358156. Aluminum Gas Check. 357 Brass. 2400 Powder?

[Michael J. Spangler]

hello everyone.

i just received my first batch of 35 cal gas checks and i'm dying to make up some loads for my 686.
in the past i've run the 358156 without GC using ACWW and when using 2400 between 12 and 14 grains i got a lot of leading.
normally i run these bullets with lighter charges of fast buying powder (3 grains bullseye up to 6 grains of universal) in 38 or 357 brass without a gas check and they shoot just fine. no lead after hundreds of rounds.

i'm hoping the gas checks will eliminate this problem of leading. does anyone have any experience with a similar set up? i'm wondering if the non gas check shank is whats giving me the leading? should i run the alloy a little harder?

i'm also in the market for a nice new mold for my 357 and i'm trying to figure out if i should buy a plain base or a GC mold? i would like something i can run hot for a potential hunting load, and big bangs at the range. i don't want to deal with the serous leading i had with the original loads of 2400 without a gas check.

thanks in advance guys!

[detox]

I wish i could answer your question. I have a couple of Gas Check design bullets i have been wanting to try out, but have not got around to it. Lyman Cast bullet manual says to use hard Linotype or Lyman #2 for higher velocities. Maybe water quenching your bullets will help make your bullets harder.

BTW what is ACWW

[Michael J. Spangler]

air cooled wheel weights

i loaded some last night to try out. is the weather warms up i'll get to the range next week. its a low of -6 here today
i do have a buddy with a 358429 mold. i guess i'll have to see if he can cast some water dropped wheel weight bullets for me to try.

[detox]

I have tried the 358429 with linotype and 2400 powder...load shot poorly in my 686. I have since had front drive band enlarged and widened, but have not tested. I would try water dropping your 156 bullet. After you water quench wait about 24 hours for bullets to harden then test. Be sure to seat gas check square and without shaving lead.

[Char-Gar]

I have fired many thousand of round of 357 Magnum ammo with 358156 gas checked over 13.5 - 15.0 grains of 2400 with nairy a spec of lead left in the barrel to show for the effort. These days I would stop at 14.5/2400 and ACWW is plenty hard for this bullet with a gas check.

[Char-Gar]

I have tried the 358429 with linotype and 2400 powder...load shot poorly in my 686. I have since had front drive band enlarged and widened, but have not tested. I would try water dropping your 156 bullet. After you water quench wait about 24 hours for bullets to harden then test. Be sure to seat gas check square and without shaving lead.

Bullets that are too hard often cause more problems than they solve. I just wanted to tell you, incase nobody has before now.

[bhn22]

358156 is one of my "must have" molds. I have Ideal molds in 358156, a 2 cav, and a single cav HP. Personally, I always run them with gaschecks. If I want this design without a gascheck, I use 357446, which is the same design, less the gascheck and extra crimp groove. Interestingly enough, the 357446 works pretty much as well as the gascheck version, throughout the same velocity range. It likes to go fast.

[Michael J. Spangler]

thanks guys

char-gar. thank you. i have read a lot about bullets being too hard. i'm fine with it if i have to use gas checks for magnum loads. i guess i just need to do more testing (hate waiting on weather) then i can see what works.
once thats done i think i'll be buying a new mold to suit my needs

[Char-Gar]

thanks guys

char-gar. thank you. i have read a lot about bullets being too hard. i'm fine with it if i have to use gas checks for magnum loads. i guess i just need to do more testing (hate waiting on weather) then i can see what works.
once thats done i think i'll be buying a new mold to suit my needs

358156 was designed by Ray Thompson and for several generations has been "the" bullet mold for the 357 Magnum round. With a gas check it should not lead with ACWW. Most of us don't shoot tens of thousands of full snort magnum loads, so the cost of gas checks is not a significant issue.

Many of us, have learned the hard way that harder is not always better and in fact is seldom is. I hold the opinion there is no need for any alloy harder than Lyman #2 (Bhn 15) is any handgun load on earth. Even so, that is only needed with full snort magnum loads with plain base bullets.

A plain base bullet of #2 (or alloy of similar hardness) works fine in every 357 Magnum sixgun in my fleet over 13.5/2400. I use the old SAECO/Cramer #12, because it is what I have. Other designs will work just as well.

Elmer Keith opined that his magnum 44 loads needed a hard alloy of 1-16 (tin to lead). That alloy will give you hardness about like your ACWW.

When Ray Thompson designed his bullet for the 44 Magnum (429244) he tested it so he could recover bullets from snow banks. He opined the 44 Magnum needed an alloy not softer than 1-20 (tin to lead). That alloy will give you a hardness just a smidge softer than ACWW. The Thompson 44 bullet, like his .357 bullet carries a gas check.

A softer bullet will slug up/obdurate to fit the cylinder throats when hit by the pressure. Therefore you can get by with a bullet .001 to .002 smaller than cylinder throat. If a fellow simply must shoot rock hard bullet, they had better be an exact fit to the cylinder throats.

[detox]

It would be very easy to shoot and compair Water Quenched WW against Air Cooled WW.

I know that my Lyman 358429 does not like hard alloy at that lower velocity...I should try softer.