Thinking about building another rifle. 34-60 ?

[Wolfer]

I'm thinking about building another rifle. What I have in mind is to bore an 8mm Turk to 338 with a slow twist. Ream the chamber with 338-06 up to the 8mm shoulder.
This would in effect give me a 338x57 with a long neck.

I have a 7x57 I built that is my favorite hunting rifle. I would like to have a gun just like it that shot a larger cal cast boolit at 1900/2000 fps.

This would be a near ballistic twin for a 338 federal. If I had something on a 308 case then 358 would be my first choice but since I have the 8mm and a extra set of 338-06 dies that I could cut down and I already cast for 338 I can see me getting in this for a more reasonable cost. Being a poor boy this is always important to me.

The 8mm would be enough for me but I don't like the fast twist. Besides I have several of them already.

I would have to do a pound cast of the chamber to determine the length of the final case. These would be formed from 06 family of cases.

Since there's a slight difference in body taper between 8mm and 338-06 the chamber would have to be enlarged slightly to allow my dies to size the fired case.

Does anybody see a problem with this that I'm missing?
Questions, comments, concerns will be greatly appreciated. Woody

[danski26]

Sounds like an ambitious project!

[Uncle Grinch]

I've always had aspirations to build a 338-06, but never got around to it. I do have an 8mm-06 on a VZ-24 action that is still a work in progress.

The Turks can be a nice and cheaper way to build on, but like most conversions, they can cost more than a factory rifle... except you end up with something special!

Good luck with your build.

[Wolfer]

Yes this is not a way to save money. It does allow me to spend a little over time as opposed to all at once. You would be hard put to trade me any new factory rifle for my old Mauser if it came with the creveat that I couldn't build me another. Woody

[lylejb]

have you considered the 35 Whelen?

A rebarrel and dies set and your there.

[nekshot]

Wolfer sounds like you got a good handle on it, go for it. Folk who question the sanity of doing things like this simply don't get it. A project like this has character when done that a newish gun cannot give. I felt sick to my gut more than once when I totalled the final tally, then I simply had to remind myself I saw it in my mind, I actually did it and now it is "my" thing brought to completion. This sounds like good work in a shop on these rather cool nites!

[Wolfer]

Lylejb, yes I have considered the 35 Whelen, also the 9 x 57. While I don't own a 35 cal except in a revolver I consider them one of the best for cast. Partially due to the slow twist that most use.
My biggest problem is I haven't found anyone that will thread me a barrel for a Turk, affordable small ring barrels short chambered prethreaded don't have a big selection of calibers

However I don't have any 35 cal stuff, I do have 338 stuff and by boring an existing rifle I can get a slower twist. I've had good luck with 30 cal and cast / deer and don't feel I need much more power for them.

If I lived in an area that I could hunt bigger game then I would certainly be looking at more power. As it is when I go elk hunting I use my 338 win mag and Barnes triple shocks because I may only get one shot from up close to far far away at whatever angle they offer.

Nekshot
Yes, I tallyed my first and while it was no more than a ruger 77 at the time since then I've made it a point not to add them up.
I don't have a shop, I have a vise on an outside welding table but mostly I use the tailgate of the truck.
Once it's broke down and the stripper clip, trigger guard ground down I can do the rest by the wood stove. In reality though if I get started pretty soon I still won't get it finished till late summer. Woody

[Wolfer]

Well, it a no go in its currant state. I talked to Jess today and he said 338 won't completely clean up military 8mm. Once the new one is rifled you'll still be able to see where the old rifling was. He suggested against it. That's good enough for me.

So now the plan is 35x60 or buy 7x57 barrel for the 34x60. I didn't feel the Adams & Bennett F-14 barrels were big enough at the muzzle for 338 but he says they are. While this would cost a little more it would make a better looking gun.

The price of a short chambered, pre threaded barrel would be about the same as dies and mold in 35 cal. Yes I could buy a cheaper mold but if I go 35 I want the RCBS 35-200 RF. by the same token if I go 338 I'll still buy the ranch dog mold even though I have the lee and like it.
Just some random thoughts. Woody

[badgeredd]

Well, it a no go in its currant state. I talked to Jess today and he said 338 won't completely clean up military 8mm. Once the new one is rifled you'll still be able to see where the old rifling was. He suggested against it. That's good enough for me.

So now the plan is 35x60 or buy 7x57 barrel for the 34x60. I didn't feel the Adams & Bennett F-14 barrels were big enough at the muzzle for 338 but he says they are. While this would cost a little more it would make a better looking gun.

The price of a short chambered, pre threaded barrel would be about the same as dies and mold in 35 cal. Yes I could buy a cheaper mold but if I go 35 I want the RCBS 35-200 RF. by the same token if I go 338 I'll still buy the ranch dog mold even though I have the lee and like it.
Just some random thoughts. Woody

I had Jesse bore and rifle a 8mm barrel for 35-60 about 4 years ago. If you go this route, you won't be disappointed. I arrived at the cartridge by maintaining the original shoulder location of the 8x57 and lengthening the neck. It is cast friendly with a 1:15 twist three groove barrel. I can easily hit 2500 FPS with a 200 grain cast bullet. One advantage of using a wildcat shaped like this is one will have flawless feeding in a Mauser action. Another advantage of the cartridge is the longer neck compared to 9x57 for cast bullets. A third advantage is the slightly smaller case capacity (compared to the 35 Whelen) is a more efficient powder burn when using cast bullets.

Edd

P.S. I use a set of 35 Whelen dies shortened .100" for reloading dies which seem to be a perfect match.

[Wolfer]

Baddgeredd
Did you open the sides of your chamber slightly with a 35 whelen reamer? Seems to me you would need this to make the dies size your fired case.

[badgeredd]

Baddgeredd
Did you open the sides of your chamber slightly with a 35 whelen reamer? Seems to me you would need this to make the dies size your fired case.

The base dimension of 8x57 and 35 Whelen are the same. Shortening the 35 Whelen dies .1" has very little effect on the base sizing so ...no, I didn't open up the chamber or dies.

The chamber is a 8x57 chamber (cut with that reamer) and Jesse added the neck portion when he bored the barrel out.

Edd

[Wolfer]

Good to know. Thanks, Woody

[Wolfer]

Update
I aquired a 7x57 SR barrel from a guy at Mauser Central. I'll send it to Jess for a 3 groove 338 bore with a 338-06 throat.
Since the 7x57 has a slightly shorter body and longer neck it may turn out to be a 8.5x57

In order to get my 338-06 dies to work ill have to run a finish reamer up to the base of the neck. There's a difference of .012 between the dies and the chamber. I know the military chamber will be on the big side but I doubt if it's that much.

Now the question of twist comes in. Originally I was thinking 14 but doing some math it appears I could go considerably slower. While I'm alive this gun may never see a jacketed bullet.
Right now the only 338 mold I have is the lee 220 gr. length 1.011
At 1700 fps requires a 16" twist
2000 fps requires a 18" twist
2400 fps requires a 19" twist

It been my limited experience that it's easer to get good results with a twist slightly faster than optimum hence I'm thinking of going with 15 or 16

Two other boolits I want to try is the ranch dog and I plan on getting the lee mold for the 8x56 and give paper patching a serious try.

Thoughts? Opinions welcomed, especially experienced opinions. Woody

[badgeredd]

Update
I aquired a 7x57 SR barrel from a guy at Mauser Central. I'll send it to Jess for a 3 groove 338 bore with a 338-06 throat.
Since the 7x57 has a slightly shorter body and longer neck it may turn out to be a 8.5x57

In order to get my 338-06 dies to work ill have to run a finish reamer up to the base of the neck. There's a difference of .012 between the dies and the chamber. I know the military chamber will be on the big side but I doubt if it's that much.

Now the question of twist comes in. Originally I was thinking 14 but doing some math it appears I could go considerably slower. While I'm alive this gun may never see a jacketed bullet.
Right now the only 338 mold I have is the lee 220 gr. length 1.011
At 1700 fps requires a 16" twist
2000 fps requires a 18" twist
2400 fps requires a 19" twist

It been my limited experience that it's easer to get good results with a twist slightly faster than optimum hence I'm thinking of going with 15 or 16

Two other boolits I want to try is the ranch dog and I plan on getting the lee mold for the 8x56 and give paper patching a serious try.

Thoughts? Opinions welcomed, especially experienced opinions. Woody

Woody,

I would go with a 15 or 16 twist, but I'd also call Jesse and talk with him. When he did mine he asked what velocity I intended as a minimum and maximun. He suggested a 1:15 and I took his suggestion. It was a good decision as I can shoot 200 to 250 grain bullets at anywhere between 1800 and 2300 fps with no difficulty and very good accuracy. Like I said, talk to Jesse.

Edd

[Wolfer]

Thanks
Ive been doing a lot of research. The longest bullet I'll ever shoot is the Sierra 215 gr. it requires a 15" at 2000 fps.
If I go too slow I may not be able to shoot any cat sneeze loads. Not that I do but I might like to.
I'm really not interested in velocity with cast above 2000 fps. I've had good luck with my 1700 fps loads and I have no problem shooting to 200 yds. However it's been several years since I shot a deer beyond 60 yds.

I'm thinking hard about going with a 14" twist. I believe I can get all the velocity I want and can still load it down to maybe 1200 fps, maybe.

I got my bolt turned and the stripper clip ground off plus drilled and tapped on Friday. My lathe is under a overhang outside and it's 4 deg here now. As soon as it warms up I'll cut the end of the barrel off, where the sight was and recrown. Then I just need to get it in the mail.
Woody

[muddy]

Wolfer, I had Delta Gun Shop rebore 2 8mm's for me, both to 9mm(358)X57. Simply had him rebore to a .350x.358 and presto. One is a 1x16 and the other is 1x12 twist either seems fine. I got an over the counter sizer die from Redding (9x57) and use a 35 rem seater. I haven't put the 1x12 over the chrony yet but I use most any 358 Win loads and will probably up them as the chrony indicates and probably will stop w/Horn. 250 RN at about 2200 or a little more. Factory Kynoch 245's I think are rated at about 2150 (got lucky and have 2 original 10 packs). I know this is now just backround but... OK on the 338 YOU WILL want to use a heavier longer bullet in the future, I got an LBT 339 260 LFN years ago and love it in my 338-06. That being said get a faster twist to stable up a long bullet, my Douglas is a 338x10 and shoots great at up to 2300, about as much fun as I want in a 7# HVA lightweight!-Muddy

[Wolfer]

I already have a 338 win mag with 10" twist. It shoots long heavy bullets as fast as I care to shoot them.

I'm looking to build a light, short deer rifle. I don't want to shoot over 220 gr above 2000 fps.
If I need more gun then I'll just take more gun.

I greatly appreciate the input though.
Woody

Do you know the length of that LBT 260 gr?

[Wolfer]

Mailed my barrel off to Clearwater Reboring yesterday. It's a 7x57 now. When it gets back ill cut the front sight step off, recrown and cut the chamber. I'll cut the chamber with a 338-06 reamer until it cleans up the 7x57 shoulder.
This cartridge won't be as long as a 35-60 since the 7mm shoulder is a little behind the 8mm.
I don't know what to name it. It's not an 8.5x57 since that cartridge has the shoulder at the same place as the 8x57 along with the same body taper.
I'll come up with something though. Any ideas?

I've got my stock, a Boyd's prairie hunter and a timney trigger. Eventually I'll want a 2-7x33 Leopold on it but right now it'll get whatever I have laying around.
Boolits are cast but I'll have to do a pound cast before I can make my brass.