45-70 with lee loader?

[BullRunBear]

I shoot 45-70 in an old Navy Arms rolling block. I've always full length resized the cases. Now that I have the Lee Loader bug I want to try one for the 45-70. I intend to get one for each rifle I have but this is the only straight walled rifle case I use.

Does the loader just neck size this caliber? That would be great: quick and saving the extra wear on the brass (more reloads).

Thanks for the help. Jeff

[smkummer]

Yep, that is all it does and it works great for brass that will be fired in the same gun only. You can take it to the range and do your own loading at the range. The first 45-70 trapdoor I shot was with only 3 cases and we shot it for about an hour with reloading every three shots. You can back out the sizing die on a full length die set so it just de caps or only slightly sizes also. The 45-70 is a tapered cases and this works also.

[Dave Bulla]

The only exception on the Lee kits is the one labeled as the "Unitized Lee Loader". It actually does full length size but I'm not sure if they were made in 45-70 or not. They don't come up very often and have not been made in quite a few years. Also, the only place it is marked "Unitized" is on the lid of the box and paperwork which is often lost from the old kits.

If you bought a new kit in the plastic box, it's a non issue and will neck size only. I suggest you go to Lee's website and look up handgun kits. Find one in 45 caliber then find the replacement parts for it so you can order a 45 caliber case mouth expander. If you plan to load cast, you will need it. Well, you could use other things around the house but for a nice uniform flare, you couldn't hardly make a flare tool for the little Lee will charge for theirs and it will probably be at your door in two days.

If it were me, I'd also order a spare 45 caliber decapping tool. I like to keep a spare handy after the day I was loading at the range and my decapper rolled off the bench, landed tip down on the concrete and snapped the pin off.

Just sayin', $h!t happens.

[BullRunBear]

Thanks. That's what I needed to know. This is a great group!

Any loader I get will be new. I rarely, if ever, see used rifle cartridge Lee Loaders around here. People just seem to hold on to them. And the mail order prices are a bargain for such an effective set of tools. Plus I can always use the regular dies as needed.

Jeff

[Dave Bulla]

One other thing to be aware of when loading the 45-70.

Brass from the Hornady Leverevolution ammo is about 1/16" shorter than standard brass and if loaded using normal brass data can generate dangerously high pressures if you don't back off on the load data.

It's still good brass and I use it a lot for reduced loads in the black powder velocity range.

[Texantothecore]

I shoot 45-70 in an old Navy Arms rolling block. I've always full length resized the cases. Now that I have the Lee Loader bug I want to try one for the 45-70. I intend to get one for each rifle I have but this is the only straight walled rifle case I use.

Does the loader just neck size this caliber? That would be great: quick and saving the extra wear on the brass (more reloads).

Thanks for the help. Jeff

I use only the Lee Loader for my 45-70 as it turns out the best ammo I have ever loaded. Incredibly accurate. The cases will last forever and if you carry powder and primers to the range you will not run out of ammo. Just reload the empty cases.

Although I have much larger equipment I use the Lee Loader exclusively as it is simply fun. It also gets a lot comment at the range and I never shoot alone anymore as there is always someone who is interested in this reloading system which does not require large shop tables to use.

The technique goes back to the Civil War and is well developed and it is very interesting to watch.
It has been a great experience.

[Green Frog]

I had done a fair amount of reloading when I found a Lee Loader in 45-70 for a friend who had a Trapdoor but had never reloaded. I gave him one quick lesson and he continued to use it as long as he owned the old TD. Piece of cake! ;)

Froggie

[Texantothecore]

I have been told by an older range officer that he has friends who bought their loaders in the 1950s and they are still using them. Very durable.

[725]

BullRunBear,
Dig around on this site for a link to one of our forum members, Junior1942. He wrote a neat article on the use of the Lee Loader and the .45-70. Fun and informative thing to read.
Welcome aboard.

[BullRunBear]

Dave, Thanks for the heads up about the Leverevolution brass. I hadn't heard that before. Fortunately, most of my brass is Starline. Thinking about it, all my brass probably predates Levrevolution. I might worry about range-found brass but never see any. The 45-70 shooters around here hold on to every spent case.

725, I tracked down that article and it is fun and informative.

Texan and the others, I appreciate the encouragement. My particular rifle likes 60 grs. Goex 2F under a lubed felt wad (homemade because I'm cheap) and a cast 405 gr. bullet. This is a relatively mild load and doesn't eat up the brass and I'm fanatical about cleaning all my black powder gear. Once in a while I load the same bullet with 10 or 11 grs of Unique. It's a soft load for small people and beginners who want to try a "buffalo" gun.

Come to think about it, the Lee Loader would make an excellent tool for teaching folks about hand loading.

Jeff

[BullRunBear]

Dave, Thanks for the heads up about the Leverevolution brass. I hadn't heard that before. Fortunately, most of my brass is Starline. Thinking about it, all my brass probably predates Levrevolution. I might worry about range-found brass but never see any. The 45-70 shooters around here hold on to every spent case.

725, I tracked down that article and it is fun and informative.

Texan and the others, I appreciate the encouragement. My particular rifle likes 60 grs. Goex 2F under a lubed felt wad (homemade because I'm cheap) and a cast 405 gr. bullet. This is a relatively mild load and doesn't eat up the brass and I'm fanatical about cleaning all my black powder gear. Once in a while I load the same bullet with 10 or 11 grs of Unique. It's a soft load for small people and beginners who want to try a "buffalo" gun.

Come to think about it, the Lee Loader would make an excellent tool for teaching folks about hand loading.

Jeff

[bstarling]

I used to reload with a Lee Loader for the exact same rifle. It had the big heavy octagon barrel. Loaded and shot a lot with that gun. Always used black and just poured the case full and then put the bullet in. Always shot very well. I still have the loader, but like a fool I sold the gun.

Bill

[mdi]

I think I'd try one first (all my Lee Loaders for straight walled cases full length size). I'd mark a few cases, magic marker the length of the case, then size in the Lee Loader to see if they full length or neck size only...

[W.R.Buchanan]

BullRunBear: A Lee Loader is the IDEAL way to tech someone how to reload ammunition. It breaks down each operation into it's simplest form. From there a person can advance in to other ways of doing each of the operations but in the end they are only faster, they don't produce ammo that is in any significant way, better.

If you look and the Wilson Loading Tools that Bench Rest shooters use to load their ammo you will see that they are nothing more than more expensive Lee Loaders.

Randy

[country gent]

In reality in the day of the rolling blocks sharps traapdoors and similar rifles the lee load all style loading tool and 310 type were the most popular and most used in the day. I cant see to many buffalo hunters wagons fitted out with lubrisizers and presses. The target shooters often loaded at the range. The Lee should be more than up to the task.

[Dframe]

The Lee works great for folks who are NOT in a hurry and are concerned ONLY for quality and NOT quantity. The only problem I've ever seen with it is the fact that it's LABOR INTENSIVE!
I discovered quickly that I didn't want to work THAT hard for a box of ammo. I sold mine over 40 years ago when I got my first press.

[BullRunBear]

Hi Dframe,
I don't mind the slowness of the Loader. I use faster means for handgun ammo but enjoy a slower, more deliberate pace for rifles. Shooting and reloading is relaxing for me. Probably why so much of my range time is with muzzleloaders. I treat my centerfire rifles, mostly old military surplus, as single shots. After decades of constant tight deadlines at work being able to take a relaxed but focused approach to the hobby is appealing. It's been one of the joys of retirement.

Of course, this just applies to me. I would be surprised if many others liked it.

Jeff

PS: I like your tag lines.

[Texantothecore]

Dave, Thanks for the heads up about the Leverevolution brass. I hadn't heard that before. Fortunately, most of my brass is Starline. Thinking about it, all my brass probably predates Levrevolution. I might worry about range-found brass but never see any. The 45-70 shooters around here hold on to every spent case.

725, I tracked down that article and it is fun and informative.

Texan and the others, I appreciate the encouragement. My particular rifle likes 60 grs. Goex 2F under a lubed felt wad (homemade because I'm cheap) and a cast 405 gr. bullet. This is a relatively mild load and doesn't eat up the brass and I'm fanatical about cleaning all my black pder gear. Once in a while I load the same bullet with 10 or 11 grs of Unique. It's a soft load for small people and beginners who want to try a "buffalo" gun.

Come to think about it, the Lee Loader would make an excellent tool for teaching folks about hand loading.

Jeff

I frequently teach people to reload with the Loader. Their usual reaction is "It can't be this easy. "

It also breaks down the belief that a lot of expensive equipment is required and benches needed on which to bolt large presses to reload. Just me, a Lee Loader and a small hammer, or a rock or a branch. That's it.

[nanuk]

my goal is to get a LeeLoader for every rifle I have

AND to get a LeeLoader for every boolit I will shoot, if they are differing sizes, so I can lap out the LeeLoader to make the seating as near perfect "inline" as I can.

eventually, one will follow me to moose camp, with a couple ingots and a mould/pot and I will cast my hunting slugs, and load them on the LeeLoader, and kill my moose with it!

Can't think of a better way to relax after a hard day fishing/hunting.


and like Mr. Buchanan said, similar to the big boys, and very cost effective.

[nanuk]

One other thing to be aware of when loading the 45-70.

Brass from the Hornady Leverevolution ammo is about 1/16" shorter than standard brass and if loaded using normal brass data can generate dangerously high pressures if you don't back off on the load data.

It's still good brass and I use it a lot for reduced loads in the black powder velocity range.


if you load it to the same COAL, you will not experience any pressure issues.

but you might have some issues in the throat from the extra jump.... try it and see.

[Dave Bulla]

if you load it to the same COAL, you will not experience any pressure issues.

but you might have some issues in the throat from the extra jump.... try it and see.

I know that you can load to the same COL, problem is, on rifles like my Marlin with a tube magazine, I need to seat the bullet to the canelure so I can get a proper crimp. If loading for a single shot, it's not an issue and you can make them to whatever length will fit your chamber. Also, seating the bullet out farther to match COL of standard ammo will NOT make the jump farther, it will be the same. Seating the bullets to the canelure in the short brass WILL result in a greater jump to the lands. I'm not sure where the ogive falls on the LE ammo compared to standard factory ammo but I can certainly say that the Hornady LE's are the most accurate ammo I've ever shot in my 45-70 to date. I just recently found a pound of LE powder and hope to try to duplicate the factory ammo at home. I don't think I could beat it, I hope to just match it. Last time I shot my 45-70 with LE's I put 3 shots in 1/2" (center to center) at 100 yards and was about as tickled as could be.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Dave: the seating depth adjustment on the Lee Loader should cover just about any length requirements you have.

One other tack to take in this quest for portability is a Lee Hand Press. This tool allows you to use normal reloading dies to load how ever you want.

Only slightly larger than the original Lee Loader, but much more versatile.

Just a thought.

Randy

[1989toddm]

One other thing to be aware of when loading the 45-70.

Brass from the Hornady Leverevolution ammo is about 1/16" shorter than standard brass and if loaded using normal brass data can generate dangerously high pressures if you don't back off on the load data.

It's still good brass and I use it a lot for reduced loads in the black powder velocity range.

Dave, if you would share..what is your BP load with Hornady brass? What grain bullet? I have been looking for a starting place and have not had much success. Also how much do you compress the powder?

[sthwestvictoria]

I don't load 45-70 however with loading 30-30 with the Lee loader and cast I have found that it is easier to prime, fill with powder, then lift the seating die off the cartridge, ease the cast bullet into the case mouth with fingers then slide the seating die over the bullet and seat. This ensures the seating die does not size down your cast projectile.

This is a fun write up about reloading cast with the Lee Loader:
http://www.castbullet.com/reload/campcast.htm