Colt Model 1917 Army

[hpdrifter]

My wife had been telling me for a couple years that her mother had a Colt 45 that was her husbands(my wifes dad) that she was going to give her/me. I've been kinda anxious and expecting a 1911. Finally she went to visit this spring and brought it home; a nice old 1917 Army.

Pretty good shape, not a collectable, I don't think, but nice especially for a freebie.

I wouldn't stay cocked in single action, the sear/hammer was worn. I put it up, and didn't even think about trying to fire it. I didn't have any moon magazines :kidding: and didn't wanna fight getting the brass out.

I got Handloader's October issue and they were taughting a Turnbull restoration and I got the wants......to shoot it, not have it refurbished.

So, I tore it apart, cleaned all the innards of probably 70 or so years of crud. Wasn't really too bad. Reprofiled the sear and the hammer, and finally got about 2.5 lbs of trigger pull in single action. Would prefer just a tad more, but at least it'll stay cocked now, even with a few bumps.

What I was wondering and wanting some input on; I have some 200 grain semiwad cutters loaded with 5.8 grains of Unique. It should be the lower end of the power scale for 45 acp with the 200. It shoots rather softly in my XDs and Ruger P97, or at least it seams so.

I'm kinda jumpy around older firearms. I've checked under a magnifying glass for any cracks or indications of stess and can't really se anything. It lockes up rather well, just a bit of cylinder shake, not much. Cylinder gap is about .008-.009.

Do you think it'll be safe to shoot this thing?

[Outpost75]

Sights are probably regulated for the old original hardball, 230-gr. FMJ at 810 fps, vs 855+/-30 for modern stuff.

The 200 SWCs will most probably shoot low, but try them unsized with your 5.8 of Unique or equivalent 4.5 of Bullseye or 5.2 of W231. Cylinder throats on my old Colt .45 and S&W Hand Ejector are. 455", I use RCBS 45-230 CM with 4.5 Bullseye in ACP cases, shoots to sights at 25 yards, same as Peters Ctg. Co. 18 ball ammo Grandpa kept with the wheelgun.

88175

Enjoy your heirloom!

[hpdrifter]

Outpost, I've been so busy worrying about the mechanics, I totally forgot about sizing.

You're right, I just checked my boolits and the throats kinda swallow them. The barrel "seems" tight"......but.

[bob208]

shoot it just don't try to make a magnum out of it . I have a s&w of the same model it likes the 225-230 grain bullets. you can get some auto rim brass and load semi wad cutters with a crimp.

as far as lock up. the old colts lock up tight when the trigger is pulled. the hand pushes the cylinder against the stop.

[Larry Gibson]

I'd also shoot it. I have shot numerous of the Colts and S&W M1917s over the years and they are generally fine shooters. I use my standard 190 - 205 gr SWC over 5 gr Bullseye load. The sights are regulated to put the 230 ball bullet into center of 6" bullet at 25 yards. The 190 - 205 gr load most often hits very close to point of aim at 25 yards......close enough for tin cans, dirt clods, pine cones etc.

Try the Unique loads but they are very light as you say.
Larry Gibson

[MtGun44]

Mine does about "OK" with hardball, fair to poor with .451 diam anything.
As I went up in diam, I couldn't chamber 455423 oversized custom clones
sized to .456, which is the throat diam, but it will chamber and fire .455s.

These shoot pretty well, have only tested at 12 yds so far and was getting
about 1-1.5" groups, so expect around double at 25 yds which beats the
8-12" that .451 H&G 68 (200 SWC commercial hard cast) will do.

Keith recommended his 454423 over 7.5 gr of Unique !!!!! I DO NOT
recommend this!!! OTOH, with my 1937 S&W Brazilian .45ACP, as I
moved from 5 gr to 5.5 to 6 to 6.5 and finally (gulp) one group EVER
with 7.0 gr, the groups moved from 6" left of POA and 4" diam to
1.5" left of POA and about 2.5" at 25 yds, so once again, Elmer knows
what he is talking about - if the gun doesn't blow!

Bill

[hpdrifter]

Thanks for the info guys. Shot it today at 7 and 15 yards, so far!!!!

Like a few have stated, was just a tad low. Put the front sight just a tick above the rear, and it was spot on, at least as far as my old eyes could tell. After 30 rounds haven't seen any signes of leading.

Shoots real nice. Probably up the Unique a half grain or so and see what that's like.

[country gent]

If you dont want to use moon clips There is always the 45auto rim cases if you can find them. a 45 auto with a thick rimm to make up the headspace and allow extration. They work pretty well. It may have seen more storage than shooting over its entire life span so far, Its a fine old revolver youll have to remedy that issue.

[ddixie884]

I shoot a lot of 6gr Power Pistol under a 255gr swcbb machine cast commercial bullet. I load these either crimped in the groove in Auto Rim cases, or taper drimped at the groove in auto cases so they won't fit in a magazine. They shoot pretty much to point of aim in my '17 colts, even the one with the 2 1/2 inch barrel.

[dek]

Starline Brass makes .45 auto rim cases.

[smkummer]

I had to bend the front sight on my mint condition 1917 Colt to adjust a windage issue but now its right on with 230 cast lead and 4.5 grs. 700X. I don't mind using a case that falls out for a tool to extract cases that are somewhat stuck, it works for me. For a serious range day with the 1917 revolver, I take out the 2 boxes of 45 auto rim that are loaded with the same 4.5 grains 700x and the results are the same.

[Char-Gar]

The Colt and Smith and Wesson DA sixguns in 45 ACP are some of my favorites and here are a few observations after many years of experience with them;

1. The old Keith loads of 7.5/Unique/452423 is a crackerjack load turning in 950 to 1,050 fps (depending on barrel length) and is just fine in any post-war Smith and Wesson. But DO NOT shoot this load in any pre-war Smith or Colt, DO NOT! You are looking for a damaged revolver if you fire more than a few rounds.

2. 45 ACP ball ammo will produce minute of enemy accuracy, but won't yield the sixguns accuracy potential.

3. A good cast bullet in the 200 to 240 grains range and sized .454-.455 will produce the best result when flung at the target in the 800 to 850 fps range and not do any damage to older guns. I like Bullseye powder for this task.

Here are some pics of some of my 45 DA sixguns. A Colt 1917, a pair of Smith pre-war Brazilians, a Smith post war 1955 Target Model with barrel chopped to 4" and a 5" 625 Smith. They are all very good guns and give lot of pleasure.

[9.3X62AL]

Let's see......Mr. Keith's recommended load in a 45 ACP case under #452423 (7.5 grains of Unique) is the same charge weight Skeeter Skelton used under the #429421 in 44 Special. Sounds a mite scary to me, especially in a 1917-series revolver.

With all of the 45 ACP tooling and componentry I have on hand here, it's kind of silly to NOT have a 45 ACP/AR revolver in the fleet. I've only owned one over the years (S&W 1955/Model 25-2), and it suffered from Cavernous Throat Syndrome (.456"-.457"). It shot jacketed bullets all right, but I found its uncooperative nature with my early casting efforts to be discouraging--so I sold it, and it is largely unmourned. Had I known then (c. 1983) what I know now about revolver consciousness-raising :) I might still have the thing. One of the better-dimensioned Model 625s would appeal in no small way to me, though their current tariffs being asked are unrealistic.

[Char-Gar]

Years ago, Skeeter wrote an article entitled "Poor Man's Magnum" where he took a Colt 1917 and loaded it with the heavier Keith 454424 over 7.5/Unique. A few years later in print, he confessed to having cracked the cylinder and had it rebarreled and recylindered to 44 Special and he got an article or two out of that pistol as well. I once owned the 44 Special version.

Lots of folks destroyed lots of good guns back in the day and some of them should have known better, or at least you would so think.

A couple of months ago, I was reading something Elmer Keith wrote in a mid-50s issue of Guns Magazine. He said that after much experimentation, he learned you should size your bullets .451 in the Colt and Smith 1917 pistols for best accuracy. Yea right! .451 cast bullets rattle down those huge cylinder throat.

Elmer Keith did not walk on water and neither did Skelton. They were just gun writers trying to pay their bills by selling words to gun magazines. I am not to certain they were all that careful with those words. If they screwed up, they could always sell more words explain and correct the previously sold words.

[Char-Gar]

Oops, I just noticed I posted a pic of my 629 and not my 625, so here is the correction.

[Scharfschuetze]

Here's my Colt 1917 resting on my wife's grandfather's uniform from WW I.

Short of my Model 14, this is one of the most accurate revolvers that I own.

[rintinglen]

Thanks to all who have posted those delightful pics. I don't own a 1917 anymore--my experience ran parallel to 9.63x62 Al's with pore accuracy and barrel leading from the Brazilian S&W I used to own. But it is delight to see "Old Iron."

[Bret4207]

Starline Brass makes .45 auto rim cases.

And they're the most bestest thing in the world too. My 17 is a Smith, but AR brass is lots nicer than ACP for a revolver.

[9.3X62AL]

Clipped 45 ACP rounds weren't my favorite thing--removal and replacement was kinda labor-intensive, and after scoring 150 factory Remington 45 Auto Rim cartridges--reloading that brass was a lot less work than messing with clips. HKS makes speed-loaders for the AR brass, too. The AR brass went with the revolver, as did the loaders.

[gmsharps]

Some years back I picked up a basket case colt 1917 and a few years later at the Tulsa gun show i found a brand new 1917 38-40 barrel and cylinder that some day plan on putting on the frame. To many things to do and to little time to get em done.

gmsharps

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

CharGar,

Those are some handsome revolvers you're posting up there. Makes a man jealous. When they had those 1917's for sale as surplus, I was young and didn't have the cash. Now that I have the cash, finding one in top notch shape is hard to do.

[Char-Gar]

Dave.....

I bought a couple of Colt 1917s back when they were $30.00 each, but never held on to them. I have had the one in the photo about 6 years. A store had it in a display case with a high end collector's price and it sat there for three years. The store was changing locations and I walked in and asked them if they really wanted to drag that to another store where it could sit for some more years. I offered them about 60% of what they had on it and they bit. Sometimes these stores just want to get their money back so they can put it into something that will sell more quickly. A fellow just has to be patient and look for the right opportunity to pounce. A fellow can't get emotionally invested in owning any particular gun.

Did I tell you, I like handguns? I have been accumulating them for almost a half century and in that time they do add up. I have always been "cash poor", so there has been lots of trades, lay-a-ways and biding my time until the right opportunity rolled around. I have several hundred good handguns go through my hands over the years. It is some form of sickness, but I don't think I ever lost a dime in all of this buying, selling and trading.