Black powder .308?

[JuliettDeltaGolf]

I know this is crazy, but I love Black Powder. What else can I say...

I'm going to rebarrel my k-98k Mauser in .308. The barrel is trashed, and I have hundreds upon hundreds of rounds of .308 ammo sitting around, and nothing to shoot it in. I need a decent deer rifle, so...

Anyway, once I get to the point that I need to start reloading for the .308, I'd like to try black powder. Yes, I know... it's not even a BP cartridge. I still want to try it, IF I can get a cast boolit (I don't want to fool with gas checks, either) that hauls enough lube. Looks like the case, brim-full, holds about 54-55 grs. FFFg by volume. Don't know what charge I would wind up with. Does anyone here have any experience trying BP in .308 successfully? Molds?

[chill45100]

This sounds like a modern version of a .30-40 Kraig. A 308 is a bit less slender but it should be interesting.
Mostly I want to follow the results.

[mikeym1a]

The primary drawback is the residue in the bore. Residue buildup in the throat might interfere with chambering after several rounds. Paul Matthews talks about that in his book 'The Paper Jacket'. He used a duplex load, primarily BP, but with a certain amount of smokeless. The thought being that the progressive burning powder would eliminate the solids left in the bore. I would have to do some research to see if I could find a comparable load for that round. Also, you could use pure lead and paper patch the boolit. I'm sure others more knowledgeable will add on. :???:

[Nobade]

Using the RCBS 150gr. cowboy bullet, a felt wad under the bullet, and a duplex load of IMR4227 + Fg I made it work tolerably well. Of course it's easy to beat with a little 2400 and a lot less hassle, but it can be done.

-Nobade

[BruceB]

[QUOTE=chill45100;2498575] "This sounds like a modern version of a .30-40 Kraig. "

The .30-40 *KRAG* (not "Kraig") is/was our first general-issue SMOKELESS-powder service cartridge. Even today, many full-power Krag loads with modern smokeless powders will run in the neighborhood of 40 grains. Similarly, full-power loads for the .30-30 will often be very close to 30 grains.

These early smokeless cartridges were named in the same manner as the soon-to-be obsolescent black-powder rounds..... caliber and powder charge, along with bullet weight in most of the blackpowder examples.

Fouling will certainly be the problem, especially in the relatively small bore diameter of the .308. I don't see much hope in this project.

[longbow]

I would expect performance to be similar to the original BP loading for .303 British. I believe that .303 British has slightly larger case capacity but pretty close.

The .303 used a 215 gr. cupronickle jackets bullet over 70 grs. of compressed BP IIRC. I suspect that the jacketed bullet tended to scrape fouling out where a cast boolit would not. Also, the .303 allows for long heavy boolits which are better with BP. .308's tend to have shorter throats so limit boolit weight without lead sticking down past the neck which cuts into powder room.

It should work fine but you will likely have limited shooting before it fouls out and has to be cleaned. Shouldn't be a problem for hunting though where only a few shots are likely to be fired.

I would suggest the heaviest boolit that will chamber. 180 to 200 gr. boolits should fit and chamber.

Just my thoughts.

Longbow

[bob208]

many years ago I loaded .30-06 with 2f black to shoot in a low number 03. I used the 311299 bullet sized to 309 with a gascheck. it shot well after I set the sights.

[Gray Fox]

It seems to me that I read an article by Mike Venturino, or someone else who has shot a lot of BP cartridge guns that described excessive carbon build up in the inside of the cases in the shoulder to neck area of sharp shouldered cartridges. Straight walled or slightly tapered cases allow us to use nylon bore brushes of the appropriate size to scrub out the cases during the case cleaning process. I know some folks say this isn't necessary, but I have often found it is needed, depending upon the length of the boolit in the case and the type of lube used. So, it might be a consideration with this .308 project. GF

[Bullshop Junior]

It seems to me that I read an article by Mike Venturino, or someone else who has shot a lot of BP cartridge guns that described excessive carbon build up in the inside of the cases in the shoulder to neck area of sharp shouldered cartridges. Straight walled or slightly tapered cases allow us to use nylon bore brushes of the appropriate size to scrub out the cases during the case cleaning process. I know some folks say this isn't necessary, but I have often found it is needed, depending upon the length of the boolit in the case and the type of lube used. So, it might be a consideration with this .308 project. GF

The easiest way to clean cases shot with black in my experiance, and it works exceptionaly well with bottleneck cases, is to punch out the primer and drop them in a jug of hot soapy water. Shake them around, let them sit for a few mins, shake vigorasly again, drain, and then blow threw the flash hole with a air compresser, preferably one that blows pretty fast.

[JuliettDeltaGolf]

Interesting, and I'm leaning toward scrapping the idee... but I die hard. :mrgreen: When I rebarrel the gun, I'm going to do so with the help of my gunsmith neighbor. He's the one with the machinery. :D I wonder if we can ream a chamber/throat that would be more suited to BP... suggestions?

[Nobade]

458 Win Mag if you wanted to mod the bolt and feed rails. That works fine with BP, especially if you get a custom reamer with a better BP type throat in it. Plus it would still shoot smokeless just fine. You can call it the 45X2 1/2 belted express when it's loaded with BP.

-Nobade

[Texantothecore]

Let's try something different. Assuming 15 grns of bp with a 312 ball in the front end, what would y'all use for filler?