Want to get started in bullet swaging

[Adam10mm]

I have a RC press inbound in a little bit, will get the solid ram from RCBS. Most sources I've read say that only sub 30cal rifle (and most common handgun) bullets should be swaged on a reloading press. I was going to try swaging with the RC to get the hang of it before I plunk down a few hundred dollars for a dedicated swaging press. I'll start with some 7mm bullets. That 22LR into jackets kit looks neat but costs $600!

CH has some reasonable prices for dies that fit the RC's thread. Corbin seems to be the major player in swaging equipment. I'd like to get either their S press or that RCE's Sea Girt press. I mainly want to make .375 caliber 300-325gr VLD/ULD bullets. Will sell them too.

For those that swage, what do you swage and what do you recommend for me starting out. I could scrape together the $200 to get the RCE Sea Girt press.

http://www.rceco.com/images/sea_girt_press.jpg

[Bent Ramrod]

Freakshow,

Mine are almost all .22 caliber, and include Bahler, Corbin, Smith (SAS) and RCBS. I have a Hollywood set in .25 caliber that I haven't tried yet. The vast bulk of my experience has been with the Corbin set which irons .22 cases for jackets and has a mould for cores. I also use commercial jackets with this set.

If I recall, RCBS only made theirs in .22 and .25 caliber, even though they had made the A2 presses for swaging use as well as reloading. Their set, and the Hollywood, took the loose core and jacket and formed the bullet in one pass. The bullet looked like a regular commercial spitzer.

I'm unfamiliar with C-H's bullet swaging dies, assuming you mean offerings from the current C-H 4-D company. The old C-H company, Herter's and Lachmiller (among others) made some extremely simple and cheap dies for swaging lead cores into half-jacket pistol bullets in one pass. Typically, they were set up so the excess lead bled out the side of the die as the jacketed bullet was forming, necessitating a short jacket and a lot of unlubricated lead exposure, which promoted leading in some revolvers.

Herter's (at least) expanded this concept into rifle dies as well. I see these at gun shows for $10 or less (was given a 6mm die gratis last time I saw it) and they're worth about that. They do not make the kind of bullets people buy, with spitzer ogives; the die is a cylinder (diameter varies) with a simple rounded or conical punch for the nose of the bullet, which fits into a shell holder, and a flat punch for the base, which is in the die. These form the bullet in one pass from core and jacket and can be used in a regular loading press, although I would recommend the compound-leverage types for this application. On the rifle ones, and some of the Herter's pistol swage dies as well, the bleed was in the nose punch so I guess a full-length jacket could be used but you would wind up with a cylindrical bullet with a step at the nose and a hemisphere or conical point. I am going to stick my neck out and assume that most people who want to swage bullets probably don't want a product that looks like this, but rather want some version of a commercial bullet design. Especially given the cost of jackets these days. On the other hand, I guess they'd shoot to some degree of effectiveness.

Which of course brings us back to the Corbin die sets, which are pretty much the standard of the home bullet industry. These dies make "real bullets," starting with the basic target/varmint spitzer hollowpoint, with elaborations to soft-points, boat-tails and so on. They are set up on the three step assembly principle that Biehler and Astles and the bench-rest people determined was the best, in that the cut or cast lead cores are swaged to a constant volume for a constant weight, the cores are swaged into the jackets, which expands the assembly in diameter a little bit, and the jacket/core assembly is swaged into the point-forming die, which forms the ogive of the bullet, closes the hollow point and again expands the bullet a trifle. This allows the jacket to spring back over the lead core, holding it tight. Extra dies or punches for boat-tails, VLD shapes, soft points, etc., will add to the cost of this basic set. A good deal, in some cases.

Such dies are expensive, and always have been expensive, although Ted Smith, Corbin's predecessor, appeared to be trying to keep prices down. Over the years, though, a good set of the basic dies have pretty much approximated the cost of a good production rifle, so it's more of a commitment than a casting set, by a factor of five. There must be some real reason for this cost, as Smith was in business for at least 20 years and Corbin has been at it for 30, and even a reloading tool iconoclast like Richard Lee hasn't presumed to undercut the market with quality bullet dies at modest prices.

Many manufacturers in the old days offered rifle dies in any caliber up to 8mm- .338 set up for use in a loading press, although only Hollywood and (maybe) Hempstead went further up than that to .375, the largest caliber I've seen offered. Compound-leverage presses weren't very common back then so (I'm guessing here) it should be possible to make some number of bullets in any of these calibers using such equipment. Making a lot of them, for sale especially, might tire your arms some. Again, it was Biehler and Astles and Ted Smith who developed the specialized, high-leverage, bullet-only presses for swaging in the larger calibers. I think if I was going to sell the bullets, I'd opt for something like this right away. With pure lead cores, I haven't found .22 bullets to be much of a workout, but I could see forming points on larger and larger diameters getting pretty tiring.

Corbin offers a lot of tech support for the aspiring swager and bullet marketer; you would do well to download some of his literature and look it over. The making of jacketed bullets is really kind of fascinating, but I have yet to win a benchrest match with mine (still trying) and I can't imagine how the commercial outfits sell theirs so cheaply.

[Adam10mm]

Thanks for the great writeup. I appreciate it.

I've been spending two days on the Corbin site reading and learning about swaging. Interesting stuff.

Yes, CH is the CH4D company (my own shorthand).

I want to make 300-325gr low drag bullets for my future .375 H&H Magnum, to whichever rate of twist is suitable. I think a 350gr bullet will stabilize in the standard twist rate, so the sleeker. longer low drag bullets of lighter weight should stabilize, be it 315gr, 320gr, etc. I think Corbin has what I'm looking for. I want a rebated boat tail bullet with a low drag profile or standard low drag soft point (a little sleeker profile than the Winchester Power Point). Since this design doesn't exist I have to make my own if I want to shoot these. If others would shoot this design I would sell to them and make money.

I would use lead wire and commercial copper jackets for swaging.

Right now I'm entertaining the idea but not fully committed to make it happen. The Hornady 300gr BTSP is close to what I'm looking for and might just do the trick.

[floodgate]

45 nut:

45NUT!! VAS YOU DERE KEN???

It looks like it's about time to start a new Topic on swaging! I/m just getting into it, too. Let's start it with this excellent thread. Lyman used to, and both Corbins still do, make moulds for casting lead and alloy cores, so it does fit "CastBoolits" at least as well as some other topics.

floodgate

[45nut]

45 nut:

45NUT!! VAS YOU DERE KEN???

It looks like it's about time to start a new Topic on swaging! I/m just getting into it, too. Let's start it with this excellent thread. Lyman used to, and both Corbins still do, make moulds for casting lead and alloy cores, so it does fit "CastBoolits" at least as well as some other topics.

floodgate

New forum is done, I did move a few threads here but notify me as you spot others that would fit better in here.

[dromia]

Brilliant! :-D

I'm just about to spring for a Walnut Hill press so this is just what I need, it'll stop me filling up Buckshot's mailbox. [smilie=1:

Can we get an "I Swage Mine" smilie to go with the forum.:mrgreen:

[Adam10mm]

Thanks for moving this. I didn't know there was a swaging forum. Excellent.

[Bent Ramrod]

I'd swear there wasn't as of last night but things happen fast around here!

[Adam10mm]

Looks like I'm going to try a setup from RCE, LLC. Seems priced to my liking. I'll give it a whirl.