you can get out of a 1911 using nothing more than a gov't issued ink pen is field stripping it.

Sounds to me like you need more than an extractor and ejector, those two parts have nothing to do with the hammer falling with the safety on, or light firing pin strikes.

I learned my personal lesson about Taurus firearms with one of their striker fired 9mm's in about 2001 or so; I will swear that I had both A/N-M8 and MK5 Very pistols that had better trigger pulls. I shot the ammo I bought for that gun and promptly traded it for a Ruger SSM in .32 H&R Magnum.

Robert

[khmer6]

Sounds like you need to adjust your leaf? Spring. It's late and I can't quite remember the name of it. The three finger part.
Anyways as far as Taurus goes I think their only rock solid semi auto is their 92 series. Copy of the m9. Broke a locking block on one after 3k of highly over pressured 9mm. The Taurus locking block is actually stronger than the beretta version.

[MtGun44]

Thumb safety is improperly fitted. This is entirely unsafe. IMO, all the Taurus internals are subpar,
somewhere between cheap and junk. Bbl, frame and slide are well made, properly dimensioned,
but a bit loose.

The extractor should take firm finger pressure to seat fully into the slide, say 5-8 lbs. If it is easy
to install, pull it out and reverse it, putting the fat round end into the slide, then use the slide as
a handle, put the extractor against a piece of scrap wood and press to bend it slightly. Reverse
and check the pressure needed to insert it. This will get you proper extractor tension.

I rebuilt a Taurus 1911 for a friend. Hammer follow was what was my friend's initial problem.
Hammer was seriously worn at 500 rds. Kept the bbl + link and bushing, firing pin stop,
slide, frame, mag catch and safety, plus grip safety. Replaced ALL other parts with Ed Brown. The gun
is now totally reliable and has been for several years, several thousand rounds. Reworked the
safety to get proper tension on and off.

Bill

[snuffy]

Today's complaints;

FTFFAILURE TO FEED? or FAILURE TO FIRE?
FTE FAILURE TO EXTRACT or FAILURE TO EJECT???
Can squeeze trigger when safety on
Hammer falls to half cock intermittently

Were those factory shells or some weak handloads?

[M-Tecs]

Ruger’s are rugged and reliable but not without issues. I have a fair number of Ruger handguns. Most had undersized throats and tights spots in the bore. I have fixed these issues.

Their rifle barrels are just OK at best. What they consider accurate and what I consider accurate are two very different standards. If they would make their guns as accurate as they are reliable they would be outstanding. CZ gives great accuracy at the same or less price point so it can be done.

When I got into cowboy shooting a had a pair of Taurus Gaucho. Looked great and had the best factory trigger pulls of any single action revolver I have shot. They were fixed sight guns. Point of impact on one was off 18 inches at 15 yards. Other was off about 10”. Went back and Taurus fixed the POI. At about 700 round internals of one broke. They warrantied both issues but shipping was on my dime. Sold them after the parts breakage. Those will be the only Taurus firearms I ever own.

[Del-Ray]

At the shop the last year I was full time we had seven guns we sent back for warranty.

One Glock that had blown up when a "normal" reload was used... Oh, the guy had JUST started reloading, and using a progressive press when I had told him NOT to. Glock offered a refurbished glock at 300.00 bucks I seem to remember, but we had to send the blown up one back. It blew out the magazine, cracked the frame at the takedown "push down thingy", and bulged the chamber up about 1/8 inch into the slide. He was not injured.

Two Bersa 380's for the trigger reset springs.

And four Taurus's, Tauruses, Tauri? Well, whatever multiple Taurus are called.

I would never buy one. If I got one for free, I would sell it.

[M-Tecs]

I guess I can say I have learned several valuable lesson here... Once I get rid of this one... I only have one taurus left in my collection...and when it needs cleaning I will take it down my self and if it ever need warranty work, well I'll lie though my teeth.


I have always found the truth works far better that a lie. Taurus has warranty issues period. http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=242923

I purchased a used Tactical Solutions AR-15 A4 Flat-Top Conversion Upper from a member here. It had a ringed barrel from a squib load. When I called Tactical Solutions I told them the truth. They told me the cost of a replacement barrel. I sent it in expecting to pay and they replaced it for free stating it was refreshing to not be feed a song and dance about how it wasn’t my fault.

Same as when I dry fired my Strothers bow. Blew a couple of cams. Sent it in for repair. Told them it was 100% my fault as I had dry fired it. They fixed it again free of charge. They stated that was the first time anyone had owned up to a dry fire.

[MBTcustom]

Look fellers, I'm not saying that Ruger's products are perfect. The accuracy issues were my biggest turnoffs, and mini 14s/mini 30's will probably always haunt them as colossal failures (although they made some dam good rifles in those lines too).
What I am telling you is that the stuff that the OP is talking about would be a non issue with a Ruger handgun.
You just have to understand the Ruger mindset.
First of all, they place reliability over accuracy, but they will work with you on the accuracy if it isn't there.
Second, they place reliability over fit and finish, but they will work with you if your gun looks like a SS dog turd with rest marks.
They warranty the reliability of their firearms no matter how old they are (sent a 1953 Ruger .22 pistol in last year) And no matter what the circumstances are (no weaseling out of it trying to cast blame on their customers).

The way I see it is, when I buy a Ruger, I'm after that warranty. I'll get the warranty, then spend my time and money working out the accuracy issues knowing that I have a gun for life.
Now, if I needed to take a handgun out of the package, tuck it in my belt and walk into a dangerous situation without test firing, it's going to be a Glock. I'll keep it for 15 years then upgrade.
However, if I need to take a handgun out of the package, tuck it in my belt and protect myself with it for the rest of my life it's going to be a Ruger.
3 times last year, I was approached by perspective clients about fixing their Kimber 1911's that the factory had refused to warranty.
Had a real bad experience with Colt (I'll never send anything back to them again).
Got the runaround from Sig Saur.
Taurus (don't make me laugh).
Remington, H&R, Marlin, (yeah not handguns but dayumm!)
The only Ruger that came through the shop last year was a Mini14 that would have made Hannibal proud. The problem the guy had was that it would only shoot a 4" group at 50 yards, but it went bang every time you hooked the bangswitch with your boogerpickers.

After a while, I just can't help but notice that I would be out of the repair business if everybody bought Rugers. I would much rather work on accuracy issues than function problems. Any gun can be made more accurate, but you only get that first class reliability and service if it says Ruger on it.

When I found out that they make a 1911, I believe my heart skipped a beat. Believe you me, as soon as I can get the scratch together, I'm going to stab $700 in some dealer's pocket and walk away with one of those babies. The best handgun design in the world with a Ruger warranty? !!!!HEAVEN!!!!
I'm going to send it back once a year for cleaning and maintenance just so I can say: "Yes this is my pistol. Yes, as a matter of fact I am a gunsmith. Worked on it? No, can't say I ever felt the need. Oh it stovepiped once, but I sent it back to Ruger and they cleared it for me." LOL!!!!! That would be rich!!!

Now, if we could all just write in and get them to make lever and pump action rifles............

[762 shooter]

Goodsteel,
Almost had a tear in my eye after reading that. Ruger may send you a 1911 just so they can use your copy in advertisements.

Well said.

762

[phaessler]

I'm going to defend my PT-1911 here, 5 years almost 6000 rounds thru it, all but the first 50 were handloads too , never a hiccup. Biggest issue I had was the front sight was too tall, called Novak they swapped it out vie the mail for me.
Ruger might have an edge with their reputation, not going to the quality of their bolt guns (sub-par for the cost), but out of the box for the money spent, I am a satisfied customer.
And actually the brass shown doesn't quite jive with the OP complaint? Especially that one in the middle where it looks "ovaled"....
Pete

[novalty]

Hey goodsteel, nice write up. Didn't see them on your list, have you ever heard of a company by the name of Smith & Wesson?

Resounding sentiments about Ruger. I have an early Mini-14 that was passed down to me by my Grandfather when he passed. Yeah, it isn't made for target shooting tight groups, but it does a great job at what it was designed to do, and that is be a Ranch Rifle for taking care of small critters--and the person standing to the right of you.

Your experience with Ruger, has been what I have experienced with Smith & Wesson. Even for minor issues they have always been a great company as far as customer service, shipping paid for to and from, warrantee repair turnaround. I have one of their earlier "billboard" 1911's and it is my favorite handgun by far. If I were to get another 1911, Ruger's offering will be one of my first choices.

[Geraldo]

Everybody pay attention to Mt44Gun's post. One of the reasons cheap 1911s are cheap, is poorly made internal parts. Some have lower quality frames/slides/barrels to boot. Browning designed the 1911 to meet Army requirements and to be reliable in battle. He did not design it to be made cheaply with poorly fitted or MIM parts. That great deal isn't so great when you have to buy $400 worth of Wilson or Brown parts to get them to run. I say this as a diehard 1911 guy: if you want an out of the box reliable 1911 for around $600, it's called a Glock.

[MBTcustom]

Is that the same Glock who refuses to warranty guns that have been shot with cast lead?

Now look, you can't blame ol John Browning. Ruger wasn't around back then, but if they had been I feel very confident that he would have done the right thing and gotten them to build his legendary guns.

Hey Novelty, I told you I'm a gunsmith. Apparently none of my clients S&W pistols had any trouble last year. The only thing I've done on them is trigger jobs and that was only on wheel guns. No warranty repair at all. So that is a feather in S&W's hat. Thanks for the info!

[MBTcustom]

Goodsteel,
Almost had a tear in my eye after reading that. Ruger may send you a 1911 just so they can use your copy in advertisements.

Well said.

762

One can only hope.

[kenyerian]

I got my first Ruger in 1968 (Single Six) and and a 44 magnum shortly after and I have never been without 2 or 3 since. I only owned one Tauras for a short time. Ruger fan for Life.

[Moonman]

I have several from TAURUS, an older steel 6 shot Ported Barrel 357 SNUBBY,

S.S. PT1911 45 ACP, and a PT709 SLIM 9mm.

The PT 709 needs more adjustment with the sights as it shoots low.

The sight is fully adjusted and it just does not have enough adjustment.

I haven't tried to fix that as of yet. 12 feet or do just point and shoot anyways.

I think I saw a PT709 SLIM fix on a forum, to take off the slide, remove screw holding

the front sight to the slide and shim it up .012 or so. re-install front sight.

The PT709 SLIM shoots fine otherwise, all who shoot it really like its feel.

ALL MY TAURUS FIREARMS FUNCTION FINE sending them down the pipe.:Fire:

YOUR RESULTS MAY VARY.

[marlin39a]

All my friends known Taurus Firearms are not welcomed in my home. I've seen too many bad ones. I know that people on tight budgets buy them. They should just save a little bit more and get a Ruger.

[jsheyn]

I'm going to defend my PT-1911 here, 5 years almost 6000 rounds thru it, all but the first 50 were handloads too , never a hiccup. Biggest issue I had was the front sight was too tall, called Novak they swapped it out vie the mail for me.
Ruger might have an edge with their reputation, not going to the quality of their bolt guns (sub-par for the cost), but out of the box for the money spent, I am a satisfied customer.
And actually the brass shown doesn't quite jive with the OP complaint? Especially that one in the middle where it looks "ovaled"....
Pete

I really don't appreciate being called a liar!

Does this help?
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/a2u9yty4.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/ure2avyj.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/byhuzady.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/e7uryrug.jpg

[contender1]

As I am headed to the SHOT show tomorrow, I read this with an interest.
Also, I had a young man, (a former BSA scout, an Eagle,) who is currently a Marine. He asked me about a Taurus just yesterday.
I, like goodsteel have excellent faith in Rugers. In fact, I'm a Ruger junkie. I collect them, I shoot them, I tinker on them, (not much) and own "a few".
Yes, the Mini-14 & Mini-30 suffer from accuracy issues by some standards. I recall a poster produced by them when it came out. (I have one of the posters.)
"World's Most Expensive Plinker!" is what it advertised. They never went for match grade accuracy.
As for the M77's and No 1 rifles. Yes, off & on, some of their barrels did not give good accuracy. But they went bang every time. Currently, they have very good accuracy for a factory built gun. I do own a few of each & all mine are older, AND accurate. Yes, I got good ones.
I also own very early built (1949) Standard Auto pistols, as well as some all the way up to modern production. Including the 1911. My main fun involves the SA revolvers.
I have a diverse collection.
So, I stand side by side with goodsteel on his comments. A proper evaluation of GOOD firearms.

But I too spend a bit of time with a gunsmith.
My gunsmith HATES Taurus firearms. He has seen too many issues to make him happy. Some, they warrantied. Others,, they didn't.
I did NOT recommend a Taurus to my young Marine.
But we did talk a lot about Rugers & S&W revolvers. All positive.

[jsheyn]

Were those factory shells or some weak handloads?

Both, weak hand loads and full house stuff. Neither did better then the other. Also tried colt, McCormicks, and Taurus factory mags. Neither was better then the other. Except colt mags won't hold the slide open

I haven't purchased or shot factory ammo in 5 or so years.

[jsheyn]

It seems like "can squeeze trigger with safety on" needs some clarification....

I can squeeze the trigger with the safety on.. But the hammer does not fall, only an audible click.

[singleshot]

I have a Taurus 327 Fed snubbie revolver that has given me good service, no problems. I have looked at several Taurus pistols and won't buy one. I always end up migrating back to Ruger, with the exception of my Bond Arms derringer which is SECOND TO NONE for build quality and reliability. I have never heard of anyone requiring warranty work on a Bond Arms, though they have a lifetime warranty.

For the most part, I don't find Ruger to be a good pick in a bolt action rifle, with the exception of the 357 mag and 44 mag, to which Ruger has no competitor.

[gray wolf]

FTF
FTE
Can squeeze trigger when safety on
Hammer falls to half cock intermittently

The three leaf spring under the main spring housing is called the sear spring. It controls the pressure applied to the back of the trigger, the disconet and the grip safety. If you don't no what your doing--leave it alone.
Didn't even need to see the pics but they confirm a bad extractor, That condition is mostly seen on the last round. The extractor tension being week, and the lack of a next round in the mag to support the round allows the case to drop down a bit and the result is a case that gets wedged between the breach face and the slide,
sometimes putting two of the wedge type dents in the case mouth. When that happens the ejector is innocent.
Not saying it's good or bad, just that it did not play a roll in what happened ( so far )

The safety has not been fitted correctly and is not blocking the sear, you need to learn how to correctly check a 1911 for it's safety issues. If the safety is poorly fitted this could happen :
The pistol is cocked, an the safety applied, this cams the safety against the sear blocking it's movement.
If that contact is week there is a small space at the safety cam and the sear. Any pressure on the trigger moves the engagement surface between the safety and the sear. (hammer starts to move into the firing position,
Releasing the safety lets the hammer continue to move and is caught by the second notch on the hammer,
the one below the main hammer hook. A new safety is in order, the old one can sometimes be welded up and refitted. A test for this is to rack the slide and apply the safety, now apply about twice the amount of pressure on the trigger as if you wanted to fire the weapon, disengage the safety and hold the pistol close to your ear,
slowly pull the hammer back and listen for a slight metallic ping sound. If you hear it ping, that is the hammer moving off the sear a bit and indicates a safety issue is present.
A new ejector may not be in order, check the two legs that go into the frame, they are below the part of the ejector that you see in the frame. one leg may be broken, see if you can pull up and down on one side of the ejector causing it to lift out of the frame a bit. ( for and aft, not side to side )
Your have said you are not the familiar with the 1911. Then be advised that a new extractor is not plug and play, they say the geometry is correct and all angles have been correctly placed on the new part. Not always so, and the tension most likely will need a looking at. The ejector face angle may need stoning also, they don't always throw the cases in the direction that is needed or wanted, I am not going into how to replace the ejector
but if you never did it before I would advise to order at least two, and learn how to tension an extractor and how to test for proper tension. At this point I would insist that you didn't void any or there silly warranty, and send the pistol back. I wouldn't try to fix it and sell it IMHO your in the deep end of the pool when it comes to the 1911 and the repairs you seek to do in order to sell the gun.
If done incorrectly they could allow the new owner to be in possession of an unsafe weapon
You may want to consider one or two of the very well put together books on the 1911, as simple as the pistol is they they can be a challenge to some folks.
I would also thing about a different manufacturer, All I have done here is try to help, No intention was given to try and slam you or your abilities.


sam

[MtGun44]

Geraldo,

Good post but you go totally off the rails on "MIM parts". MIM parts are precision and quality, assuming
that the maker is doing it well, any manufacturing process can be done well or badly, milling, drilling, MIMing.

I have an early Kimber 1911 with all MIM internal parts. I put a 2 lb trigger pull on it in about 14 years
ago and have in the neighborhood of 40,000 rounds through it and it still has a 2 lb, perfect trigger pull.
I have a number of S&W revolvers with MIMed internals, no problems with them, but none have anywhere
near that round count.

Improperly tensioned (at least, may be more) extractor and badly fitted safety are obvious problem.
I hope the OP will take my advice and tension the extractor, it will probably solve his primary problem.
The safety fit issue needs a gunsmith to either stretch and refit the safety or replace it.

The Taurus I worked on had hammer and sear wear issues at 500 rounds, was falling to half cock. An internal
examination showed significant wear on non-standard parts, sloppily made. Lots of indication of engineering
attention to modifying the design of internal parts to make them 'work' with looser tolerances, and to make
the pieces cost less. I have absolutely no doubt that Taurus instructed their engineering department to
"cut out XX hours of labor on this design" to hit their market cost target. Big parts were well made and
durable. Small parts were between 'kinda OK' and unacceptable.

Bill

[Blacksmith]

".....the pieces cost less. Big parts were well made and durable. Small parts were between OK and carp."

Well if they are putting fish parts in their guns what can I say. :kidding:

Oops you already fixed it.[smilie=1:

[phaessler]

Be nice now. I Didn't mention the "L" word at all, did I ? Just questioning their appearance.



I really don't appreciate being called a liar!

Does this help?
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/a2u9yty4.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/ure2avyj.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/byhuzady.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/12/e7uryrug.jpg

[rockrat]

Guess I got lucky with my Taurus pt1911. Its in 9mm though, couldn't find a springfield, so got the Taurus. Probably 1k-2K rounds thru it and not a bit of trouble.
Just like I got lucky with my Taurus, been unlucky with a Ruger. A #1 in 460 S&W. Only goes "bang" about 1/2 to 2/3's of the time. Swapped breechblock from another #1, it went "bang" every time. Looked at breechblocks side by side. Looked like firing pin protrusion was less on the 460 and possible misdrilled hole for firing pin retainer pin. Sent it back to Ruger on my dime, with a letter explaining what was going on. They said it was OK. Took it to the range, same problem. Can't trust it hunting and not going to send my problem rifle along to another owner. Guess I might have to try and make a new firing pin for it.
Looks like you can get a lemon from just about any mfg.
Hope you can get your Taurus fixed.

[ACrowe25]

That's what happens when you purchase low quality firearms I guess.

[Geraldo]

Is that the same Glock who refuses to warranty guns that have been shot with cast lead?

Now look, you can't blame ol John Browning. Ruger wasn't around back then, but if they had been I feel very confident that he would have done the right thing and gotten them to build his legendary guns.


Yep, that's the same Glock. I'm not talking about cast/jacketed or warranty, just that if folks want to treat a gun like they treat their lawnmower (pull-start-run to death), the G will take it better than a 1911.

[snuffy]

Taurus isn't the only one with problems. I bought a used Springfield Armory 1911 45 from my nephew, he bought it new. Wonderful gun, he had a trigger job done, adjustable rear sight installed, some other stuff as well. He needed the money, so I got it at a great price.

Shot it a lot! at least 1500 rounds, then my son took a liking to it. He practiced with it, then we got it rigged up to shoot in an IDPA match. About half way through the match, the safety failed to engage, the problem was the spring tube for the detent plunger housing had become un-staked from the frame!

The man that did the original upgrades said he didn't have the tool for re-staking that spring tube. I was advised to call SA. The lady there said they were sending an attachment to print pre-paid shipping to send it in. I explained I was NOT the original owner, she said that doesn't matter, the warranty transfers to every new owner, lifetime.

I waited 2 weeks after sending it, called them. They were profuse with apologies, it was during Camp Perry matches, all their senior staff was there participating. I got it back 5 days later,,,,---- it's a stainless gun, apparently they didn't have/couldn't find a stainless spring tube, put a blued one on!:oops:[smilie=b::groner:

Then when firing it, the formerly flawless function turned into stove pipes, half extracted, shoved back into the back of the barrel, looked a lot like jsheyn's pictured trashed brass.

I should have sent it right back. I DID NOT say anything about extraction/ejection ,(FTE and FTE), so why the heck did that moron mess with the extractor? I bought 2 new extractors from Brownells. I also read up on how to fit/tune one. When they arrived, I replaced the one that was in there. (It looked like it was old, well used, not a new part. Might have been my original one that he re-tuned)

The new extractor, once tensioned enough works properly, as good as new. SO any company can have problems.

[freebullet]

Every Taurus I've ever held- I would condsider overpriced import junk- except the m85. It wasn't an heirloom gun either though.

Expensive junk guns are sold aswell. Many a colt defender have a rattley trigger from the factory.

They all break. Best too learn how to fix them yourself, saves lots of drama.

[merlin101]

I haven't read all the posts so this may have been covered already.
"anything beyond a field strip voids the warranty"
Thats not true! The company may want you to believe that but thats not how it works.
The company would have to show that removeing/installing whatever somehow DAMAGED the gun! Of course none of this means squat unless you take them to court.
Would it be possible to sue in small claims?

[bhn22]

I don't sweat the MIM stuff anymore. If I want something else, I simply change it out. This 1911 simply needs a little attention, and perhaps some better fitted internal parts. The OP already has an extractor coming, along with an ejector he may not need, but it's a start. We can bash the gun all day long without a productive outcome, or we can try to help the guy out. Anybody whos deep into the quality aspect probably didn't own a S&W revolver from the 1970s and early '80s. Colt has had issues too. Everybody has. Taurus doesn't seem to learn very quickly, but the simplest solution for that is to simply make your next purchase something else. That doesn't affect the situation the OP is currently dealing with.

[tygar]

This isn't the first time this gun has been back to Taurus....it has never fired well or reliably...today when called Taurus I was told something that i feel is absurd. I was told that I had voided my warranty cause I took the firing pin and Extractor out. Apparently anything beyond a field strip voids the warranty
.

I can't comment on any Taurus's other than Raging Bulls .454 & .480 of which I have 4. All have been problem free & as accurate as my other .454s, including Freedom Arms & Rugers. In fact, I don't even own any FAs any more. The Taurus RBs were picked as my carry pistol for bear in the 90s & were what I carried in the AK bush as backup until I picked the .500 S&W.

The RBs were as accurate, easier shooting & could put several rounds in a charging bear where the single action FA would only get one off at the most. The Ruger was not as easy to use with the longer barrel.

My son in AK still carries one of mine when he's in the bush.

So are far as RBs go I have no problem.

Now I have been reading about what you folks are saying about the Rugers & I do have a definite opinion on them.

I have had & tried Rugers since the 60s. My favorite comment was they make good fence posts & hammers.

Have had Single sixes, Blackhawks, SBHs, M77s, Minis & probably others. We are talking about 60s-70s now. None were at all accurate, but all were sturdy (fence posts & hammers) & when the RedHawks first were publicized, me, a friend & another that was NCOIC of the PX placed orders with Ruger. We were actually one of if not the first to do so. We ordered 11 between us & when then finally came out, we received 11 of the first 100 to be sold & not presentation guns.

Long story short, I got my 4, looked at them, shot one & had them all sold within the week. Fence posts & hammers!

Didn't own another until friends said that they had improved & some were OK accuracy wise. I shot a few, Minis still sucked, but SRH & SBHs, although still hammers were better made, smoother & more accurate.

I bought a couple in SBH & SRH in .44 & .454. I got the .44s just to shoot a bunch of hot ammo I was given that had been for a Desert Eagle. Wanted to see how tough they were & wanted the brass. They passed with flying colors & were reasonably accurate. I worked up loads to fit them & they were very accurate in both cals.

These were bought in the last 10 yrs so the new ones seem to be much better than the older ones.

They still are "Rugers" & as such are big honkin guns! They need to make a shorter SRH. I have been talking to my gunsmith about cutting it to 5" & try that.

I am a total S&W revolver man with many & think they are the finest. But....they can't take the hot loads the Rugers can, so I shoot a lot of the Rugers because I shoot a lot of hotter loads & the Ruger "hammers" can take it & now, at least with the ones I have, are minute of killing whatever you aim at.

As for customer service & repairs, no problem with the Taurus so don't know. Have sent 1 Ruger back, can't remember what or when, but it was fixed & returned.

With S&W I have had to return a few?? don't know how many, no more than 5. 2 or more were actually used guns bought off Gun Broker, that had problems. All were sent in, paid by S&W & returned fixed or replaced!!

One a brand new Custom shop 10 or 12" .500 that the barrel was not straight. They didn't have any more of those barrels & weren't making a run for several months, so they had a distributor send them one back & sent it to me, total replacement. All done in 2 or 3 weeks. That's service.

I still have the M41 I shot in the 60s-90s, I'm on my 3rd barrel & remember sending it back in the 70s or 80s cause I was having extractor problems & some slop or something, got it back in a few weeks, just like new.

So if Ruger is doing that, I'll tip my hat to them & maybe look at some others.

Just remembered a S&W. When their 1911 match gun came out I got one & it shot like sh..

Called them up, sent it in, & got one that shot great.

I have hesitated in getting some of the lever .454s, .44 mags etc. because of what I have been reading about Puma/legacy/Taurus's poor quality & service.

So this is a good thread & "real" complaints & praise should be closely looked at & those that are good should be told & their guns bought & bad ones should be told & their guns not bought.
Tom

[archmaker]

I have a PT1911, and except for the issue with the extended ejector (got rid of it, once I had the accident), it has functioned without fail.

Now I have had to replace the recoil spring, and sights, and oversize bushing. The bushing is only because I wanted something a little tighter. Only problem it has given me can be traced back to the shooter, and that usually means me. Learning all the things that have to be considered for reloading for a semi vs a revolver is what has caused the problems. So in that case I can't fault the gun.

Just my experience, and as far as getting a Ruger 1911, that is probably next on my list of toys, diehard Ruger fan (SR Phoenix tattoo on the right forearm).

[jonp]

I'm not a Taurus fanboy although I own a couple of them now and have owned a few that I have sold off. I would not consider them junk by any stretch of the imagination. The Millennium Pro that I have has one of the worst triggers I have experienced but it does go bang everytime and I am sure I could make it better but just don't care to do so.
This is your 4th go around with a bad Taurus. I am guessing that you are a slow learner as I had 2 Kel-tecs that were junk and did not give them a 3rd chance. What would make you keep going back to the well time and again if you don't like their guns?

I got my warranty book out for the Pro to take a look at it. It says " This warranty does not cover grips, sights, accessories, cosmetic defects after one year, or damage caused by customer abuse at any time. Taurus will not be responsible for these items." Those are the only caveats to the limited lifetime. Are they telling you that your dis-assembly of the firearm during normal cleaning is "abuse" of some type?
The directions for field stripping the firearm for cleaning, ie "field stripped" does not include what you did. Is that the problem?
The manual says that in special cases such as repair, it is recommended that further disassembly be performed by a gunsmith or the factory. It does not say required only recommended.
Your situation is strange to say the least.

[SOFMatchstaff]

Taurus PT 45, wouldnt fire to save its own ***, back to importer twice, still wouldnt fire reliably. Finally fed it to the milling machine and welded up the locking lug so the firing pin would actually hit the primer. Now it only sets off soft Federal primers, about half the time. The finest example of a real ***... I could go on for pages about this terd. Russian Roulette with this one would keep the game fair.

[MaryB]

Need a c heap reliable pistol get a High Point, my C9 has over a thousand rounds through it with zero issues. But if it fails call the factory and they will either send free parts or ship it in for repair. No questions asked warranty, drop it? Under warranty, drive over it? No problem under warranty. Plus they ship a free magazine with all repairs for the trouble. Yes it is a cheap pistol but hey, they work, mine is accurate at 20 yards on 8 inch flip targets...

[gray wolf]

Taurus PT 45, wouldnt fire to save its own ***, back to importer twice, still wouldnt fire reliably. Finally fed it to the milling machine and welded up the locking lug so the firing pin would actually hit the primer. Now it only sets off soft Federal primers, about half the time. The finest example of a real ***... I could go on for pages about this terd. Russian Roulette with this one would keep the game fair.
I like the way you think, gave me a chuckle. I had a piece of turd rifle one time and I said i would like to dig a hole and put it in it and pee on it everyday so i could watch it rust. But that was in my younger days, to old to dig holes now so it would have to be done above ground. ( same effect i guess )

[TXGunNut]

Both my 1911's are Colts, have let a few get away but they were first rate as well. My old Series 70 was heavily modified as was the custom back in the early 80's but it's been running great ever since, albeit with a few updates. Bought a Defender several years ago, pretty cheap because it had an annoying habit of bouncing cases off the shooter's forehead on a regular basis. Tuning the extractor didn't help, a Commander ejector and a new extractor did. Come to think of it, more than a few parts in my old parts bin came from this gun but it spends more time on my hip than any other gun...and it's not because it's purty, lol.
A totally reliable 1911 out of the box sounds like a fantasy but if anyone could pull it of Ruger could. They've got the machinery, they've got the craftsmen, they've got the management team, guess it could happen. We'll see. I don't have a particular fondness for Rugers but there seem to be more than a few around here. MK I .22 "needed" a trigger stop, RBH needed a heavier cylinder pin spring, M77 needed a Timney trigger, 10-22 "needed" 2-3 updates but they're all keepers and I hope someone makes a good home for them when I'm gone.

[quilbilly]

I agree with Recluse. I got mine back in the 80's (a stainless 357 revolver) and it too has functioned flawlessly. I can only assume that time has taken its toll on Taurus quality.

[snuffy]

So what in tarnation is MIM??¿¿ A google search revealed MIM= Metal Injection Molding? Never heard of it before, is it like sintered metal parts?

I never fully understood that process, but my view is the powdered metal is hit with a lot of pressure to cause the powder to bond together?? I'd like to see that done. I'm always curious about processes used for building things.

Isn't Taurus and Rossi the same people? I have 2 Rossi M-92 leverguns, the first is a 45 Colt, the new one is a .357 magnum ,(haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, too darn cold). While not a great rifle as to fit and finish, they work great. Function and accuracy for the 45 Colt, fun gun to shoot.

The third Rossi I have is actually 3 guns, a combo single shot, .243, .22 long rifle, and a short .410 shotty. All three work as advertised, crude is all I can say about fit and finish. Function is as expected. Gander Mt. had it on "special", just wish the shot barrel had been in 20 Ga.

The forth is another single shot, again in .410 but a longer barrel. That one is better in the fit & finish department. It's just plain fun to shoot as well. Those .410's caused me to switch a 12 gauge mec 600 over to .410 to load the otherwise expensive .410 ammo. I even got some of the magtech all-brass shells.

A buddy of mine has two Taurus revolvers, a .454 Cassull and a 10.5 44 mag. He has bad arthritis in his wrists, hasn't shot them in full potential loads. He sticks with 44 special loadings in the 44, and 45 SAA colt loads in the 454. Both guns work just fine, he DID send both off for trigger work, has nice crisp breaking triggers now.

[jonp]

There are big arguments over MIM v Machined parts. I've never noticed a difference but I don't shoot enough rounds to cause wear enough to give an opinion one way or the other only that in my limited experience I've not noticed anything.

On a different note about Customer Service I bought a HiPoint recently and when I took it apart it was missing a few parts. I guess the last owner was a not so good junior gunsmith or thought he was one. It was also put back together wrong. I called HiPoint to buy the parts and they are sending them to me free of charge no questions asked.

A Kahr of mine also had the Slide Stop pop out a few times during firing stopping the gun. I called Kahr and after talking to them about what was wrong they are sending me parts also free of charge.

These recent experiences are pretty standard for me. I have never had a problem but maybe I am just lucky

[montana_charlie]

Isn't Taurus and Rossi the same people?
Taurus bought out Rossi in 1997.

[jsheyn]

There's no doubt that any company can produce a sub par product.

This consumers expectation is that the company stand behind their product when a sub par product is brought to their attention.

[snuffy]

On another note about Ruger, when Wisconsin became #49 to get CCW, I bought a Ruger LC-9 to go with my shiny new concealed carry card. It fired when it felt like it! The appearance of the primer dent was something I've never seen, kind of mushed and looked to be flowing back into the firing pin hole.

Further investigation revealed that the firing pin hole in the slide had an accumulation of brass slivers in it, cushioning the FP force. Cleaning it out resulted in it firing every time for about 10-15 rounds, then back to taking sometimes 3 hits to fire one shell.

I contacted Ruger service, they said a new slide was on it's way to me, not necessary to send it in. A return envelope was included with the new slide, only took 2 weeks to get it to me.

What I think was happening was; the dent in the primer was extruding/cratering into the FP hole, then when the slide unlocked it was shearing the cratered primer material as it slid past the hole. Enough brass accumulated to cushion the FP. I suspect it was a know problem because the didn't even hesitate to send a new slide,(and a new slide was immediately available.)

The new slide works perfectly. Now I can depend on it while carrying in case a B.G. insists that my property becomes his!

[KCSO]

I deal Taurus and have sold any nuber of them and have returned a few. Taurus is a 60-40 deal, 60% of them work just fine and every now and then you come across a real gem and out of the other 40 about 10% of those are return for a different gun. BUT I remember returning 90% of the Bangor Punta guns from one shipment to our PD and have had similar results with the early model 39's so it can happen to anyone. The Colt percussion guns were just about as bad.

[bhn22]

Those aren't great odds...

[montana_charlie]

I deal Taurus and have sold any nuber of them and have returned a few.
Taurus makes a big deal of the fact that the PT1911 frame, slide, and barrel are all identically serial numbered. This is said to be because they are all 'fitted' to each other, creating a gun that is much like a 'worked over' cutom piece.
Is this strictly hooplah, or is there some validity to it?

CM

[MtGun44]

No idea whether they are hand fitted, but those parts are reasonably well made and have
given no trouble at all in the one that I rebuilt. IMO, Taurus sees their end of the market
as the low end and consciously pushes the limits to do what they can to reduce costs. One
of the most important tools that manufacturers use to lower cost is a careful effort in
the engineering department to reduce labor hours used to make the gun.

When you buy new stuff today, you will notice that it is crimped, glued or more recently
I have seen, snapped together rather than screwed together. Snapping plastic parts together
is much quicker than putting in 4 or 6 screws, so a worker can assemble 40 items in 10
minutes compared to 15 items in 10 minutes. This sort of design is critical to lower costs
and win market share in a very competitive world market.

The 1911 was designed in a time of very low cost for very high quality labor and it was designed
FOR THE MILITARY where cost is a secondary issue. It is much more labor intensive than
most current designs which use plastic frames, for example. Good makers have used advanced
manufacturing methods like investment casting, computer controlled machining and metal injection
molding to produce parts to high quality and tight dimensions with LESS LABOR CONTENT. IMO
Taurus lowered the cost per part and labor content on the small internal parts a bit too much
on their 1911 and a certain fraction of them drop over the edge of quality. I have only worked
on one, so I have no idea what that fraction is. 1%, 10% or 20% that don't function? I have
an opinion, but no added facts on that matter.

Bill

[dubber123]

I have personally only dealt with 2 at the pistol shoot I ran until recently. Both had the thumb safeties fall off. One did it even after a trip to the "repair" facility. My brother tried repairing it using the stock parts, but they were just way too soft and poorly fitted. An aftermarket safety fixed that one, the other pistol was sold for a loss and never seen again. In the limited amount of use I saw them for, they seemed to be fairly reliable though. I put 17,000 rounds through my SA in a few years, I am curious how they would have fared given the same treatment.

[MBTcustom]

No idea whether they are hand fitted, but those parts are reasonably well made and have
given no trouble at all in the one that I rebuilt. IMO, Taurus sees their end of the market
as the low end and consciously pushes the limits to do what they can to reduce costs. One
of the most important tools that manufacturers use to lower cost is a careful effort in
the engineering department to reduce labor hours used to make the gun.

When you buy new stuff today, you will notice that it is crimped, glued or more recently
I have seen, snapped together rather than screwed together. Snapping plastic parts together
is much quicker than putting in 4 or 6 screws, so a worker can assemble 40 items in 10
minutes compared to 15 items in 10 minutes. This sort of design is critical to lower costs
and win market share in a very competitive world market.

The 1911 was designed in a time of very low cost for very high quality labor and it was designed
FOR THE MILITARY where cost is a secondary issue. It is much more labor intensive than
most current designs which use plastic frames, for example. Good makers have used advanced
manufacturing methods like investment casting, computer controlled machining and metal injection
molding to produce parts to high quality and tight dimensions with LESS LABOR CONTENT. IMO
Taurus lowered the cost per part and labor content on the small internal parts a bit too much
on their 1911 and a certain fraction of them drop over the edge of quality. I have only worked
on one, so I have no idea what that fraction is. 1%, 10% or 20% that don't function? I have
an opinion, but no added facts on that matter.

Bill

This is my opinion as well. If you want a fairly good quality frame and slide as a platform to build on, and you like the look of the Taurus, it's a good platform to build on. Just scrap the internals and replace with good aftermarket parts, and you have something as good as any custom 1911 on the market (OK, it'll never be an original Wilson Combat. Work with me here OK?).
I have long held that the single best thing you can do for accurizing a 1911 is to buy an oversize "gunsmith" barrel bushing, and stone it into fit with the slide and barrel. Do that next, and finally, work on reliable feeding and trigger pull. Get all these things together correctly, and I dont give a dam if it has "Made in Turky" stamped on the slide with a dull chisel. That baby will walk and talk.

[MtGun44]

LOL! Tim, we are generally in agreement here, but I'll have to part with you on ANY
reworked Taurus 1911 EVER being equal to "any custom 1911 on the market" . . . . .
But with quality internals, it definitely can be a very viable pistol, I have proven that.

But financially, this is a disaster. Unless you buy the Taurus as junk for $200 as my
friend did, you are MILES AND MILES ahead to get a new Ruger or Remington and just
get on with your life. Or, move another $500 upmarket and get a Kimber - high quality pistols.

If you can come up with HALF the money of the Wilson guns (~$3500 for Wilsons) or a
bit less, you can have the real equal - Dan Wesson 1911s have to be seen, handled and
shot to be believed. Their competition is NOT the SAs and Kimbers that most assume
are their competition - it is the Wilson, Baer, Brown, Heine and Nastoff guns that are their
REAL competition - but they cost 2-4 times the price of the DW guns.

Bill

[MBTcustom]

LOL! Tim, we are generally in agreement here, but I'll have to part with you on ANY
reworked Taurus 1911 EVER being equal to "any custom 1911 on the market" . . . . .
But with quality internals, it definitely can be a very viable pistol, I have proven that.
Bill

Yeah, now that I think about it......I don't really believe it either. LOL!

[MtGun44]

LOL! I was pretty sure you would rethink that. ;-)

Now we are in 100% agreement - on this. :bigsmyl2:

Bill

[MBTcustom]

LOL! I was pretty sure you would rethink that. ;-)

Now we are in 100% agreement - on this. :bigsmyl2:

Bill

I wouldn't care for your company if you agreed with me all the time. :wink:

[Moonie]

Any make can have issues, do we not remember the issues that someone had with a certain NMBH that was eventually replaced by a super redhawk? I have a PT-1911 that has had many thousands of rounds fired through it and it has always been 100% trouble free. Do I believe this means that ALL of them are flawless? No, but neither do I believe mine is a rare object. I did have issues with it shooting low so I replaced the sights. Mine is as accurate and reliable as the Springfields and Kimbers I've owned. I also own a RIA compact that had issues due to the factory magazine, since replacement it has been flawless as well. I can't really say I've ever had serious issues with any firearm I've ever owned that I didn't cause though, just lucky I guess.

Now I'm certainly not calling you a liar, just saying that perhaps you have been unlucky.

I trust my Taurus with my life, it has never failed.

[bhn22]

In the olden days we had the same issues with a company called AMT. Your best bet seemed to be to hold the gun over a trash can, pull all the pins and controls, and let them drop into the can. Then reassemble using Colt parts. The barrel was generally okay, but this was viewed to be the best way to get a stainless 1911 that worked. Hell, this was even before Bill Wilson started selling parts, so you know it's ancient.

[Ed Barrett]

I've got a Taurus 99 and a 101 for about 10 years use them both regularly at the range, never had a problem with either.

[khmer6]

Those models along with the 92 and 917 are great. Made on old beretta machines.

[Boogieman]

When I bought my PT1911 they were giving a $75.00 rebate. I soon found out why they were paying people to buy them. mine shot so far left of POA the sights would have been sticking out of the dovetails when zero'ed. Slid stop quit working after 300 rnds. called Taurus they said send them the gun Told them I could install a slide stop. They told me send them the old one & they would replace it. I sent it to them & installed an Ed Brown. After 3 calls and being told, it's on order, will be shipped Friday,& it's on it's way. I gave up. This was over a 2 month time span ending in Jan. In Nov. a FEDX truck brought my slide stop. About 10 months after I got rid of the gun. Does "lifetime service" the time it takes to get it?

[nicholst55]

This seems to have turned into a Taurus-versus-Ruger thread, so let me add my thoughts. ALL (as in every single one) of the gun manufacturers turn out a turd every now and then - some just more frequently than others. IMHO what matters most is how they respond to that turd. Let me state that I own both Ruger and Taurus firearms, although the Rugers far outnumber the Taurus.

I belong to the Ruger forum, and there are numerous threads about guns that come out of the box not functioning correctly, or that fail after a few rounds. Ruger takes care of them immediately, normally with no cost to the owner.

Taurus, on the other hand, seems to consistently turn out turds, and then gives the owners a hard time about warranty issues. The current lack of quality control at Taurus has convinced me that I will never buy another.

I suspect that within the next couple of years, we will either see Taurus withdraw from the US market (or fold up entirely), or else they will undergo a major, major shakeup, and ultimately get their act together. Ruger, on the other hand, is enjoying record profits and is expanding their production base. I don't expect that to change.

[LUBEDUDE]

Very well said nichol.

[MT Gianni]

I disagree. I think may new gun owners are buying tauras and not shooting them often. 50 rds in 5 years would be a lot to them. As long as that is the business model it will continue.

[MtGun44]

MTG probably is right about a large fraction of the market.

Bill

[Blacksmith]

I disagree. I think may new gun owners are buying tauras and not shooting them often. 50 rds in 5 years would be a lot to them. As long as that is the business model it will continue.

Neighbor bought a Taurus for home defense last year. Hasn't had a box of rounds through it, I know because I took him to the range to try it out. I have promised to take him and his wife to the range when the weather gets better so she can try it too. He will probably will the gun and ammo remaining from original purchase to his children.

Before anyone says anything he originally wanted a cheap semi auto but I talked him into a revolver because he hadn't shot since he got out of the service 20 or 30 years ago and he wanted something both he and his wife, who has never shot, could use. Before questioning Taurus reliability for home defense remember a firearm that usually works is way ahead of a phone call that may get a response in as little as several minutes.

[popper]

Darn, I was looking at a 300BO from Diamondback - same people as Rossi, Taurus. Maybe rethink that. If I can find some powder to cycle my 308 AR with light loads?

[Garyshome]

I had one for a little while, I didn't like cast so out the door it went!

[sleeper1428]

I have several Taurus handguns - a PT99AF 9mm, a TCP380 380 Auto, a Millenium Pro 40 S&W, a Model 65 2" 357 Mag and a Model 85 2" 38 Spl - and all have worked flawlessly, three of them for over 20 years and the 40 S&W and the 380Auto for the last three or four years. After reading about all the problems some others have had, I don't know whether I've been incredibly lucky or those other people have been just as incredibly unlucky!!

sleeper1428

[smokeywolf]

Until I was about 9 years old, I didn't know anyone else other than Colt and Smith & Wesson made pistols.

smokeywolf

[Boogieman]

Until I was about 9 years old, I didn't know anyone else other than Colt and Smith & Wesson made pistols.

smokeywolf
Me too,
I predate Ruger . I looked at a revolver at a gun show last month ,looked like a Colt PP Special, found out it was made in Japan by Miroku ,a new one to me

[str8shot426]

I have a taurus model 66 stainless 357mag. Other than setting back the barrel and recutting fc, it has been a very accurate and functional handgun. This probably didn't need to be done. It was just a project I took on to make it tighter and more accurate.

That being said. Taurus does make lemons from time to time and so does smith and wesson, ruger, remington, winchester, benelli, FORD! CHEVY DODGE, MAYTAG ETC.ETC.

There track record is just a little worse.