5-7 station reloading presses

[GRUMPA]

I've been looking lately for a reloading press that the top of it moves and not the cases spinning around on a shell plate. I've been looking and so far all I've been able to find are the 5 station with the shell plate type. What I've heard, they used to make them in the day like a 7 station carousel type that left the case, stationary, held in place with a shell holder and it was the top that you would move.

Do they even make anything like that anymore?

[jmort]

This is the closest to what you want

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/588482/redding-t-7-turret-press

[seagiant]

Hi,
Well...IMO (regular) turrent presses get old REAL quick! What about the LEE Classic Turret? It is an Auto Type press!

Merry Christmas!

[GRUMPA]

Wonder why google didn't show that up? That is essentially what I'm after but wish it wasn't priced just under the gold standard.

[GRUMPA]

Hi,
Well...IMO (regular) turrent presses get old REAL quick! What about the LEE Classic Turret? It is an Auto Type press!

Merry Christmas!

What I'm using it for I have to have the ability to get my hands in there adding things to the cartridge as it's going through the processes involved in the project I have going on. I have 7 different things the case goes through before it's completed.

[jmort]

Easy for me to spend your money, but they are worth the $$$. Really nice/strong. Look for a used one. They hold value, so new may make as much sense.

[seagiant]

Hi,
This is what I prefer over a turrent!

[GRUMPA]

This is but 1 of my projects I'm currently doing.

91569

It's very involved to the point it takes up so much time.

If your curious it's a 140-150gr shot load for the 300 Blackout.

[jmort]

I want a CH4D 444 which is similar but no swinging shell holder arm. Nice press.

[seagiant]

Hi,
The CH 444 is to "busy" for me just like a turrent! Go figure! Whats nice about the PW Met II is you are not having to grab the case everytime when you move it,you just swing the arm also has a primer feed! VERY nice press,but once again,take your wallet!

[GRUMPA]

Hi,
This is what I prefer over a turrent!

I need more stations than that for what I'm doing. Although a very fine looking press it's under gunned for what I need.

seagiant....you have nicer toys...I'm envious.

[StratsMan]

Another option is an old Herters 234 6-position turret... there's one on FleaBay right now, but way overpriced... should be $60-$70 (IMHO).... I use mine to keep a couple of calibers set up, so I can load 15-20 rounds of each for quick testing instead of setting up the 550 for each one.... I wouldn't try to load match grade rounds with it, as there is slight movement from the wide, unsupported turret... but it's fine for what I ask of it...

[seagiant]

Another option is an old Herters 234 6-position turret... there's one on FleaBay right now, but way overpriced... should be $60-$70 (IMHO).... I use mine to keep a couple of calibers set up, so I can load 15-20 rounds of each for quick testing instead of setting up the 550 for each one.... I wouldn't try to load match grade rounds with it, as there is slight movement from the wide, unsupported turret... but it's fine for what I ask of it...

Hi,
I HAD one of those and it is an excellent heavy duty press. I think I sold it for $75 at the time! Of course this was before everything reloading went crazy!

[dbosman]

A Hollywood Senior has eleven stations. If I'm recalling correctly, there is an eight station model.
They show up on eBay periodically.

The RCBS Delux has six die stations.

Redding T7 has six die stations.

[seagiant]

Hi,
The Herter's 234 should be your cheapest way out,IF you can find one!

Here is one a member here redid and made a stand for it, which I thought was very nice! Can't remember who, but kept the pic!

[Bullshop Junior]

Hi,
Well...IMO (regular) turrent presses get old REAL quick! What about the LEE Classic Turret? It is an Auto Type press!

Merry Christmas!

I have a Lee classic cast turret, and it is a very good press, but the auto index stinks. The plastic index bushings wear out after about 2 boxes of ammo. I usually set all my dies, and then just to one stage at a time. size all the brass, prime it all and so on.

[Bullshop Junior]

Hi,
This is what I prefer over a turrent!

Now that is just plain cool! What brand is it?

[Bullshop Junior]

I think Hollywood actually made a 12 station as well. I believe redding currently has a 7 stage, and RCBS and Lyman have a 6 stage.

[monadnock#5]

You might consider a Forster Co-Ax. The one where the dies, once adjusted, snap in and out of the casting. Your production rate might be a little better with the Redding T-7, but not by much I would think.

[GRUMPA]

You might consider a Forster Co-Ax. The one where the dies, once adjusted, snap in and out of the casting. Your production rate might be a little better with the Redding T-7, but not by much I would think.

Well.....right now I make those on a single stage even though I have 2 progressives that aren't any better at it with me having to stuff things by hand into the cases. I just got the RCBS version with an extra die holder so I might be able to use it for 1 of my other projects. Just seems you have to try and be 1 step ahead of the game when it comes to anything in the reloading world. Either things are out of stock or the prices have gone through the roof.

[liliysdad]

I do 95% of my loading on an RCBS Turret, and could not be happier with it.

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

,,,,,

[seagiant]

Hi 123,DB,
That is a sweet looking press! The only way I could use it would be as a single stage with a loading block and have my PM on the bench! If I tried to load a complete round at one time by moving the turrent every time I would get wore out in about 10 minutes!!!

That is me and others are different but the good news is everyone can choose. It is a very high quality press with loads of owner appreciation! I know you enjoy it! Thanks for the pic!

[LUBEDUDE]

Howdy Seagiant, I guess you are just not feeling us Turret folks. Or I'm not feeling you. :)

It's really 6 to 1, half dozen to the other when compared to your Met II.

Your are swinging the shell holder roughly 4/5 places at the BOTTOM of the press.

With a conventional Turret like the T-7, Lyman, or Hollywood your are swinging the die roughly 4/5 places at the TOP of the press.

Now what difference does it make if you are swinging at the top of the press or the bottom?

Other than one particular BRAND of press may be a better design as far as leverage, strength, or what have you. I just don't see your point. Keep in mind, you swing back and forth with the turret. You are Not going all the way around each time.

Maybe I'm missing something. Please educate me. :)

[seagiant]

Hi Lube,
Hope your doing well! I CAN understand why you think I'm nuts,but that is because you have never used a PW Met II! The difference to me is with a turrent you are moving a "turrent head" full of dies and the head is steel and the dies are steel AND powder measure are steel AND the powder is heavy too! Add all this up together and boy, now you are moving ALOT of weight around every few seconds to make your cartridge!!!

The MetII however, you are only moving an aluminum swing arm and the only weight is the cartridge! Once you think of it I'm sure anyone could see the difference. I wish it was possible for people to try one of these loaders and also that they were more affordable. At pretty much $450 they are not an impulse buy!

To go a step further, my problem with the CH 444 press is that you are moving the casing from one shellholder to the next and this is to "busy" for me! Once again the Met II takes care of this problem as once the case is put in the swing arm it is kept there from priming to crimping! Also with the "H" press open design it is easy to see what is going on including inspection of the case at anytime! What can I say? Just a better mouse trap to me! YMMV!

[Whiterabbit]

is that a primer feed on the T7? looks too big to be a primer feed tube. can't be anything else though?

[LUBEDUDE]

Hey SG, ok, makes sense! And the MetII IS and has been on my list for some time now. Seems that the Old School presses always win out.

All I can say, I've never had issues. But then, I've haven't experienced a MetII yet!:grin:

Thanks for the help!

[LUBEDUDE]

is that a primer feed on the T7? looks too big to be a primer feed tube. can't be anything else though?

Yes, that's the primer system. The tube is big because that is a blast tube surrounding the primer tube.

[Jailer]

An alternative, albeit not a perfect solution, would be a Lee Classic Turret and two turrets set up with the dies you need. Swapping turrets literally takes like 5 seconds if you are moving slow.

Start with the first 4 steps in your process in one turret swap turrets and finish the next 3 in the second turret. Spare turrets are under $10 each.

ETA: I like the shot shell idea. How well does it work? What size shot are you using? I think you should start a thread on your loading process for this.

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

How

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnVT/Guns/Crushed45_zps65f86d72.jpg (http://s153.photobucket.com/user/ShawnVT/media/Guns/Crushed45_zps65f86d72.jpg.html)

[Warhawk]

Look for a Lyman T-Mag press.

[seagiant]

Hi 123 DB,
Well,I think you have found the best way to use your machine! It sounds like you have found a way to increase speed over a single stage but have kept ALL the safety in!!! That's hard to improve on!

[Bullwolf]

I too am one of those oddball hand loaders who often likes to use a turret press.

I got started with a RCBS "Rock Chucker" and have used the RCBS piggyback conversions, Dillon progressive presses, Ammo Load machines, Lee presses and quite a few various assorted others over the years as well. I really enjoy loading single stage and simply taking my time, with all the dies locked down into a turret head.

I do the same things that most others do when using a turret press, however with one step added that I rarely see mentioned here. I add a powder measure to the turret head and powder charge the individual case while turning the turret.

When loading handgun cartridges I tend to screw my spare RCBS Uniflow powder measure into an empty hole in the turret head. Often right after the resizing/depriming die stage, and the flaring die stage.

Here is a picture of a Uniflow powder measure screwed into my newer style Lyman T-mag press.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52367&d=1304661429

When loading a single test round to check cycling, or small quantity like a box of 50 or 100 rounds I just turn the turret head for each step to size, prime, and flare.

Then with the case still in the shell holder I carefully raise the ram and powder charge the case during that step, and then move on to seat, and then crimp resulting in a finished round. All of this without ever moving the case to a charging block or a separately mounted stand for the powder measure. I find it convenient as the 6 or 7 hole turret heads will often have a free station or two, even while seating and crimping in separate steps.

I do this often when loading small batches, rather than sizing 50 cases, and then priming 50, flaring 50, and using a loading block and separately powder charging 50 cases, then coming back and seating, and crimping 50 loaded rounds. I still double check my powder throws every few rounds on a balance beam scale to make sure things aren't drifting off course with the powder measure screwed down into the turret.

Not saying that I don't do it both ways. Sometimes I powder charge away from the press using a powder trickler when loading rifle cartridges with hard to meter powders. I sometimes use loading blocks too, along with a powder measure mounted on a stand. I just appreciate the added versatility of being able to mount the powder measure in the turret head.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_187904efc51e484b72.jpg

I'm surprised that I don't see mention of others doing it this way. I always thought it just another added benefit of using a turret press.

- Bullwolf

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

[quote]I'm surprised that I don't see mention of others doing it this way. I always thought it just another added benefit of using a turret press.

- Bullwolf [/quote

[W.R.Buchanan]

Good to see all of the ways you guys are using your machines. This type of thing helps when people see it as it gives ideas on how to do things faster or better or both.

As far as the diff between the MetalMatic II and the T7 Press it is six of one half dozen other. One moves the case the other moves the tools.

The Turret Press. (Greg, please drop the "N" from this word) is a solution which enables you to do multiple operations to a case in one handling. This is the overall concept of the Turret Lathe or Turret drill or turret anything, which I do know something about.

On a turret lathe the idea is for the turret to complete one full revolution for each part done, or in some cases you will have multiple setups on the same turret that do the same two or three functions two or three times in one rotation.

IE: center drill, drill, tap. This is a common set of operations, and since the turret has 6 stations it can be done where there is a open space between tools,, Index twice,, or if you are making a zillion parts you would have two complete set ups so you only index the turret once for each operation. This saves you work since everytime you index the turret it takes energy. Surprising how quickly this gets old.

It is faster to index the turret twice for every operation than it is to put three tools into three consecutive stations and then index back to the beginning each time you have completed a part. Similarly it is faster and more efficient to make a complete rotation than moving back and forth. Turrets on Lathes typically won't let you rotate the turret backwards. it forces you to go all the way around.

A simple indexing device could be made for your reloading press that indexes the turret for you when it is pushed or when the handle is raised to it's uppermost position. There is literally a zillion ways to do this.
Google "escapements"

The whole idea of all of these tools is to reduce your handling of the individual pieces. This is what kills you. If you are doing a million parts and you have two completely different operations then you must handle those parts 2 million times. If you add an operation then you just upped your workload 33% and when we are talking 2 million handlings that just went up to 3 million handlings. Whatever you can do in a situation like this to either eliminate operations or consolidate operations will pay you back big time. Hence the multi tool turret.

Grumpa: you are a skilled machinist. I think you should buy a Dillon 1050 and set it up to do a variety of operations that you need to do to sell your brass. If you're going to be in business then your time is worth money and the more time you can save the better off you'll be in the long run. Also a machine like the 1050 can help you produce quality cases and ammo that is far beyond what is normally available out there with a minimum of effort and high rate of production.

For your .300blk cases you could start by chopping the case off to a rough length, then put the case in the 1050 and form it, size it, trim to final length, swage the primer pocket and poop out a done case everytime you pull the handle. This is the beauty of the Rotary Transfer Machine.

I'm sure you'll figure out something that works for you.

Randy

[Bullwolf]

That's what I thought I was going to do when I bought my T7 back in the spring ... just set it up this last week finally!

When I went to put my powder measure on ... I ran into a problem ... since I have the "auto primer" thingy ... it won't allow me to position the powder measure over the ram/shell, maybe there is an adapter, or an extension to lift it up above the primer tube safety shield, but? I decided I was still comfortable to look at the powder in the tray ... I was a little leery of not being able to confirm the consistent powder drop.

Here is what mine looks like ...

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s220/ShawnTVT/Guns/002_zpsaf8e1a3d.jpg (http://s153.photobucket.com/user/ShawnTVT/media/Guns/002_zpsaf8e1a3d.jpg.html)



Wow that really is a tight fit. Excellent pictures there that clearly describe the situation.

I like the idea of the Redding T7 press. It sure looks well built. I can also appreciate the primer blast tube after having blown an almost full primer tube on one of the large progressive Dillon machines at work. The big Dillon press handled the blown primer tube extremely well, and only my nerves were somewhat shot after.

(I was loading 9mm Luger just fine until a 9 Makarov case got missed by one of the case sorters. It ran right through the auto case feeder, but when I tried to seat a boxer primer in the 9 Mak berdan primed case... Bang! - It's raining primers)

My only thoughts would be trying another slimmer powder measure, or raising the powder measure up higher, which may give a drop tube like effect.

You could possibly turn the measure a bit, move the charge handle or mock up some kind of different throw handle but it still looks tight for space. All those suggestions don't sound very ergonomic either.

If you do come up with a work around that will easily throw powder charges on the T7 press... Please tell us about it, or post a picture of it. I would sure like to see it, and it may be beneficial to others who are using the same setup.




- Bullwolf

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FB1FIytu74

[kenyerian]

Looks like A little dandy Measure would work .

[W.R.Buchanan]

I think you guys are trying to do too much at once. If you set up the press for each loading session and cartridge you will have more space to run your PM on the turret. By only using four of the seven stations it will leave you room to run your powder measure.

It is obvious that if you have the turret loaded with 2-3 different sets of dies that you will have to compromise in the operation of each one.

Using 4 dies is the best way to load pistol rounds. First is deprime/size, and then you prime the case on the up stroke. Second die bells the case mouth and if you use the right kind of die (like a Dillon powder thru die ) charges the case. Third die seats the bullet and fourth die crimps the case and since you are seating and crimping in separate steps you can control both better and easier.

Get rid of the turning handle that sticks out the side and turn the turret by hand by using the dies as a handle. That way you can turn the turret completely around and start on the next round at the beginning of the set up as opposed to winding the turret back around to start over. It is much more efficient to rotate the turret in one direction.

Dillon sells the powder charging die and then you buy individual "powder funnels" which bell the case mouth and directs the powder into the case separately. They also have an adapter to mount your powder measure to the die.

Another way to go is to get a Dillon Powder measure which sits on top of their die and throws the charge when the cartridge enters the die. This prevents you from spilling powder all over the machine since if there is no case present the powder measure doesn't get activated.

The Dillon Powder measures are more consistent than the RCBS type anyway due to the more consistent way they are activated, so the likelihood of a wrong charge is lessened. This is especially true if you are loading pistol rounds like .45 ACP. If you are loading Rifle rounds then using a fine grained ball powder like BLC-2 is kind of a must since stick powders just don't meter that well in any type of measure.

If you insist on using stick powders for like .30-06 or .308's like I do, then Dillon also has a neato funnel that sits atop their powder die, and you throw a charge into a pan and weigh it and then dump the weighed charge into the funnel when a case is under the die.

Then you simply seat a bullet and crimp in the next two stations and then you're done . Rotate turret and repeat.

Randy

[Bullwolf]

A while back I took apart the Uniflow measure that I often mount in the turret head, and I reversed the powder drum as well as the throw handle on it so I could charge cases using my free left hand.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=91798&d=1388216329

While doing that I noticed that you could also invert, or move the handle position somewhat depending on where you wanted it mounted by using the two screws. I still don't think that will give you enough play for what you want to do, but just in case, I figured it was worth mentioning.

Perhaps a Lil'Dandy or some other brand of powder measure would be a perfect fit. I'm always looking for an excuse to get another powder measure after all, even though I'm a big fan of the RCBS Uniflow measure.

For the record I rarely if ever use the turret head advancing handle. It's only in the picture as a convenient place to put it rather than letting it roll around someplace.

I just grab the head or the dies and rotate by hand.
I don't even think my older Orange T-mag Press...
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_187904eec3a72ac51f.jpg
Even came with an advancing handle.

(I re-painted the orange press body black so both machines match)





- Bullwolf

[hornetman]

In addition to the Dillion powder die- Lyman also makes a "Multi-Expand Powder Charge Die" that lets you mount almost any measure and expand and drop powder in one operation. It comes with several expanders for different calibers- works like their M die.

[oger]

Picked up a T-7 on E-bay with the intention of using it to play with small runs of different loads it ended up being set up for 357 Sig and left that way. The way I reload Sig it requires 5 stations even though I deprime and clean them before reloading. One station is a 40 carbide die then the Sig fl sizer then an old Dillon powder drop that flares and fills the case then the seater and finally a taper crimp die. I prime the case when I first put it in the shell holder under one of the empty stations (the decapping pins are removed from both sizers). Once you get the feel of what is happening it goes real well and I still have 2 stations that can be used like a single stage press.

[dragon813gt]

In addition to the Dillion powder die- Lyman also makes a "Multi-Expand Powder Charge Die" that lets you mount almost any measure and expand and drop powder in one operation. It comes with several expanders for different calibers- works like their M die.

Does it? I see no reference to it working like a M die. It's a shame it doesn't operate like Lee's or Dillon's w/ it being case activated. If it expanded like a M die and was case activated I would buy it.

[Doc_Stihl]

I'm in the same boat Grumpa. I need at least 7 stations to form one piece of brass. (.14 Flea from 32 ACP) I have a lyman spar t or whatever it is and was excited that I'd only need to move the brass twice. Only to realize, my head only has 4 of the 5 holes threaded.
I'll have a redding T-7 someday. If I had 10 stations, then I'd be really happy. Add a decap into every head.

[dbosman]

There are a couple of Hollywood Seniors on that online auction site. Eight stations.

[GRUMPA]

Grumpa: you are a skilled machinist. I think you should buy a Dillon 1050 and set it up to do a variety of operations that you need to do to sell your brass. If you're going to be in business then your time is worth money and the more time you can save the better off you'll be in the long run. Also a machine like the 1050 can help you produce quality cases and ammo that is far beyond what is normally available out there with a minimum of effort and high rate of production.

For your .300blk cases you could start by chopping the case off to a rough length, then put the case in the 1050 and form it, size it, trim to final length, swage the primer pocket and poop out a done case everytime you pull the handle. This is the beauty of the Rotary Transfer Machine.

I'm sure you'll figure out something that works for you.

Randy

I would like to clarify something, I don't consider myself a machinist, more a precision grinder by trade. You put me in front of a mill and it looks like a big hunk of metal I would have to figure out, a lathe I can do some things with because I only made tooling for myself with them.

Most of the folks that sell 300BO brass use those types of machines and rig them to run automatically. There's a couple of things they seem to do that I don't.

I do rough cut the brass first thing actually, them I tumble them clean and remove the burrs at the same time (first cleaning process)

1) I can't do it.....I live on solar power and the system would require to much power to operate. Now those power trimmers for the Dillon (from what I've been told by more than 1 person) are slower than they once were.

2) I have had messages both here and on another site and folks say the same thing: "Why is your brass so much better than the other guys" Simple: I run mine differently, I don't do it or any other brass I do for the money, I do it for the enjoyment I get out of it and the person that gets what I do. I run all of the 300BO brass through a double sizing step that takes out the "spring back" from squeezing the new neck which keeps the gauge point dimension within .0015 on all of them. That and I keep that equipment in the house in a stable temperature room to keep the ram from either expanding or contracting to much and in my mind .002 is to much.

I can go on and on about that but what I have now gets the job done a lot cheaper than 1 of those units with all the bells and whistles attached to it. I have 1 person that does run his on a 1050 and likes mine better, go figure that 1 out.

What I use cost me roughly under $200 for everything I use, I even re-sharpen those cheap Harbor Freight saw blades and I can get just under 30K cuts before I throw it away.

So the way it is now do I really want to invest 2K into something that I can live without? Or am I happy just getting them out better but just slower?

[AlaskanGuy]

Well, after examining your work carefully, i have this to say.... If it aint broke, dont fix it sir... You are nearing perfection with what you do now, so dont mess with the process.

AG

[W.R.Buchanan]

grumpa: everyone has their own way of doing things, and if yours suits you, then it's all good.

After being a production machinist for so many years I tend to look at these types of jobs as turret lathe jobs.

Rotary Transfer Reloading Presses run exactly the same as a turret lathe runs. Any time I see a bunch of brass sitting on the floor I immediately start thinking of ways to load it all as fast as possible.

The kicker here is deciding on what rate of production fulfills your needs and is an amount of workload that you can tolerate.

If you're happy, I'm happy.:mrgreen:

Randy

[gunoil]

just buy a 1050,