The 100 pound propane bottle

[FAsmus]

Gentlemen;

Recently I came into a free 100 pound propane bottle.

I accepted it because I thought I could use it instead of my several 25 pound tanks to fire my casing outfit.

I set the tank outside my casting shed and went to the local propane shop to buy some fittings, a regulator and enough flexible rubber hose to run inside to my burner. They asked me what I was going to do with their materials, I told them and they told me that what I was planning was illegal! and they could not/would not help me.

I tried another shop and ran into the same careful interrogation. I am currently so discouraged that I may very well just give this tank to the first fellow who shows up to take it off my hands.

Good morning,
Forrest

[gmsharps]

Just curious what did they say was illegal about it.

gmsharps

[frkelly74]

Menards has all that stuff on display for hooking up tanks and most of their floor walkers have no idea what is legal , or even whether it is a good idea. I bought an adapter to fill small propane tanks from a 20lb tank there, whether it's a good idea or not.

I also once bought a no vent gas heater there that the guy said was okay for habitable areas, gave us all headaches. Not a good idea.

[oneokie]

Get some soft 3/8" copper tubing instead of the flexible rubber hose.

[lancem]

It is probably the flex line that is causing you the grief, go with the 3/8 copper and you probably won't have any problems.

Personally I think I would have simply told them I have a project I'm working on, when asked the second time I would have simply said how much I owe you?

[Wayne Smith]

If its illegal how do they hook them up to a house for LNG or Propane run appliances?

[oneokie]

If its illegal how do they hook them up to a house for LNG or Propane run appliances?
With the soft copper line. Back in the '50's, many homes here used the 100 lb bottles for their cookstoves. Copper tubing was run from the stove through a hole in the wall to the regulator that was connected to the tank. When it was time to refill the bottle, the regulator was unscrewed from the valve on the bottle, bottle loaded into the truck and hauled to the propane co. for refilling, or the delivery trucks carried an adapter that would be screwed into the valve on the tank and the hose from the truck connected to the adapter A few of the bottles had the refill connection on the top of the tank along with the regular valve. In that instance, a delivery truck would fill the tank without using the adapter.

[BruceB]

The vast majority of safety regulations exist for two reasons:

-Somebody somewhere paid a high price, or

-Somebody somewhere anticipated a problem and created a regulation to PREVENT that problem from exacting the "high price".

Propane is a potential bomb, just waiting for the chance to escape and ignite or detonate.

I lived with propane for heating and all household functions for many years. I NEVER forgot its potential, even while enjoying its benefits.

Consider this, too: if we self-install a propane system of any kind that does NOT meet regulations, and it figures in a fire or explosion, WE MAY HAVE VOIDED THE INSURANCE COVERAGE....... as well as endangering our family!

This thread gives me the willies.

[theperfessor]

The last time we bought a stove the installers informed me that using soft copper line for gas was illegal and they installed a woven/braided stainless steel flex line. Maybe the same with propane as it is with natural gas.

[Hardcast416taylor]

My neighbor came into a 3/4 ton pick up load of 100 lb. tanks from his construction company that used them for heating several work shacks. They bought them new and filled, when empty they just changed tanks with a full one. I got 3 of these new empty tanks had them filled and am using them 1 at a time to heat my casting area in my barn with a large space floor heater. I have adequate ventilation and use care with this gas all the time anyways. Parts are available at TSC farm stores, Menards and many other stores that are farmer related.Robert

[shadowcaster]

I set the tank outside my casting shed and went to the local propane shop to buy some fittings, a regulator and enough flexible rubber hose to run inside to my burner. They asked me what I was going to do with their materials, I told them and they told me that what I was planning was illegal! and they could not/would not help me.

I'm not sure why they said it would be illegal....

I did the same thing. Acquired a 100 pounder, went to the propane shop, they made me up a hose that is 12 feet long with the proper ends. It's basically an extension hose that my short hose and regulator hook up to. They were happy to make the sale.

Shad

[bangerjim]

Not only do you have the tubing/hookup problems you also face the expiration test date on that feeebee you got. Most LPG tanks have a 12 year test date stamped on the top. With the 20# tanks, most people trade them in at Home Depot or Lowe's rather than refilling them, That way you get an "in-date" tank. If you buy the tank and just refill it, it expires in 12 years and it is scrap. It has to be re-certified.

You may want to look into your local propane delivery company and get that tank swapped out real soon!

My father was a manager of a propane company for years and always used solid copper not braided or flex.


banger

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I set the tank outside my casting shed and went to the local propane shop to buy some fittings, a regulator and enough flexible rubber hose to run inside to my burner. They asked me what I was going to do with their materials, I told them and they told me that what I was planning was illegal! and they could not/would not help me.

I tried another shop and ran into the same careful interrogation.
Since you talked with the people that would know...
I suspect there are some local/state regulations that mandate that a person must be licensed to do that kind of work.

[starmac]

It may be union country. I repaired an emergency fuel leak at a local truckstop once, and while I was repairing the leak a union plumber stopped and informed me that what I was doing was illegal. I told him to call the law, as I wasn't stopping and would be finished before they could get there anyway. I guess in his eyes, it would have been better to let diesel leak, while waiting for a licensed plumbing company to come 65 miles.

[detox]

Can you run without regulator and use just the valve? Seems i borrowed a cooker one time and it did not have regulator...very simple to adjust without fire going out. The regulator on my burner is very fussy and hard to adjust...yes I have followed the instructions that came with regulator.

[Beau Cassidy]

Just as late as yesterday I too 2 20 lb propane tanks to the propane place to be filled. One was over 13 years old and they said they could not fill it without pressure testing it. The guy there suggested I take it next door to the Dollar General and do the exchange deal. I did that and it was about a dollar cheaper. I wonder if the age of the tank is what you are running into.

[MarkP]

Probably does not meet code. May need to be hard pipe; nails can pierce copper and rubber lines.

[starmac]

Just tell them you are getting a hose for your weedburner.

[freebullet]

Camper/motorhome stores sell both high & low pressure propane hoses with the fittings you need.

[uscra112]

You can get everything you need online. McMaster.com if nowhere else. That said, any kind of hose I would never use inside a structure. I plumbed up my old farmhouse for a propane stove, and used the yellow coated "accordion" flex-pipes. There's three shutoffs in the line, so I can stop any leak immediately, no matter where I am. I also spent $150 for a good quality hand-held "combustible-gas detector". (These things will sense gas long before you can smell it.)

[dragon813gt]

I plumbed up my old farmhouse for a propane stove, and used the yellow coated "accordion" flex-pipes.

So I hope you bonded the line at both ends. I'm assuming you're talking about CSST. There was a class action lawsuit for yellow TracPipe due to pin holeing from a lightning strike. The yellow covering is no longer being made and does not meet IBC because it's not internally bonded. The new black covered counterstrike tubing is. This is another product that should only be sold to licensed professionals for a reason.

The reason I posted was to tell you if you ran CSST with the yellow covering you need to bond it at all ends if you didn't already. If you're talking about the short hose kits you can buy at Home Depot and Lowes then you have nothing to worry about.

[boltaction308]

My brother buys propane fittings all the time and never has any problems. He flys hot air balloons. Just tell them you are repairing a hot air balloon.

[shaune509]

local regs may very, but I would use copper line from a shielded outdoor spot a short distance from any buildings [as per fire code] into your shed/casting area. use flex from tank to preregulator to secured copper to secured 1/4 turn valve at wall near burner, then flex with quick disconnect to burners regulater. The tank will need a weather cover over the valve to keep sun, rain and ice away but also allow free venting of area, the tank should also be secured from tipping and inpact. The inside hose should be as short as possable [<10']. A tank retest used to be less than @20.00 on a clean unrusted tank.
Shaune509

[FAsmus]

Gentlemen;

I am very grateful for all the response to this subject! Thanks very much.

I plan on putting together a (safe) design for this tank from all the advise you've provided - but before I do anything else I'll check to see if the darn thing is within its inspection period ~ probably not, considering it's source..

I'll be back to put closure on the subject.

Good evening,
Forrest

[EDG]

I think the caution that makes it illegal is due to using a temporary line for a permanent installation in an occupied structure.

Gas collected in an enclosed space can suffocate your or it can reach a source of ignition it will blow the building apart.

If you use the line out in the open with no shed you do not have either of these concerns though you can still burn yourself up.

[dikman]

Our house was originally plumbed for LP gas (talking Australia here). We had two 100 lb. bottles, connected to an automatic changeover valve which also incorporated the regulator. All connections here always have the regulator mounted right next to the tank, presumably so that only low pressure gas is in the line into the house. I would not recommend running the line directly to a burner without a regulator at the tank. The lines were all run in hard-drawn copper pipe.

Basically, the only thing anyone can do here with LP gas is to connect/disconnect a BBQ/camping stove/camping light! Anything else requires a licensed gas fitter. Of course, it's still possible to buy all sorts of gas fittings, even though legally you can't do anything with them! Hasn't stopped me making several burner assemblies for melting lead, wax etc.[smilie=1:

I've also re-filled small gas bottles from larger ones, which requires turning them upside down to get the liquid propane out - which, of course, I'm also not supposed to do! Just had a thought, have a look at glass-blowing sites and see what they use - many here seem to use 100 lb. bottles inside.

[Adk Mike]

I work for a large propane company and have for thirty years. PM me and I'll tell you what you need. Most propane company's discourage folks with 100 pound tanks. It is just part of the culture. They have to be upright when transported and have a neck ring etc. The value is POL (put on left) . I use one on my barbecue grill and smelt with one . They are very handy.
Hoses are for temp heat and camping. If your going in a building there is a lot to consider. High pressure is a no no in a building and most turkey cookers are high pressure. Again PM me and I'll help you out. Propane is much safer than Gasoline to have around. It has to be handles correctly that's all. Mike

[FAsmus]

Gentlemen;

I thought to put closure on this thread today: The 100-pound bottle is gone ~ it was simply not worth the effort to plumb it up, fill it up haul it around.

Instead I asked the local Farmer's Co-Op if I could donate. They said sure! An hour later it was theirs.

Good morning, FASmus

[Faret]

Just as late as yesterday I too 2 20 lb propane tanks to the propane place to be filled. One was over 13 years old and they said they could not fill it without pressure testing it. The guy there suggested I take it next door to the Dollar General and do the exchange deal. I did that and it was about a dollar cheaper. I wonder if the age of the tank is what you are running into.

Look at or weigh how much you got on exchange now they only put in 15#. Filled is a full 20#

[mongoose33]

Gentlemen;

I am very grateful for all the response to this subject! Thanks very much.

I plan on putting together a (safe) design for this tank from all the advise you've provided - but before I do anything else I'll check to see if the darn thing is within its inspection period ~ probably not, considering it's source..

I'll be back to put closure on the subject.

Good evening,
Forrest

If it turns out to be out of date, you can always cut off the bottom and use it for a casting pot. ;)

[dikman]

I was thinking the same thing, plus there would be a lot of material left to make a windshield for the burner.

[FAsmus]

Gentlemen;

What interesting posts in response to a closure.

As for the bottom of a 100-pound bottle for rendering - wow! That would make for some serious production!

I get mileage from a recycled dutch-oven. I heat it with a cut-down propane turkey burner. Filled it holds about 90 pounds of alloy.

Good evening, Forrest

[sirgknight]

"local propane shop"? or local government regulators? Seems to me they need to decide if they want to BE a propane shop or continue to formulate policy.....

[Kylongrifle]

You can buy 12' extension hoses with a regulator already on them. Mr Heater brand if im not mistaken. Tractor supply sells them here..They are for running heaters off small tanks and you see people everywhere running heaters with them off 100 pounders..If a propane outfit comes to your house here they use copper tubing..Standard around here..
One of our forges runs off a 40 pounder and we keep a couple 20 pounders to run small heaters from like the big buddy heater..We also have a 125 gallon PIG set outside one of the shops to run a 30K BTU heater with during the winter..I have a 100 pound tank but never wanted to move it..Im going to purge it and make a smoker from it most likely..