Questions about Phone Company Lead

[lightman]

Hey Guys, I have a pretty good pile of phone company cable sheathing and splice covers that I plan to smelt as soon as Duck season is over. I was just wondering if it was worth the effort to cut the soldered seams out and save the solder/tin separately. If you think it is, what have you cut it with? I'm thinking about an air tool like a muffler shop uses. Thanks, Lightman

[sqlbullet]

I personally wouldn't bother. You will end up with one of three outcomes: Tin rich, tin right, or tin poor. Regardless of which one you hit, you can correct at casting time by using it to sweeten a pot (tin rich), using it straight (tin right) or adding some solder (tin poor).

But, I am kinda lazy. Never do today what you can put off tomorrow.

[GabbyM]

Tin runs around $15 a pound. Cable sheathing is pure Pb. Great stuff for muzzle loaders and you also know what you have when alloying up. I'd cut out the joints and melt them all down into ingots. Stamp a mark in them as writing disappears when they oxidize.

[lightman]

Thanks for the replys, Guys. The cable sheathing is seamless except for the occasional splice and a valve every so often. Not much solder in these. But the splice covers have a large seam, plus the end caps are soldered on. There is a big difference between the craftsmanship from splice to splice. The neat ones have less solder! I'm thinking that the soldered seams in the splices may have enough solder to make it worth the effort to save. Even if it is a unknown, it still contains tin. Thanks, Lightman

[williamwaco]

Thanks for the replys, Guys. The cable sheathing is seamless except for the occasional splice and a valve every so often. Not much solder in these. But the splice covers have a large seam, plus the end caps are soldered on. There is a big difference between the craftsmanship from splice to splice. The neat ones have less solder! I'm thinking that the soldered seams in the splices may have enough solder to make it worth the effort to save. Even if it is a unknown, it still contains tin. Thanks, Lightman


Save it, you don't know the exact content but you don't care about that. All you care about is good fill out.
Add it to your pot a little at a time until you get good fill out.

Lots of people are looking for pure lead for softening harder alloys.
You will need something to harden your alloy. ( I assume you are not using muzzle loading balls )
You might be able to work out a good trade with some of them.

[10 ga]

I use limb loppers and tin snips/shears to cut cable sheathing. Works great. Yes, I cut the soldered joints out! I shoot a lot of ML and use soft for that. Use the tin rich to make high tin ingots for alloying for CF and sabot bullets. 10

[dikman]

Also being somewhat lazy, I wouldn't bother cutting out the joins. If there is a decent amount of lead then the amount of tin from the soldered joints is going to be pretty low when it's all mixed in. As for cutting, tin snips work ok, of course, but a pair of air-powered shears would certainly make it much easier.

[jakec]

i have/use a lot of phone cable sheathing also. i dont cut out the seams but i dont cast much for muzzeloading. i have plenty of pure without having to cut out the seams. i work for the phone company and when we did lead we didnt use solder. we were just going into existing splices though not building new ones. ive never seen a new one done. i came too late for that. i wish i wouldve been into casting about 10 years ago. ive thrown away tons of great lead!!

[lightman]

I'm probably going to cut the soldered seams out and smelt all of the rest of it together. I'll probably make ingots from the tin rich stuff and keep it separate. I have 4 different batches of lead, coww, isotope lead, phone co/roofing flashing/soww, and mixed type metal. I use less pure than anything, so a trade is a good idea. I picked up about 500 pounds yesterday, and was promised more. I guess I need to make a run to the beer store!

I've used several different methods to cut this stuff, mostly either an ax or bandsaw. I'm thinking an air chisel might work ok, and I've been wanting one for the shop, anyway. I've gotten lots of ideas from here, so feel free to offer anymore that you have tried. Lightman

[dikman]

An air chisel will work, but I reckon it will be tiring after a while (the vibration from the thing is not nice for extended use - trust me, I just used one to dig out some paving!!). As I mentioned, air shears would be good, but they do need a decent compressor to drive them. The axe isn't a bad idea, saws generally aren't the best as soft lead can bind and jam the teeth.

With the amount you've got/are getting, you're going to have a lot of cutting ahead of you. (Hmm, battery powered pruning shears, maybe? Just joking).

[GabbyM]

A carpenters circular saw works fine on lead. Chips fly all around though. You just need to be careful not to pinch the blade.
Plus never ever plug in a power saw after even one beer.

[lightman]

Gabby, the beer was for the phone guy,:grin: but I also partake! Still a very good suggestion, and thanks. I wonder is a pair if nibblers, like you cut sheet metal will work? The contractor cut the cable sheathing up in 2 to 4 ft pieces to get the copper out. The splice covers look like a blown out muffler. Both will fit in my smelting pot, as is, if I would just forget about salvaging that soldered seam! Thanks for the ideas, Lightman

[GabbyM]

Those air powered nibblers come in different sizes. They work great when material thickness is matched to the tool.

I use a 7 1/4 inch circular saw one day to cut up a fork truck counter weight. IIRC it was one piece of about 900 pounds. used a carbide tipped blade. It did pretty much wear out a new blade.

I used to work construction. Took a young fellow to the hospital one day after he tangled with a saw. Took four doctors three hours to sew him up. We had to hose out the van we transported him in with a garden hose.

[dikman]

I really don't like circular saws - they scare me! I've cut wood, steel, concrete and bricks with one, but there's no way I'll try it on lead (I can just see it getting jammed!!). I feel much safer using a chainsaw, which is strange as they are considered to be one of the most dangerous tools to use. If I had that much sheet lead available, I'd be looking at an air-powered cutter of some sort (probably shears, as I think a nibbling tool would be too slow - after all, they aren't called "nibbling" tools for nothing).

Gabby, your little anecdote made me squirm a bit, as I can just imagine the mess it would have made!

[GabbyM]

I wouldn't bother worrying about the soldered seams. The resultant mix is going to be low in tin anyway.

As for telephone cable sheathing being pure, don't count on it! I had purchased a quantity of recovered sheathing some years ago, and it is NOT pure, and has more than just tin in it. I tired skimming everything that floated to the top, and still had 10+ BHN. A friend of mine works for a phone company and melted down some of his sheathing. I traded him some 25-1 for his "pure" and found his was harder than mine!

The best recovered lead that I've encountered was cable sheathing recovered from an old hydro electric power plant.

That is informative. Makes sense. Old stuff being pure then newer being of many times recycled lead. My five thousand pounds is dead soft lead. It is for a fact 19th century. Your finger nail will literally push into it. not scratch it. It's almost plastic and serious funky stuff.

[badgeredd]

I wouldn't bother worrying about the soldered seams. The resultant mix is going to be low in tin anyway.

As for telephone cable sheathing being pure, don't count on it! I had purchased a quantity of recovered sheathing some years ago, and it is NOT pure, and has more than just tin in it. I tired skimming everything that floated to the top, and still had 10+ BHN. A friend of mine works for a phone company and melted down some of his sheathing. I traded him some 25-1 for his "pure" and found his was harder than mine!

The best recovered lead that I've encountered was cable sheathing recovered from an old hydro electric power plant.

The sheathing I aquired four years ago definitely had a little antimony in it. After reading it was purish lead, I melted it down into separate ingots but found it checks right at 10-12 BHN so it isn't totally pure. I assume it has had some antimony added to toughen it. I also found something years ago that said a little tin and antimony have been added in more recent years to improve its strength and corrosion resistance.

Edd

[kootne]

Wondering if bolt cutters would work for cutting it up?
kootne

[lightman]

Thanks for the replys and ideas. I don't think bolt cutters will work very good. I don't have time for a few more weeks to smelt, but you'all got me curious so I cut a sample from my new score, and one from some some other splices that I had. Also cut a sample from some roofing flanges that I scored, last summer. The cabine tree tester showed all three to be in the soft lead range. By the way, I used a sawzall to cut these pieces and it worked great. I bought the air chisel, but did not use it for this. I still plan to try and salvage the soldered seams, but keeping an open mind, may decide to give that idea up. Thanks again, Lightman

[dbosman]

If your smelting pot is large enough, melt to the joint, then flip the piece and melt from the other end.

[Daffy]

Air chisel or a sawzall with a very aggressive blade at slow speed.(keeping the heat down so the blade doesn't gum up) Air chisel works the best at not wasting or making a mess.

+ For the question on the smaller amount of solder on the sleeves, they were probably hand wiped joints, a true art of the craft that has been forgotten.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

I worked for the phone company for 37 years so you know where all my lead came from. I always separated the solder joints and marked it with letter stamps. You can always mix it later and it is much easier to sell pure lead than lead that is a mystery metal. I found that nothing worked like a cutting torch.

[jsizemore]

3lb sledge and an ax or hatchet. Just split 700lbs of service cable sheathing and chopped out the splice joints with a single bit axe and 3lb sledge. No air, no electricity, and no whining.