401043 Lyman 38-40 mold

[smkummer]

Is anyone having trouble with this bullet not holding in position and pushing itself into the case in tube loading guns? My plan was to use this in a Colt lightning which holds 15 carts.. thanks Mike

[Morgan Astorbilt]

Yes I had this problem with my original Marlin 1894. The bullets don't have a crimp groove. I 've since bought the RCBS version: .40-180 CM, and this is what I've been using for three years, for cowboy action shooting. This mold is listed in thier cowboy action series. You can also get a better roll crimp with their cowboy action dies. Lately all their "regular" dies have been supplied with what they call modified roll crimps, look like taper crimps to me.
Morgan

[John F.]

You're not alone -- Mike Venturino has long noted that this bullet dates back to black powder days, when it was supported by the powder charge in the case and thus a crimp over the ogive was sufficient. You MIGHT find that a Lee Factory Crimp die would crimp it enough to work in your rifle, but it also might possibly be hard on your brass to crimp it that much.

John

[smkummer]

I plan on using modern smokeless loads, so the RCBS appears the way to go. Although has anyone tried the Lee TL 175 gr SWC? If I were to crimp in the last TL cavity will I be OK on the OAL? I always wondered why it was the standard 38-40 bullet all those years and worked. Now I know that it was the bulk blackpowder that held it from moving into the case.

[Morgan Astorbilt]

You're right about the brass, John. The .38-40, like the .44-40 has a very thin case mouth, and can't give a very strong crimp. After giving up trying to convince Dillon to bring out the SDB in .38-40, I was setting up my Hornady ProJector press, which came with a ram actuated powder measure. I thought I'd get an RCBS case actuated adapter, but found the Rube Goldberg arrangement was too much for the thin case mouths, collapsing them. I've since installed a Dillon powder measure (old style spring-actuated), and haven't had any trouble since.
Morgan

[Harry O]

BTW, if you do use almost a full case of BP (enough so that 1/8" to 3/16" of compression will be at the base of the seated bullet, you won't have that problem. I have done that and have found that the old guys knew what they were doing. I have two 40043 single-cavity moulds that I use alternately when casting. I have a 401452 for smokeless powder. It has a crimp groove.

[hydraulic]

I use the same load as Harry O in my Colt Single Action and I load with an old Ideal #4 tong tool. I have a problem opposite of those previous mentioned; the bullet tends to pull out of the case under recoil. I suppose I'll have to buy a modern bullet seater/crimper. Incidentally, I also load the same bullet in my S&W .40.

[Morgan Astorbilt]

Same here, I originally bought the mold years ago, to load for my 10MM Delta Elite for bowling pin matches.
Morgan

[Harry O]

I use the same load as Harry O in my Colt Single Action and I load with an old Ideal #4 tong tool. I have a problem opposite of those previous mentioned; the bullet tends to pull out of the case under recoil. I suppose I'll have to buy a modern bullet seater/crimper.

Do you roll crimp on the front curve of the bullet. I do and have not had that problem. The 38-40 Lee factory crimp dies does not work with this bullet. They are made to fold metal into a crimp groove. I have some Ideal 310 dies and a handle, but have never tried them. Do they do a roll crimp? I just use the regular dies and do a heavy roll crimp ahead of the lube groove (again, on the front curve). It keeps the bullet from moving forward. The case full of BP keeps it from moving back.

[hydraulic]

The seating chamber crimping shoulder on that old #4 is probably worn. If you recall, there is no adjustment on those old tools-they are designed to seat the bullet that comes from the attached mould. Unfortunately, the mould on this tool is not in good condition so I have been using the 401043 bullet. This bullet probably has a different ogive and doesn't crimp above the shoulder. Thanks for the heads up on the Lee dies. I'll probably go with RCBS. My old single action was made in 1898 so I only use BP; 30 grs. ffg.