.44 Mag 300gr region

[wonderwolf]

I have a 310Gr Lee GC mold as well as the healthier part of a large box of Full gas checked Rainier 305gr flat points left. I shoot Smiths with varying length barrels and I have noticed that NON of them like bullets weighing over 265gr at any speeds. So I have deemed that it is a short range (under 50yards) bullet. I load with Unique and 2400 and little else. What kind of loads do you use and what kind of results do you get?

I have no desire to use these for long range thats what the 250 Keith is for. I only want a good thumper load (somewhat accurate) in that bullet weight to see what can be done with it. Books don't offer much and as much as I dislike GC bullets this is one I can't seem to avoid. Not sure if it would be worth while to have the mold modified or not. :Fire:

I've tried 16.5gr of 2400 as well as 15.5gr and 7gr of unique as well...Did not chrono any of these

Also consider this a bonus Q...I can't seem to find this doing a quick search but what was Keith's load with 2400 and the 429421? wasn't it 21gr?

[MtGun44]

Elmer reported 22 grains of 2400, but this was in early cases with more
capacity than current, and the concensus is that new 2400 is a bit
different than his 2400, so . . . . I use 20.0 of new 2400 in Starline
cases and get about 1400 fps from a 6.5" Powerport 629 (former Mountain
Gun 4") with a 429421 cast pretty soft, like 8 BHN up to sometimes
11 BHN. Zero leading, 2" at 50 yds from the bench. Size to fit your
cyl throats (front end of the cyl) or throat +.001".

Another super accurate load in nearly every 44 mag is 10.0 Unique under
the same bullet. :Fire:

Do not use magnum primers with Unique or 2400, they cause fliers.

IMHO 300 grainers kick a lot more and this side of a buffalo or eland, I can't
see why you'd need more than the 429421. It's going to exit, so why do
you need more wt? :-D

Bill

[wonderwolf]

The 10.0gr of unique is my standard load, I only use CCI 300's never felt the need for 350's and I do remember know that case capacity is a issue with the 300's and 2400 I wonder what the water grain capacity dif is between 1960's brass and todays brass.

Book says 33.94 gr water

[MtGun44]

A couple of pix.

Not always this good, but this happens frequently.

Bill

[MtGun44]

CCI350s help with H110/W296. I find them detrimental with
Unique and 2400. Unnecessary with H4227 or IMR4227.

Another good load is 24.0 H4227 or IMR4227 under the 429421 or
the RCBS 250 K, a near copy of the 429421, and a quality mold.

Bill

[MtGun44]

Actually, the brass in question was more like 50s brass.

Bill

[Lloyd Smale]

used to load 300s in the smiths with 19 grains of 110 and a fed mag primer. It shot well but anymore i mostly use loads that push 250s to 1100 fps max in the smiths. Im sure theyd take alot more but my hand and the smith grip frames just to match well for heavy loads. If im gong to shoot heavies in a 44 its usually in a ruger. I did shoot a smith loose back in my old days of running everything at the redline. Cant see a use in doing it anymore as a 250 at 1100 will kill deer and bear just as well as the 300s at 1200 will. Ive killed animals as big as 800 lbs with 250s at 1100. Dont get me wrong i shoot and hunt with bigger bullets but would never be one that would say its absoulutely nessisary.

[dubber123]

I have gotten very good accuracy with the heavies in my 2 S&W's, including the Lee bullet you ask about. I think you will be best served by a max charge of H-110/296. I have never gotten a heavy bullet to shoot well at anything resembling slow or even midrange loads. The thing that stopped me in the Smiths was bullet pull with Lees tiny crimp groove on that bullet. That being said, I now shoot mostly 250 grain bullets. I love both my 629's and want to keep them around. I still carry it with the heavy bullets during bear season.

[44man]

Dubber is right, the S&W loves heavy boolits for accuracy but they need to be shot faster. I would not make them a steady diet in the Smith though. For normal shooting the 250 to 265 gr boolits are best.

[wonderwolf]

Maybe thats why I was having trouble with them. The lee 310 does not look like much of a bullet. Just a squaty chunk of lead. I'll try and get some H110 or other such powder to try for these. I might load up more of the loads I WAS shooting and chrono them see where I'm at

[dubber123]

Maybe thats why I was having trouble with them. The lee 310 does not look like much of a bullet. Just a squaty chunk of lead. I'll try and get some H110 or other such powder to try for these. I might load up more of the loads I WAS shooting and chrono them see where I'm at

I kinda like the looks of them! I'd like it alot better with a deeper crimp groove though. A hot load of H-110 will shoot around 1" at 25 yards out of the 2 Smiths, and under an inch at 50 yards out of my 10" Contender. I'm betting at a healthy speed, they hit hard too.

[Larry Gibson]

Disaggree with MtGun44 about the "concensus" on Alliant's new 2400 being "different" from old Hercules 2400. Alliant says it hasn't changed anything in 2400 and side by side tests demonstrate no difference other than the ususal lot to lot variation. Would also point out that Elmer's .44 magnum cases were also of the same case capacity as ours today; it was the 44 Special caces that had more capacity. These were the balloon head cases and there's never been any .44 magnums made with them.

I do have to whole heartily agree with MtGun44 on the 429421 and no need for anything heavier. I have a Lyman 429244 that will weight at 270 gr (GC'd and lubed) and that is about as heavy as I've found a need for. I really didn't want it that heavy (wanted the GC for rifle loads) just the way it came.

Larry Gibson

[MtGun44]

Maybe the 'concensus' is really a polite way of selling the idea that
Elmer's loads were a few grains too hot. :-D I know the .44 special
had the balloon head cases, but I had been told that the early 44 mag cases,
while solid head, were a bit lower in capacity than current ones. Sounds
like another old wives tale.

I have always wondered why 2400 would change and Unique and Bullseye
are exactly the same 100+ yrs later. Since I never loaded 2400 in the
40s, I have just been believing what I read - which can be wrong at
times.

Bill

[IcerUSA]

Been loading for the RCBS 44-300-K with 296 , 110 , and get this one , Lil-Gun , and what is intriging to me is the 296 load is near max and 110 and Lil-Gun are at the start loads and all 3 shoot POA at 25 yds out of my SBH Hunter with a 7 1/2" barrel and I don't find the recoil much harder than the 240 gr RNFP RCBS boolits I have shot in it . FWIW

Keith

[Shuz]

Many years ago the "rumor" that Alliant changed the burning rate of 2400 got started somehow. So...I figgered, Why not call them and ask? I did and I was told by Alliant's technician, that the burning rate HAS NOT CHANGED. I reported this conversation on the old "Shooters" site then. However, the rumor still persists. I agree, that 22g of 2400 is prolly a little on the stout side, and I think that the loading manual perveyors are just being litigious conscious.

[wonderwolf]

The load I kept in my notebook for the Lee 310gr is 7.0 Gr of unique with a CCI 300. I didn't write anything else so the load must not have impressed me.

The 310gr mold I have needs worked on. Something is not lined up right and i'm getting a 25% rejection rate at best.

[dubber123]

The load I kept in my notebook for the Lee 310gr is 7.0 Gr of unique with a CCI 300. I didn't write anything else so the load must not have impressed me.

The 310gr mold I have needs worked on. Something is not lined up right and i'm getting a 25% rejection rate at best.

8 grains of Unique averaged 888 fps., out of my 4" S&W Mountain Gun, and shot OK. 17.5-18 grains of H-110 shot much better, velocity was just under 1,100fps. in the 4".

[wonderwolf]

Did you try pushing the unique load any heavier? Kinda funny that thats the same powder weight for the light wadcutters as well

[dubber123]

Did you try pushing the unique load any heavier? Kinda funny that thats the same powder weight for the light wadcutters as well

I looked back through my notes, and it looks like 8 grains was as high as I went with Unique. You're right, 8 grains works very well for me with the 429421 also, it's more accurate than the heavies at this speed. Bumping up the velocity on the 310 gr. Lee shrunk groups quite a bit.

[TCLouis]

Try 18.5 under the Lee boolit in top crimp groove.

BEST groups I have ever produced out of my Ruger at 50 yards.

If you have some WC680 it may surprise you also.

WLP primers in every thing I load.