A Close Call

[376Steyr]

Last Saturday afternoon my hunting buddies and I were cutting up an elk on the side of a mountain. We had just brought our packboards and knives with us as it was a reasonably nice day; the buddy who had killed the elk assured us it was only a mile from the road; and after all, we had all done this before, how long could it take?
The mile from the road turned out to be all uphill, through brush, and we were dripping with sweat when we got to the carcass. Then it began to rain. Then it began to snow. Then the wind started to blow. We were all soaked to the skin, moving slower and slower, and finally had to take shelter behind a tree. It was time to build a fire. Turned out the only fire starter we had between the three of us was a butane lighter in my pants pocket. Each of us had a well-stocked emergency kit, and all of them were sitting back at the truck in our hunting packs. On the third strike the lighter produced a tiny flame, flickered, and then died. It hasn't worked since.
Things were looking pretty grim when suddenly it stopped snowing and the wind died down. We staggered out from behind the tree, resumed work, got the meat loaded into our packs, and started down the hill. The trip back was nasty. It started snowing again, then the sun set. We had one flashlight between us, which the lead guy would use to find the trail with and light up the worst of the obstacles. Despite numerous stumbles and falls, nobody broke or twisted anything important. We were on our last legs when we finally got back to the truck. I'm typing slowly due to the touch of frostbite I got on a couple of fingers.
I'm mulling over all the things we did wrong, and thinking about improvements. Lessons learned so far:
1. Always have more than one way to start a fire.
2. Start a fire as soon as you get to the carcass, even if you think you won't need it.
3. When you are freezing to death, standing over a big pile of bloody elk meat, with only a knife in your hand, is a bad time to start thinking about all the wolf tracks you have seen in the area.
Any more suggestions?

[TheCelt]

Dang, all the makings for a bad day!!! Glad Ya'll got out alright and good lessons for us all hard learned. Thanks for sharing.

[454PB]

In Montana, the sound of a gun shot is the dinner bell for bears. You have to keep that in mind ALL the time when recovering game, and always have a gun at the ready. As far as fire starters, I always have at least two lighters, and ammunition can be used to start a fire in a real emergency.

[300savage]

nope no suggestions.
those of us , like yourself who have done this kind of thing dont have to be told what to do next time.
we allready know, just like you do now.

[oneokie]

Kill the game closer to the road.
Be thankful that it wasn't down hill getting to the carcass.

[HNSB]

A trick for the Bic type lighters when they get wet:
Take off the child-resistant spring. Just pull it up with a pair of pliers.
Roll the wheel down your pant leg a couple of times. That heats up the flint & steel and helps dry them.
As long as there's butane left in it, it should light.

[376Steyr]

Life would have been a whole lot better if we hadn't left the GPS in the truck, or if I had carried my old wool GI gloves with me, or if we'd marked the spot in the brush where you had to turn to find the start of the trail back to the truck. I'm hoping to get a suggestion that I'd never think of, something along the lines of "I always carry a small XYZ with me, so I can ZYX if necessary." Thanks!

[376Steyr]

A trick for the Bic type lighters when they get wet:
Take off the child-resistant spring. Just pull it up with a pair of pliers.
Roll the wheel down your pant leg a couple of times. That heats up the flint & steel and helps dry them.
As long as there's butane left in it, it should light.

Thanks! I'll try that, I still have the dead lighter. Don't know it somebody had a set of pliers on them, but I just managed to pry the clip off a fresh lighter with something else I have handy. I forgot to mention the part about the lighter being soaked in blood (my own) from a nasty cut I got when I fumbled my knife with cold hands. First aid supplies: Back at the truck.

[btroj]

A first aid and survival kit are worthless if they aren't with you.

Gear in the truck is only of value if you are also in the truck.

Big take away- you kept your wits about you and got out. Learn from the experience so it is never repeated.

Greatest survival gear lies between the ears. Yours worked. Next time, take some gear with you to help it out.

[oneokie]

I'm hoping to get a suggestion that I'd never think of, something along the lines of "I always carry a small XYZ with me, so I can ZYX if necessary." Thanks!

You asked.
>
>
>
Carry a 2 way radio with a helicopter service on speed dial.

[DxieLandMan]

That was a bad situation turned ugly. I'm glad that you are ok and your buddies are too.

[Hamish]

376, your story sounds like every bad story that ever started with "We only thought it would take,,", and ends up with "So there we were,,,and it was bad,,,,", glad to hear it didn't turn out that way.

There is no "shame on you", or "you knew better", it's just a matter of denying your training and making a short sighted decision.

I don't even leave the house for Church without a lockback, zippo, zoomie (led flashlight), a utility knife,a cell phone, and "Daddy's little helper". Any other day, add a multi-tool to that.

I can't help but wonder what your list looks like in your pack, seeing what you had would let others compare what they normally ruck up with.

[RoyEllis]

I'm hoping to get a suggestion that I'd never think of, something along the lines of "I always carry a small XYZ with me, so I can ZYX if necessary." Thanks!

First off, very glad all made it out OK & intact. Within reason (considering weight & bulk), those things that would be handy to have "just in case" are never worth shixt to ya if you aren't carrying them. With a carcass on the ground, at least 2 of you should've been packing guns....wolves & bears will contest ownership of "found meat" and you may not have known they were there till too late to turn & run. All should've had a small pack with minimum of a space blanket, waterproof match pack, energy bar or 2 and a full canteen. The Bic lighter trick works, but keep in mind those lose efficiency due to cold so carry it in a pocket as close to your body heat as possible.

[376Steyr]

"I can't help but wonder what your list looks like in your pack, seeing what you had would let others compare what they normally ruck up with."

In a ziplock bag I carry: toilet paper, water proof matches, butane lighter, fire starter sticks, water purification tablets, safety pins, 25 feet of parachute cord, band aids. This fits easily in a pocket on my small orange daypack, which has a 30 gallon trash bag (emergency raincoat), surveyor's marking ribbon, more parachute cord, spare knife, granola bars and bottled water. Minus the water, it weighs maybe five pounds. I could have easily hung it on the packboard, but I didn't. It would have added about 10% to the load I was carrying out, and foolishly that was the only thing I thought of when we started up the hill.

[Fishman]

Yep, my hunting approach is very light duty compared to most, just whitetails with a bow mostly within a couple miles of the truck, but I still have what I consider necessaries. As far as what could be considered safety gear, a compass, a bottle of water, two energy bars, a knife, a compact sharpener, a space blanket, waterproof matches, a magnesium fire starter, toilet paper, a length of cord, a single AAA flashlight and a AAA headlamp with extra batteries, four bandaids, and a trauma/clotting pac. I am probably going to add a roll of surgical tape. This all takes up one internal front pocket in my backpack and a side pocket for the water and energy bars.

Thanks for the reminder to always keep it with me, 376Steyr.

Now I have a piece of advice learned the hard way this season: Always use a broadhead wrench to change your broadheads!

[Rangefinder]

With respect to the OP---MAN, I'm sure glad you and all your buddies made it out intact with so little harm done over-all. Some don't get so lucky.

NOW, since you've had the living experience of being caught unprepared by Mother Nature, I'm gonna share a little of what I know. I teach Wilderness Survival--everything from simple day trips with prepared emergency kits to extreme survival with nothing. Fire is among what I call the "Critical Four" necessary things to ensure your ability to survive when Mama Nature decides to flip you on your head. I'd be happy to get more detailed with it (and the other three it shares importance with), but for the nature of the post I'm just going to introduce you to a little friend of mine that I keep in my wallet (no, it's not Franklins--or even Washingtons, for that matter).
8656386564

It's called Ferroserium Rod... AKA "Fire Steel". The ones I get are 3" by 5/16". Where I get them bulk run me less than $20 for 8 or them. Here's the thing: I don't like taking chances with a few things. YES, I know and do practice primitive fire methods regularly--I teach the stuff, so I can produce fire pretty confidently with just about nothing. THAT being said, I STILL don't want to rely solely on that--as you have now experienced, the unexpected can land right on top of you with no warning at all. Even with my skills and experience, I keep a fire steel in my tool box, in my glove box, in my tackle box, in my chainsaw case, in all my day packs, hunting packs, in my kayak, and--as you can see, I even keep a broken-off piece in my wallet. It's small enough to never even notice it's there. While a knife or some sharp piece of metal for a striker is preferred, a jagged corner of rock or even shell WILL spark enough to ignite a fire. It will strike in sub-zero temps. It will strike when it's completely drenched and pouring rain or snow. It will strike in the wind. It has no moving parts to fail or fluid to leak, and I have yet to use ONE up to the point I can't get another fire out of it--and I've struck an awful lot of fires. I'm never without one. A couple bucks could make the difference between telling us all about your next adventure and not being around to tell us anything. Never underestimate Mother Nature--she plays for keeps. ;)

[tommag]

For fire, one of the handiest spark catchers I've found is cotton balls with a little vaseline rubbed into them. With the firestick, ignition is usually on the first strike, and the vaseline helps it burn hotter and longer. I keep a couple stuffed into an old plastic film can.

[Beerd]

important safety tip for the rest of us, "Don't be like that guy".
..

[Love Life]

Holy smokes you had a close call. I have a set of pcket items I carry with me everywhere.

A pocket knife with multiple blades/tools (think swiss army) attached to a 10ft (unbraided) length of hunter orange 550 cord and a fire steel. Those are in my pocket no matter where I am.

When I know I am going out wandering or hunting I have a small buttpack or a larger day pack.

The buttpack has:
More 550 cord
Smooth stone with divet turned in it (think bow drill)
large black contractors trash bag
folded up space blanket
small 1st aid kit (will cover most minor injuries)
A label less pill bottle full of cotton balls soaked in vaseline
several snickers bars
A multi tool.
Water purification pills
A beanie and a spare pair of gloves.

That buttpack only weighs a few pounds and I rarely ever notice I have it on. I also have a Nalgene bottle with steel cup carried in an insulated carry pouch at all times on my person when out and about.

The day pack has much more goodies.

The buttpack will allow you to SURVIVE for a few days. The day pack will allow you to survive for a few days comfortably. My alice pack will allow me to live like a king.

Tailor the pack to the situation and have it on you at ALL times for the situation. If you practice having it on you at all times for awhile, then you will be more likely to have it on you at all times. your survival kit is worthless in your vehicle and people will talk about it in hushed tones at your funural.

As said above fire starting kit and fire are paramouont. Fire boosts your morale, allows you to cook and sanitize water, provides charcoal for belly aches and purfying, provides lye for skins, keeps you warm, can be used as a signaling device, etc.

Ddepending on the situation fire coomes first followed by everything else. If really nasty than you have to weigh out a fire against immediate shelter. Fire is better built against a reflective surface (Rock) with your shelter opening facing the fire.

There is more, but I don't want to write a book.

[Love Life]

Also, most people have some chapstick with them. That is a great firestarting aid, and in the cse of my buddy, it is a snack, but that is another story altogether.

[smokeywolf]

One more thing to add to Rangefinder and tommag's posts. Space blankets won't necessarily keep you warm, but they are easily carried and can stave off hypothermia and shield you from rain. As btroj pointed out, "Greatest survival gear lies between the ears"; hypothermia can render that tool or gear ineffective.

Was caught in a white-out once on horseback in unfamiliar territory at or above 5,000 ft. elevation; I had a space blanket, my partner didn't. He suffered a mild case of hypothermia and had trouble thinking straight.

smokeywolf

[1Shirt]

One bic type lighter is never enough, and should only be one source of firestarting! Strongly recommend googling "fire making or starting, etc", and there are numerous UTube videos on the subject.
1Shirt!

[Love Life]

For your cotton balls soaked in vaseline:

A friend and I wanted to know how much vaseline did what. We started with just a dab worked into the cotton ball all the way to completely saturating the cottonbal in vasoline until it looked like a giant booger. All lit up fine and the burn times were quite close between the saturations. So I gob them up real good like.

When you use a vasoline cotton ball don't just stick it on the ground and light it. it'll burn, but it is mo' better to pick the soaked cottonball apart and fluff it up for more surface area.

Have the rest of your fire making materials at hand and ready to feed into the cotton ball. They burn for about a minute.

[1Shirt]

On a lighter side, I just ran across a bit of humor on the subject of fire starting on Yahoo. Go to Yahoo and type in "fire fart"!
1Shirt!

[starmac]

I will go one further, along with the fire starting equipment and starter of your choice, practice and learn to use it in every condition. Learning to start a fire when it is raining and you HAVE to have a fire doesn't usually work.

[Love Life]

^^^Truth.

[dakotashooter2]

Shed clothing BEFORE you get too warm. At the first sign of heating up I shed clothes even if it is a PITA. In most cases I like to start a hard walk in "condition cold" and carry the extra clothes if I think I may need them. One generally can survive better with not quite enough "dry" clothes than too much "wet" cloths........ Rain is one of the reason I like wool..................

[CastingFool]

We all learned or were reminded of something today. Glad everything turned out allright.

[Rangefinder]

Shed clothing BEFORE you get too warm. At the first sign of heating up I shed clothes even if it is a PITA. In most cases I like to start a hard walk in "condition cold" and carry the extra clothes if I think I may need them. One generally can survive better with not quite enough "dry" clothes than too much "wet" cloths........ Rain is one of the reason I like wool..................
And along those lines... There is a saying--Cotton Kills. When cotton gets even slightly damp it not only becomes abrasive, but it wicks your body heat away like a radiator. There is a reason it is the cloth of choice in the desert. Polyester or wool for mountains and cooler climates--stay away from cotton.

[MT Gianni]

Glad it turned out OK. I have spent a night unprepared in the woods and it isn't fun. I have a altoids can on my person with a 2" lockblade, matches, lighter, cotton balls in vaseline, alum foil, mini flashlight with the battery reversed and flint and magnesium/steel starter. Wrap it with duct tape and it fits in a pocket.

[376Steyr]

Thanks for all the good ideas, guys. Keep them coming. I now have several items on order that I'm going to add to the kit. I have a fireplace at home, and plan on testing the assorted firestarting items in the comfort of my living room instead of trying them for the first time in the middle of a snow storm. Once again, the greatest survival kit in the world does you no good if you leave it behind. And again, it was my own bad decisions, each little one piling on top of the the last, that got me into that jam.

[Love Life]

Just have packs of different sizes for different situations. ALWAYS have your pocket items, as even those can make things livible for an evening.

Going from the truck to a game animal or something=Buttpack/small waistpack
Going hiking and exploring in the local area=Day pack
Going on a long range movement where you PLAN to be out multiple days=ALICE/ILBE/Full size ruck.

One size pack does not fit all situations so I like to tailor them. I also like to have some high proof bourbon in my pack in the winter time. I'm not a drinker so a nip goes a long way for fortitude.

[bubba15301]

add dryer lint to your fire starting kit.

[Rangefinder]

I also like to have some high proof bourbon in my pack in the winter time. I'm not a drinker so a nip goes a long way for fortitude.

Amen to that! All the 'who-says-what' about alcohol dropping body temp and such is true... But it sure is nice, once all the essentials are handled and you're as tucked in for the night by a fire, to have a couple sips to make a bearable night into a pleasant, if not even cozy one. If you're gonna be stuck there, you might as well get a little enjoyment out of it!

[Love Life]

You know this already, Rangefinder, but your mental attitude has as much to do with surviving as anything else you can do.

Your body will physically tell you when it can't do anymore. Your mind will make you quit long before your body does.

Survival is one of the hardest and easiest things you can do. Brilliance in the basics.

[TES]

Carry a small bag of fritos chips. One match or flick of the bic and you have a great fire starter fuel. Worst case you have hi carb food / fuel for yourself.

[tommag]

Someone once suggested duct tape for tinder. I tried lighting a scrap, and it burns fairly well, too. I think I'd rather save it for other uses, but it does burn pretty good.

[obssd1958]

I carry a small pack with me, every time I leave the truck. When I need to take a packframe to carry back meat, the regular pack goes in or on the frame on the way out - and is carried backwards (on my chest) on the way out.

I too, have been in an "almost didn't make it back" situation. Last week of October, lost (buddy said he knew the area like the back of his hand...), no pack, no supplies, Denim jacket, jeans, cotton t-shirt, raining and not enough experience to know how to build a fire when everything is wet. Spent the night shivering and praying. We hiked out to the last 100 yards of an abandoned forest road (left no question about which way to go), the following day. Evidently, the good Lord wasn't done with me here yet...

[Three44s]

This is a very good thread and I thank the OP for sharing his story that precipitated it.

I would offer this: A friend of mine uses his food saver to package up a pair of dry socks for his days out hunting. Take that a step farther and one can use it for packaging up anything non-perishable that must be kept dry to be useful.

The other thought is that youth hunter safety classes should include a discussion like this thread ........ now, I am old enough that I did not go through such classes so maybe they do cover such an important topic and am unaware of it.

The sportsman channels on cable TV SHOULD include such information as well. It's very intuitive once it's explained once or twice .........

Retailers like Cabelas and others could also do work at this ........

You can't sell another gun or fishing pole to a dead guy! AND you'd likely sell him some "tools of the trade" after the class!!!

Three 44s

[gbrown]

I can't add a lot more to this, except you always have to be in the mindset of "what if?" Lot of good ideas here from people with more experience in remote hunting areas. I have several backpacking stoves that I would carry. As far as fire starting, I would consider carrying several options with me--Bic lighter, the magnesium fire starter and matches in a waterproof container. I make fire starters out of paper egg cartons, lint (dryer) and wax. All free or dirt cheap. Pack the egg carton with lint and pour wax all over the lint/carton. After its good and cold, you can break apart the segments by hand. I also use "fatwood" or lighter pine. Both the wax/lint starters and the lighter pine burn really hot. A cheap small vinyl tarp from someplace like Harbor Freight would work well, also. You can make some high calorie food in small packages, like Ramen, Oatmeal/Raisins/nuts, or homemade/commercial jerky that doesn't take up much room or weight. Always, always, have a traditional compass on your person. My truck, my hunting jacket, my boat and sometimes my cargo pants have one in them at all times. You just never know.

[300savage]

just another little thing that i learned the hard way.. a compass does you little good if you dont know what direction the truck/horses / truck lies.
so i check my direction of travel with the compass when i leave my base, and again often as i travel. needless to say its not carried in my pack.
i also usually have a waxed topo map of my hunting area in a ziplock in my pack. you never know when a fog bank or a snow storm can come on you.
oh, and a small bottle of extra strength pain killer is always with me
but the most important thing is that i would rather forget my rifle than go out in the bush without my kit.
of course these are all in addition to a good gps, but again i have learned the hard way that the old ways are more reliable.

[Love Life]

I'll be the first here to say that those green package magnesium firestarters/rod combos are pretty crappy.

A serious ferro rod and a bag/bottle of cotton balls are much better. This comes from experience.

Heck, a serious ferro rod by itself is better than that green package compromise.

Also, if using stoves, keep in mind your altitudes and temperatures. Those snazzy pocket stoves with the sternoish fuel cans look really cool on the box sitting on some snow, but when it dips below -15 they don't work that well. The small white fuel stoves are the bomb. Period.

Having thick snow on the ground gives you advantages and disadvantages. Ease of movement (with snow shoes) and easy shelter building material. I'll take a properly dug "T" trench over a one man tent on top of the snow. You'll be warmer in the "T" trench.

Collect kindling and stuff as you walk along. As I said, you need to have all of your fire materials at hand when you start the process.

A compass is a good thing to have, but you can orient using terrain features, and don't forget about the sun...

Spare clothes and stuff are great to have, but if you don't have them then you don't have them. If soaked with no spares, I'd rather be buck nekid and dry (while your clothes dry near a fire) than cold, wet, and clothed. Stopping is ok, you don't always have to be moving.


If it is summer time then find some water and shade. If in the desert then find some shade....

I'd really like to take one of Rangefinder's course and if I was in his area I absolutely would. The knowledge he can pass on is worth it's weight in gold.

[aspangler]

This is a very good thread and I thank the OP for sharing his story that precipitated it.

I would offer this: A friend of mine uses his food saver to package up a pair of dry socks for his days out hunting. Take that a step farther and one can use it for packaging up anything non-perishable that must be kept dry to be useful.

The other thought is that youth hunter safety classes should include a discussion like this thread ........ now, I am old enough that I did not go through such classes so maybe they do cover such an important topic and am unaware of it.

The sportsman channels on cable TV SHOULD include such information as well. It's very intuitive once it's explained once or twice .........

Retailers like Cabelas and others could also do work at this ........

You can't sell another gun or fishing pole to a dead guy! AND you'd likely sell him some "tools of the trade" after the class!!!

Three 44s
I don't know about other states, but Tennessee Hunter Education classes DO include basic survival. I know I teach it. I am proud to say that our Hunter Education certification is recognized in all 50 states, Canada, and Mexico.

[300savage]

there is an old saying most people who die while lost in the woods die from shame.

they wont admit the truth until its too late.
there is always a break point where a man must admit the facts and shift mindset from one of finding their way back, to surviving the storm, or the night.
this must be done before exhaustion or hypothermia or light is gone or weather conditions make it impossible to prepare your hide and fire.