Muzzle loading Shotgun

[wire nut]

Have any of you thought about making a Muzzle loading shotgun from a Single shot break down shotgun. I have been pondering about trying to make one from an H and R 12 gauge. I would like to thread the chamber and insert a bolt to use as a breach plug. Anyone have an idea as to what size tap I could use to thread the chamber. The chamber measures .810 of an inch. Any help appreciated.

[johnson1942]

wire nut, look up smokeless muzzleloader inc. on the internet and call them. they can make your H and R into the kind of muzzle loader you want. their are others also if you search them out. useing the shot gun barrel thats on their you would have to talk to a good gun smith to see if would be safe.

[wire nut]

I want to shoot black powder in this. If I wanted to shoot smokeless I would just use one of my shotguns. I'm sure if the gun can shoot a 3 inch shell it would be ok with light to medium black powder loads. I know of this being done by a local gunsmith several years ago but he has since left our area.

[Nobade]

It has been done plenty and works, but the problem is the chamber. Unless you put a huge amount of powder in it or some sort of filler, the wad stack is going to be in the chamber where it isn't going to fit right and seal. If you do some tricky machining to sleeve the chamber to match the bore, you can make it work but it needs to be done right so you don't have a step at the end. Since you can buy a H&R Huntsman 12ga. for less than $150 usually on the auction sites I wouldn't bother trying to build one.

-Nobade

[DIRT Farmer]

Wire Nut several of the competive skeet shooters are building 209 guns due to the amount of wear and tear on origonals and 209 primers are cheaper than percussion caps. The process is to ream out the forceing cone to chamber then machine a insert that threads into the barrel. I have seen them built on the Russion SxSs and one built on a Browning Catori.
There are several who do the conversion and it works well.

[johnson1942]

because the word smokeless is in their heading, does that mean you have to shoot smokeless in it. the word muzzleloader should have gotten your attention. you will either make it work or get hurt trying. no more said.

[Lonegun1894]

Here is what I have done, that may interest you. I used NEF 28" (27.5" actual) Modified 12ga shotgun, and loaded a empty case with a primer only, then chambered it, and did the rest of the loading from the muzzle. You would be amazed at the kinds of patterns a modified choke, loaded with BP, and about 3-4 OZ on #6 shot can give. This is the kind of performance that a fixed shell can't provide, but this gun can, and I can still go back to any kind of fixed shell I want at whim. This would also give you the opportunity to try out your idea, and see if it is something you'll be happy with, without having to spend any money on modifications and such, so you can make a decision based on your experience with it instead of what someone here or anywhere else on the internet says about theirs. Just an idea.

[Hickory]

A friend of mine made an insert the same size of a 12 gage shot shell.
It was fitted with a nipple, machined hollow for the powder charge and had two o-rings fore and aft. He used it for years on rabbits and squirrels. And carried the ramrod in an arrow quivver.

[725]

I've done the same thing as Lonegun1984 and was pleased with the results. I cut a standard shot hull off at the end of the brass, installed a fresh 209 primer and then loaded from the front end just like any other muzzleloader. As you are loading over a hot primer chambered, insure the hammer is not cocked!! It worked well and gave very good patterning.

[wire nut]

I have thought about using a cutoff hull But I am skittish about loading on top of a live primer. the old gunsmith would thread the chamber and install a bolt for the breach plug. He would then drill the bolt to accept the powder charge. He installed a nipple as this was before anyone started using a 209 primer in place of the cap

[Lonegun1894]

IIRC, you said you are wanting to do this with an H&R shotgun? If so, the H&R/NEF have a transfer bar as part of the design, so if the hammer is down (as in completely UNCOCKED), it is impossible for it to make contact with the firing pin, so the pin does not rest, and has no way of making contact with the primer. So, IN THEORY, it should be impossible for the gun to fire. But I fully understand the hesitation to put anything you value in front of a primed gun, as it goes against standard safety rules. And yes, I do blow down the bore of my MLs after I fire a shot to help keep the fouling soft, so I just may be a dinosaur. :)

[Col4570]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s452/livebattery/10GFlintlockShotgun006.jpg (http://s1052.photobucket.com/user/livebattery/media/10GFlintlockShotgun006.jpg.html)
This is a 10 gauge I built some time ago.The Barrels are originally Breach Loading.I squared off the Forcing Cones,threaded the Chambers,Fitted sleeves in the Chambers.

[Col4570]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s452/livebattery/10GFlintlockShotgun003.jpg (http://s1052.photobucket.com/user/livebattery/media/10GFlintlockShotgun003.jpg.html)
Another View.

[pietro]

I cut a standard shot hull off at the end of the brass, installed a fresh 209 primer and then loaded from the front end just like any other muzzleloader.




And I would presume one could make any number of cut-off shells, re-prime them, and keep them handy for speedy reloads ! :D


.

[CPL Lou]

TK 2000 :wink: :bigsmyl2:

CPL Lou

[Lonegun1894]

Col4570,
THAT is some great work. You have talent, Sir! Would you happen to have more photo's available? My only SxS ML shotgun is an Indian-made 13ga caplock, that I proofed and had inspected, but no matter what I do, it will always be just an Indian-made cheapie, even if it was one of the ones made for Navy Arms, at least per the gunsmith who inspected it and showed me his personal, which was identical, to include proof marks, except his has "Navy Arms" stamped on it, and mine doesn't. I would love to have a flinter like yours some day, but love admiring good work like yours and will probably just drool over it for a while til I get my own.

[Col4570]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s452/livebattery/10GFlintlockShotgun008.jpg (http://s1052.photobucket.com/user/livebattery/media/10GFlintlockShotgun008.jpg.html)

[Col4570]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s452/livebattery/10GFlintlockShotgun007.jpg (http://s1052.photobucket.com/user/livebattery/media/10GFlintlockShotgun007.jpg.html)
The Timber is Pear Wood,the top tang is Angle Steel cut to suit.The Locks are Castings from E J Blackley UK, I made the Springs and internal parts.

[longbow]

Now that is a nice piece of work!

I have an 1880's vintage W & C Scott and Son 10 ga. Damascus barrel side by that has been badly abused. I have been planning to see if it is worth anything to a collector or for parts as some of it has been modified and the stock is broken. I figured if it has no value to someone who can restore it or for parts to restore another gun, I might cut it down for BP slug shooting but this is inspiring. I'd love to have a side by flintlock. Not sure I have your talent to do it though.

Very nice work indeed!

Longbow

[Lonegun1894]

That looks great! Thank you very much.

[waksupi]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s452/livebattery/10GFlintlockShotgun007.jpg (http://s1052.photobucket.com/user/livebattery/media/10GFlintlockShotgun007.jpg.html)
The Timber is Pear Wood,the top tang is Angle Steel cut to suit.The Locks are Castings from E J Blackley UK, I made the Springs and internal parts.

Ohhhhh!!!! Ahhhhhh!!! Jealous!

[Col4570]

Waksupi,thanks but I know you are a good Gunsmith and would do the same in a flash.
Best regards.

[wire nut]

After starting this thread I was reading in a magazine about Short lane adapters. They have adapters for 12 gauge and 410 bore to be able to use these guns as Muzzle loading Shotguns. I will probably just go that route.

[Col4570]

Slightly deviating but connected to this thread.The Snider Rifle can be adapted by replacing the firing Pin with a long tube the end of which takes a Top Hat Military Percussion Cap.An Empty Brass Case minus Primer is loaded to make a seal,this was a standard armourers issue for when and if loaded rounds had run out.