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atom73
12-19-2013, 12:17 PM
We all knew it would happen, sorry if this has already been posted but Doe Run in MO (the last lead smelter in the US) is closing Dec 31, 2013. EPA regs choked it out. Remember Doe Run.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/18/end-line-for-lead-bullet-regulations-bans-force-switch-to-green-ammo/
Atom
cbrick
12-19-2013, 12:56 PM
91010

Thanks for the info but uh, . . . this is the 189th post started on this.

Rick
ShooterAZ
12-19-2013, 01:01 PM
Remember Doe Run
atom73
12-19-2013, 01:03 PM
See, and I gave the forum a quick once over and didnt see any postings on it (which I though was odd). I am not surprised that it's already been posted, in fact, I expect that it had but didnt see it. This article has been the first I've seen that was specifically addressing the closing of the last US smelter. If this is a redundant thread, Mods feel free to delete.
gkainz
12-19-2013, 01:05 PM
No worries, atom73 ... I know it takes a while for news to get to South Dakota some times ... lol ... I only say that as I grew up in Custer and spent the longest, coldest winter of my life at SDSU
atom73
12-19-2013, 01:10 PM
Hey! I live in Clear Lake! I love it up here, nice cold winters, plenty of room. Cold weather keeps the pests out, both insect and human ;)
bangerjim
12-19-2013, 01:11 PM
WE all know.......this has been posted M......A.......N......Y times!!!!!!!!

This was known by MOST of us waaaaaaaay back in 2010 when D R announced the action to come in 2013.

Doe Run will NOT change our vested interests in our hobby, as proved by many comments from commercial ammo manufacturers. They are not worried.....why should you be?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

If you are worried, go out and buy any and all lead at any price you can find right now. There are so many other sources of elemental lead that the secondary/tertiary sources we use will have no shortages to speak of. (just do NOT use car batteries for lead!!!)

And they are floating rumors they will build a new operation in MO.


Merry Christmas

banger
atom73
12-19-2013, 01:11 PM
Oh and by the way, there still is a small family smelter up and running in SD....
atom73
12-19-2013, 01:14 PM
I've got my stash, welcome to the forum Banger. I dont recall indicating that I was worried or hand wringing.
cbrick
12-19-2013, 01:23 PM
atom73, don't let it get you down, every new thread started on this has for some time now gotten similar or worse responses. Nothing personal.

Rick
atom73
12-19-2013, 01:40 PM
You're a good egg Rick, I've dealt with you before here on this forum. It's been a while since I have posted, I've been busy with building 'the compound' here in SD. Seems as if the mood has changed here a bit, a little less...gentlemanly. Nice to see you are still around though.
ShooterAZ
12-19-2013, 05:07 PM
atom73,

Please don't be offended. The topic has been brought up so many times that it has become the subject of many, many jokes. The mood really hasn't changed...I think a few of us might have cabin fever though. It's all good.
bhn22
12-19-2013, 05:24 PM
If you think the place is silly now, you should have been here a little over a week ago.

We are a silly group at times.
gkainz
12-19-2013, 05:39 PM
I hope my post wasn't perceived as being "less than gentlemanly"? If so, I extend my humble apology! I figured it was just some good ol' SoDak fun-poking :)
farmerjim
12-19-2013, 06:03 PM
See Doe Run
Run Doe Run
atom73
12-19-2013, 06:06 PM
No Gkainz, nothing to do with you. I looked a little further and found some other postings about the closing of Doe Run, same guy said the same thing to others that posted about it. I still think I'm gonna make a few Tshirts that say "Remember Doe Run" and give em out to buddies. Maybe the kids can wear em to school. Here in SD, it's still ok to talk about hunting and shooting in class.
zomby woof
12-19-2013, 06:20 PM
Breaking news!!
btroj
12-19-2013, 10:52 PM
The sky is falling! the sky is falling!
freebullet
12-19-2013, 11:15 PM
There is no way they can make every doe stop running. Merping'em only works so often.
SciFiJim
12-20-2013, 01:22 AM
Oh No! Doe Run is closing!


http://www.smileyvault.com/albums/userpics/10172/panic.gif (http://www.smileyvault.com/)
el34
12-20-2013, 01:36 AM
The OP innocently started the thread, I believe. I saw the FoxNews article yesterday, it talks of a movement to reduce/eliminate lead use in ammunition. And that several states are jumping on the green bandwagon. You can't help but wonder if the future will outlaw lead bullets, maybe including the homemade ones. It's more about the EPA vs lead than it is about Doe Run.

Oops, I said Doe Run. I hope the strong respect for freedom here will not be offended.
btroj
12-20-2013, 07:58 AM
The EPA is a far greater risk to shooting sports than Doe Run closing is. I could easily see this EPA wanting to shut down all lead bullet use. These morons will stop at nothing.

Doe Run is a symptom, not the disease.
Pb2au
12-20-2013, 08:11 AM
^. Yep. Look at the legislation passed recently in California (if I remember correctly).
concho
12-20-2013, 08:15 AM
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/12/18/end-line-for-lead-bullet-regulations-bans-force-switch-to-green-ammo/
el34
12-21-2013, 03:24 PM
The EPA is a far greater risk to shooting sports than Doe Run closing is. I could easily see this EPA wanting to shut down all lead bullet use. These morons will stop at nothing.

Doe Run is a symptom, not the disease.

Which gives validity to the overly-lambasted posts about Doe Run. Spotlighting a symptom is a good way to spotlight a disease. Then do something about the disease if the risk of ignoring it is too great.
btroj
12-21-2013, 05:40 PM
They aren't overly lambasted based on merit but rather because of sheer volume. When a single topic gets numerous new threads in a short period of time it grows tiresome.

Yep, Doe run, lead, and the EPA are the zombie topic
el34
12-21-2013, 07:59 PM
They aren't overly lambasted based on merit but rather because of sheer volume. When a single topic gets numerous new threads in a short period of time it grows tiresome.

That's one of those difficult situations, kinda like the way free speech with no harm intended requires that everyone is allowed regardless of anybody else's reaction. Posting about a worn out subject doesn't necessarily require lots of rehashed responses, it only requires civility. Nobody should be made guilty of innocently violating somebody else's personal microrule.
btroj
12-21-2013, 08:23 PM
I have no micro rule. I just don't see a need to rehash a topic because someone didn't pay attention to the days posts.

We might as well make Doe Run a sticky so we know that nobody will read it......
el34
12-22-2013, 01:28 AM
I have no micro rule. I just don't see a need to rehash a topic because someone didn't pay attention to the days posts.

We might as well make Doe Run a sticky so we know that nobody will read it......
I apologize btroj, I suck at expressing my thoughts. The microrule idea is when something that is basically innocent in nature crosses someone the wrong way due to that person's own intolerance of a given subject. And that the displeased person is justified in making unfriendly or insulting implications that the original post was somehow wrong (broke the microrule). If a freshman has a new thought or question and posts it and then is met with criticism from seniors it'll cause a small fear of doing it again and not knowing what's ok and what's not, outside of stated forum rules. Anyway, that's all I was trying to point out. But that's what we got moderators for.
btroj
12-22-2013, 01:24 PM
It isn't the question, it is the fact it was asked daily for an entire semester. After a few weeks even the freshman are wondering if their classmates are paying attention at all.

I think this topic came up 5 or 6 times in a single week, a few in the same day. It was a good topic, the first dozen times. Now it is just monotonous.

Like I said, a zombie topic.
el34
12-22-2013, 02:41 PM
I think this topic came up 5 or 6 times in a single week, a few in the same day. It was a good topic, the first dozen times. Now it is just monotonous.


Absolutely correct there. It's the reaction to it that matters.

Next month I will have been casting for a year. I'm a freshman but was seriously bitten by the bug. I haven't been here long enough to get tired of anything, I just read as much as I want then move on. A while back I picked up the realization that if I thought of something important to me during the day then logged in when I got home and immediately posted about it I might find out I "didn't search first" or "we're tired of this", which dents the sense of freedom to post.

All this is just my opinion, not to be taken too seriously [smilie=s:
dtknowles
12-22-2013, 04:00 PM
It isn't the question, it is the fact it was asked daily for an entire semester. After a few weeks even the freshman are wondering if their classmates are paying attention at all.

I think this topic came up 5 or 6 times in a single week, a few in the same day. It was a good topic, the first dozen times. Now it is just monotonous.

Like I said, a zombie topic.

Man, why do you keep tortureing yourself. Stay away from the zombie topic, do you really have to read every post to the fourm?

Tim
dtknowles
12-22-2013, 04:10 PM
..........A while back I picked up the realization that if I thought of something important to me during the day then logged in when I got home and immediately posted about it I might find out I "didn't search first" or "we're tired of this", which dents the sense of freedom to post.

All this is just my opinion, not to be taken too seriously [smilie=s:

Wait, do you think that people will form an impression of you and it might be negative if you ask questions that have been answered many times? Duh, yes, do the search first and not only here but around the web. I feel to many members just want to ask questions to build post count or to get a personel response instead of the answer that has already been provided. Feel free to post and ask whatever you want, I will feel free to respond or ignore and form whatever opinion I might wish. I think the dents in your sense of freedom to post is possibly your good sense trying to tell you something.

Tim
el34
12-22-2013, 04:46 PM
..., do the search first and not only here but around the web. I feel to many members just want to ask questions to build post count or to get a personel response instead of the answer that has already been provided. Feel free to post and ask whatever you want, I will feel free to respond or ignore and form whatever opinion I might wish. I think the dents in your sense of freedom to post is possibly your good sense trying to tell you something.

Tim

Got it! Maybe others will catch on too. Thanks Tim.
atom73
12-23-2013, 11:02 AM
As the op, I kinda figured either it had been posted before or not (pretty safe assumption). I also figured (this is where I was wrong) that IF it had been posted before, then those that had seen it would either say 'seen it' and move along or provide intelligent commentary as they saw fit. If I took the time to post 'zombie topic' on every ww sorting post or every black powder making post (the ones I follow most) then I wouldnt have time for a job. I am always incredulous at the intention and motivation of those who would take the time like they have on this thread to argue that this topic has been overly discussed. I recognize that I posted a topic that has been posted before, I also recognize that unless I am EPA chief there is little that can be done, I did not post this as a worriesome 'sky is falling' post, it was a referrence to a current event impacting our hobbies. I would like to get together and meet a lot of board members someday at like a jamboree or forum shoot, others not so much as they appear to be sort of a 'neighborhood association', overzealous in their opinion of how others should behave.
Atom...
SciFiJim
12-23-2013, 11:30 AM
Atom,

I need to apologize.

I did to you what I have castigated others for doing.

You are right.

Those that have seen this subject before and are not interested in discussing again should have just moved on to something else.

Please accept my apologies.

Jim
atom73
12-23-2013, 12:40 PM
Jim,
Thanks for saying that. I am not trolling for apologies, my self esteem could actually use some hits (it's way too high!). But the fact that you would consider saying that means that you are a stand up guy!
Mike
Shooter6br
12-23-2013, 12:40 PM
The EPA wants to ban fire hydrants that have lead in them........Isnt lead insoluable in water?
cbrick
12-23-2013, 01:27 PM
It's not the lead but rather lead oxide. There are those that believe it could have also been a part of the fall of the Roman Empire because of their lead water pipes and lead drinking mugs. They also sweetened their wine with lead. Yummy.

Rick
el34
12-23-2013, 07:12 PM
Atom,

I need to apologize.

I did to you what I have castigated others for doing.

You are right.

Those that have seen this subject before and are not interested in discussing again should have just moved on to something else.

Please accept my apologies.

Jim

Now there's an indicator of solid character. :drinks:
Well, except the castigating part- isn't that where you lop off someone's Brazils? :grin:
762 shooter
12-23-2013, 07:47 PM
Another sticky candidate !!!!!!!!!!

762
atom73
12-24-2013, 02:17 PM
Nyrstar facility in Clarksville TN is a zinc facility. Zinc and lead are alloyed together for many industrial uses so it's possible that it is a consumer of lead to produce Zn alloy but probably not a producer of lead alloy per se. Good find though. I know there is still a small family run smelter running in South Dakota, sort of a renegade operation ;)