Unique Substitue??

[Corvette]

First off, if this question has been answered somewhere else, I appologize. I use alot of Unique, but Im starting to run low, and its all sold out around here. I've been looking for a substitute, but can't seem to find anything. I've done a couple searches on here and have found out about powders that are close to Unique, but I'm looking for powders that are exactly the same thing. I don't really like the idea of having 3 or 4 types of pistol powder around, I use Unique in 38spl & 357, and TiteGroup in 32 S&W Long & 45acp/AR. I'm kinda anal that way! From what I understand WW231 -IS- HP38 and WW296 -IS- HP110, so are there any powders out there that are Unique just with a different name??

Thanks
Vette

[jmort]

Universal Clays is very close

[Corvette]

Who makes it? And would I be able to use my Unique load data?

[jmort]

Hodgdon and nothing will be exact swap. Most loads I see are about 3 grains heavier, but you need good data.

[Wheelgun]

While I've never personally, a very good friend does, and loves it. Says it runs through his Lee measure much better than Unique.

[fryboy]

there's 3 clays in the clays line , in appox order of burning speed

clays , most akin to perhaps red dot
international, most akin to ye olde ww superlite ,umm kind of kin to super target etc
universal , most akin to unique


most of the "dot" powders will work in what you list ,some a lil better than others ,there's tons of data for red dot,promo is supposed to load like red dot and is often available in 8 # jugs for reasonable ,the monkey wrench in the works is the 357 mag , of course a slightly compressed load of black powder would also work as a universal powder , again,not optimum but ....
i've seen a few jugs of unique come and go at various online supply places , one has to watch and be ready to commit when it's there or some one else assuredly will
data of course is different for all of them you wont find a crossover per say , my personal opinion is that universal is cleaner than ye olde "flammable dirt' that was unique and is cleaner than the new improved"cleaner" unique , ummm i also prefer unique :P

[btroj]

How can you substitute for something that is Unique?

With that out of the way look at AA5.

[jmort]

Here is an example for .38 special

158 Cast #358665 (Linotype) Alliant Unique 4.0 791
Remarks: sugg. start load; 1.445" OAL; 13,100 cup
158 Cast #358665 (Linotype) Alliant Unique 4.5 871
Remarks: max load; 1.445" OAL; 16,000 cup
158 Cast #358665 (Linotype) Hodgdon Universal 4.2 760
Remarks: sugg. start load; 1.445" OAL; 12,500 cup
158 Cast #358665 (Linotype) Hodgdon Universal 4.7 867
Remarks: max load; 1.445" OAL; 15,800 cup

[fecmech]

Well not exactly. But if you can find Herco (Uniques slower brother) whatever powder measure settings you were using with Unique in your .38/.357 can be used with Herco to give identical velocities. Your measure will throw slightly more Herco at the Unique setting but being slower it will give very similar velocity.

[runfiverun]

aa#5 is right in there and meters like water, universal is super close too.
herco is right behind unique in burn rate and usually takes about 1/2 to 1 grain more for the same pressures and velocity.
it meters a bit better though.

I turned to unique a while back because of availability and it's versatility then went and stocked up, I bought 8 more pounds on Monday and think I'm set for life now.
as soon as I burn up all the odds and ends of 231,titegroup,700-x etc, i'll switch everything over to the loads I developed with unique long ago.

[jmort]

Here is burn rate chart, and you see that Unique is 35 and Universal is 36

http://www.reloadbench.com/burn.html

[OBIII]

No such animal. Unique Uber Alles!

OB

[KYCaster]

The really unique thing about Unique is the fact that it is VERY consistent across the entire range of it's useful applications. For each additional increment of powder charge you will get a very predictable increase in pressure and velocity...right up to the point where you start having pressure problems. I've found this true over a wide range of cartridges, bullet weights, case capacities and velocity levels.

I've also found that for moderate and mid-range loads, Hodgden Universal can often be substituted grain for grain for Unique.

For start loads and especially for loads approaching max, Universal is not nearly as predictable as Unique and Universal can get a bit squirrely when you get to the top of its useful pressure range.

Bottom line is....use a little common sense and you can use Universal instead of Unique in most of your loads.

Jerry

[Corvette]

Ok thanks a lot. All the info is greatly appreciated.

[LeftyDon]

I was going to say Herco or Green Dot would be close, but there's no exact replacements. Plus 2400 would be a good powder to buy if you find some on the shelf too. But Unique is unique.

[Outpost75]

My experience has been that IMR PB works well in applications in which you would use Unique, in similar charge weights, but is has a finer particle size which meters well in the Dillon machines. It is single-based, porous flake, which is easily ignited and it tolerates airspace in the case well. You can substitute it on a weight-for-weight basis using Unique data and not get into any trouble, although it is a bit more bulky, which is an advantage.

I have loaded lots of it in .38 Special and .45 ACP for target work and it performs well.

I have also used it for reduced, low velocity and subsonic, plainbased, cast bullet rifle loads in the .45-70 trapdoor and .375 H&H where it performed well using the same weight of charges as listed for Unique. It ignites easily, burns completely, gives uniform velocities and accuracy is wonderful.

SR7625 has similar characteristics and particle size, but is slightly faster burning, in handgun cases such as .38 Special or .45 ACP for wadcutter target loads you can use the same weight of charge as for W231, but the powder is more bulky, being a single-based flake shotgun powder used for the same purposes as WST.

As the others have said, there is no exact replacement for Unique, but there are acceptable substitutes which give good results in prudently developed loads. I have come to prefer WST, 7625 or PB over Unique because of their smaller particle sizes which are better suited to production machine loading.

[smkummer]

outpost75 beat me to the punch on SR7625. I found some low pressure data to use it with a Damascus barreled shotgun but noticed its burn rate is really close to unique.

[smlekid]

there's 3 clays in the clays line , in appox order of burning speed

clays , most akin to perhaps red dot
international, most akin to ye olde ww superlite ,umm kind of kin to super target etc
universal , most akin to unique


most of the "dot" powders will work in what you list ,some a lil better than others ,there's tons of data for red dot,promo is supposed to load like red dot and is often available in 8 # jugs for reasonable ,the monkey wrench in the works is the 357 mag , of course a slightly compressed load of black powder would also work as a universal powder , again,not optimum but ....
i've seen a few jugs of unique come and go at various online supply places , one has to watch and be ready to commit when it's there or some one else assuredly will
data of course is different for all of them you wont find a crossover per say , my personal opinion is that universal is cleaner than ye olde "flammable dirt' that was unique and is cleaner than the new improved"cleaner" unique , ummm i also prefer unique :P

Please take this as a interesting point and not load swapping data
When the Clays series of powders were released in Australia the first loading manuals told us they were modelled on Allaint powders
Clays (AS30 here) was based on red dot and it was stated in the manual that where data was unavailable you could use RedDot data
International (AS50N) was based on GreenDot again where data was not shown you could use GreenDot data
Universal (AP70) was based on Unique and it to said to use data for Unique
Notice the slightly different naming of AS50N there was an AS50 that predates the clays series it was single base where the clays series is double base
in Australia at the time I would say that 90% of reloaders were using Winchester Compression formed cases and components there wasn't much else around for reloading nobody ever really tried to use much else

[bhn22]

Only some of the Winchester & Hodgdon powders play the name game, Alliant doesn't buy their pistol powders elsewhere and slap their name on it. There is no other version of Unique, and many have already have said. There are man, many suitable powders out there. My guy in Grand Island Nebraska has some Unique the last I knew. He's likely to be at the Millard, NE gun show next week if you feel like making a roadtrip. PM me if you want his phone number. I don't know if he'll ship to Kansas because of UPS's stupid hazmat charges.

[.22-10-45]

Unique has a very interesting history..see Laflandandrand.com web site. The new smokeless shotgun powder Infallible came out in 1890..some insist this powder was identical to the later Unique..brought out when L&R combined with Hercules Powder Co. Bullseye powder was introduced in 1898..some say it was made from screenings--or floor sweepings of Infallible/Unique powder. Later, both powders were manufactured under the Hercules name. One interesting fact is that Unique and Bullseye are identical in composition..the faster burning rate of Bullseye is due to the smaller grain size...exactly the same method used to control burning of black powders! Could it be that in these early stages of smokeless powder manufacture they were using the same standards that had been used for centuries in the manufacture of black?

[.22-10-45]

Just examined some Unique & Bullseye I had bought in early 1970's..tall round cardboard containers..under magnification they both look the same..same crinkly surface & color..only B'eye smaller of course.

[LeftyDon]

A fellow posted that Bruno Shooters has powder. I checked and they have 8 lb jugs of Unique at this time.

[r6487]

look at the burn rate chart and see what is close, either above or below and what is available that you can acquire.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?24023-burning-rate-chart

[GabbyM]

Alliant 20/28 is almost a direct by weight replacement for Unique in hand gun loads. It is smaller flake so will be more dense.
Which can be a good thing is small cases like 9x19mm.

I like H-Universal in 38 Special. Not a direct replacement but you may go to it then stay there. Big problem with the 20-28 is you are wildcatting sort of speak as there is no data. I ran several pounds of it through 9mm last couple years and it did load grain for grain with Unique. But in other cartridges it may work different.

[fecmech]

In regards to 20/28 it is just a hair faster than Unique in the .38/.357 IME. For any given Unique load with 158 gr bullets it took .3-.4 less grains of 20/28 for the same velocities.

[WALLNUTT]

I sub 20/28 by weight in 44spl meters better burns cleaner

[DrCaveman]

I tried some sr4756 a little while back, and it has replaced my "unique" loads in a few calibers. Takes an extra grain or two to reach unique velocities but tops out a little higher i think.

Ive liked it in 38 spl, 45-70, and 460 mag, in load efforts where i had previously been using unique

[GabbyM]

I sub 20/28 by weight in 44spl meters better burns cleaner

Yes but I never did see any "more" clean like Alliant claims. But then they are claiming that in there shotgun loads.
Main reason I used 20/28 was a few years ago I couldn't get any Unique. Still hard. With the 9x19mm the difference in case size between brands makes a far greater pressure deviation that the difference between Unique and 20/28. My all time favorite 9mm powder is still AA #5. Don't have any but wish I'd of just stayed with it. H Universal is my favorite 38 Special so I'll probably just get a barrel of that some day.

[bangerjim]

If you look at all the load data out there, TightGroup seems to be universal....even more than Unique. And it seems to be somewhat cleaner. I have found Unique to be very dirty, even at full loads.

Every cal I load (5 of 'em) has published TG data for all the weights I cast. And I found 8# at a smookin deal.

I have several other powders in the stores and will gradually use them up like runfiverun is doing.

But today...............burn anything you can get yer hands on!

banger

[35 Whelen]

First off, if this question has been answered somewhere else, I appologize. I use alot of Unique, but Im starting to run low, and its all sold out around here. I've been looking for a substitute, but can't seem to find anything. I've done a couple searches on here and have found out about powders that are close to Unique, but I'm looking for powders that are exactly the same thing. I don't really like the idea of having 3 or 4 types of pistol powder around, I use Unique in 38spl & 357, and TiteGroup in 32 S&W Long & 45acp/AR. I'm kinda anal that way! From what I understand WW231 -IS- HP38 and WW296 -IS- HP110, so are there any powders out there that are Unique just with a different name??

Thanks
Vette

I did some direct comparison of Unique to AL 20/28 in this post (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?195149-Alternatives-to-quot-Standard-quot-Pistol-Powders) and found them to be practically a direct interchange in my .44 Special and with the one load I tried in my 45 ACP. That said, 20/28 burned MUCH faster in my 45 Colt.

Since that little test, 20/28 has all but replaced Unique for use in my .44 Specials and I have used probably 3 lbs. of my 4 lb. keg with no problems at all.

35W

[Shiloh]

AA#5 is close.

Shiloh