S&w 19-4

[james6600]

Picked this up yesterday, has target hammer & trigger, anyone have load recommendations keeping in mind forcing cone issues. I don't need heavy loads just target and a few deer loads. I will stay with 357 brass and 158gr and maybe 170-180gr boolits, what boolits and powder are working for you S&W 19 guy's? I almost forgot, the lettering is gold that's not factory is it?

[bhn22]

The gold lettering is not factory, brake cleaner and a soft brush will likely remove it. I'd probably feed the revolver 155-160 gr bullets, probably Lyman 358156, a design that makes more sense to me every day. I'd also probably use Unique for a powder, and perhaps occasionally 2400 if I had a specific need for it. The cylinder should be long enough for Keith bullets if you want. There are also a large number of custom molds you could use if you want. If you really want a target load, consider a cast wadcutter in .357 brass with 3.5- 4.0 gr of Bullseye. It could live forever at that power level, and I do understand that K frames are tougher than some people think they are.

[Bret4207]

I will never be without a M19 if I have anything to say about it. I put an awful lot of hot loads through mine back in my 'hotter is better" days. Today most of my 38/357 shooting involves 38 brass, a 358477 or 358156 in front of 5.0 Unique. Not too hot, not too slow, just about right for me. With the 357 brass for coyote/varmint/possible deer it's the 358156 in front of 13.5 2400. That's not real hot either, in fact I used to shoot it in 38 brass in 38's that were probably not done much good by it, but they weren't up to even M19 standards. That load will do what ever I want, pretty much whenever I need it to. There are probably better loads with other powders but I'm old fashioned kinda guy and I'm comfortable with the familiar. Truthfully, the Unique load will do at least 75% of what the 2400 load will do when you factor in my eyesight. The only other load I stick with is the old stand by H+G #50 WC in front of 2.7 grs Bullseye in 38 brass. That one is plenty for smaller varmints and small game.

My Smiff like them all at .359.

[waco]

Nice score! Lyman 358477 for light target work, RCBS 162gr. GC for the heavy hitting stuff.

[BruceB]

Is that a 4" or 6" barrel? (The photo sorta cuts-off at the crucial point.

No matter.... with either barrel length, you have one the most-practical revolvers ever built.

I currently own a 4" M19, and also owned a 6" in earlier times. Both are/were excellent handguns.

The "problem" with the M19 was usually the extensive use of the then-new hot .357/125-grain hollowpoint factory loads.

With my normal cast-bullet loads, the 19s seem/ed to perform perfectly for long periods of time with extensive shooting. I've long viewed the Model 19 as a sort of "super K-38", the K-38 being the .38 Special-chambered S&W on the same K frame. I've used a K-38 with near-.357 loads for thousands of rounds, but the 19 is INTENDED for such loads and is doubtless better-suited to such intrepid use.

I use the above-mentioned 358156, loaded over 14.5 grains of 2400, either with or without the gascheck as the mood strikes. This is an energetic load, but the revolver tolerates it easily, with free extraction and excellent accuracy. If full power is not needed, the load can be dropped a grain or two to moderate the performance. 358477 is a plain-base SWC which would also do fine in this gun, as would almost any maker's SWC of similar weight (around 150-160 grains).

There are MANY powders that can be used in this cartridge/gun combo, but I use 231 in .38 brass for the low-power end, and 2400 for the heavier stuff. You could spend YEARS in trial-loading and still not exhaust the possible permutations and combinations.

That revolver will give you endless enjoyment for many years. USE IT!

(I agree with Bret re: sizing at .358.... I've even tried .359 without much visible benefit...)

[rondog]

I want another 19.....I miss the two I used to have.....<sniff>

[james6600]

Thanks for the replies. It actually looks better than in the pic, I had the wife shooting it and had not cleaned it yet. I was wanting a 357 for the wife to target shoot and deer hunt on our farm and was leaning towards a GP100 4" but this showed up 2 weeks ago at my LGS. I knew the K frames handled good and figured it probably shot better and was no heaver than the Ruger even with a 6" barrel so I finally broke down and bought it yesterday. I Don't believe it has had much use as there are only flash rings around 5 chambers and next to no drag mark on the cylinder. Any way the wife shot some 38spl 158gr LRN and some 158gr 357 FMJ's, she handled the 357's better than I thought she would so I think it might work for her. She let me shoot it twice and I loaded a 38 and a 357 and at 30yds I hit an 8" steel plate with the same hold I didn't expect that. The Hogue is a little large for her hand and the finger grooves too small for mine so I'm going to try to find the walnut target grips and see how they work. I doubt I will ever load it more then about mid range mag velocity for hunting deer and the target loads will be kept to around 800fps at least that's the plan. At the moment I don't have anything to cast 38/357 so I will have to buy some molds but I'm good on powder with the exception of Bullseye, I think it's a myth anymore. James

[james6600]

BruceB, It's a 6", Thanks for your reply... James

[rondog]

Wow, you bought a .357 magnum handgun for your wife to shoot deer with? That woman's a keeper for sure!

[james6600]

rondog, well she wasn't raised in a firearms family and she is long gun recoil sensitive but shoots hand guns fairly well for a beginner. It only took 25 years for me to get her to take an interest in shooting sports but I think we are finally there. She talks about hunting but has never been so her guns are target first hunting second, I think she will be ready next fall she just needs trigger time. James

[357Mag]

James -

Congrats on a nice M-19.

RX -

For an accurate, no-kiddin' " Magnum " load: 14.5gr WW286 ( H110 same stuff ), Lyman SWC of 158 - 172 gr; SP Magnum primer. Use a good crimp.

Also Accurate and milder: 7.0gr IMR4756, Lyman SWC of 158 -172gr, SP primer. Use a good crimp.


With regards,
357Mag

[357Mag]

James -

Correction to previous message' typo.....

14.5gr WW296.


Regards,
357Mag

[leftiye]

I've developed a salivation response for NOE's RNGCHP boolits in almost any caliber. I like devastators too. I usually re cut the hollow point pins to make a wide mouthed medium shallow cone or cup shaped cavity. Just a suggestion.

[bobthenailer]

i used to have a 2 1/2 " 66 and a 4" 19 ! my wife took them both off of me, now there hers ! as well as the new 63 22 lr i bought a few years ago . shes really nice to me she did give me back the 617 its a little too heavy for her.

[rhead]

I have a model 19 -5 with a six inch barrel. The 5 on the cylinder yoke hinge has a 5 which is over struck on a 4. It is definitely a 5 (No recessed chambers)

Did they just have a few left over when they changed from the 19-4 to the 19-5?

[james6600]

I picked up an Ideal 358156 two cavity with handles today. I cast 75 with 10 to 1 PB to WW and they are dropping 161gr at .360 dia. and I'm running them through a .358 sizer, if they print good I'll be happy. James

[DrCaveman]

The ideal/lyman 358429 will get it all done

Around 12 gr of 2400 for hot yet accurate

Around 5 gr Unique for medium yet accurate

My 19-3 can take this boolit in magnum brass crimped in crimp groove

Have fun, i really like my m19

[Char-Gar]

In my 19 and every other 357 mag in the fleet my most often used load is 3.5/Bulleye over a 150-160 cast bullet in 38 Special cases. Up the ladder is 13.5/2400 with the same bullets in 357 Magnum cases.

[aya]

Char-Gar
What kind of grips is it on your 19 ?

[Ben]

My Model 19, 4" is by my side at night when I sleep.
I've got 15 handguns, this one is my favorite .

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/030-6.jpg

[DrCaveman]

In my 19 and every other 357 mag in the fleet my most often used load is 3.5/Bulleye over a 150-160 cast bullet in 38 Special cases. Up the ladder is 13.5/2400 with the same bullets in 357 Magnum cases.

I second aya's question. Those grips look kinda like my factory target grips, but the heel seems a little more narrow. Also there is no checkering.

Modified factory target grips?

Im liking your guys blue guns. Im happy with my nickel, and bought it since it was available at the time...but i kinda wish it would have been blued

[Char-Gar]

Char-Gar
What kind of grips is it on your 19 ?

Those grips are the Skeeter Skelton design made by Deacon Deason/Bear Hug Grips. Deacon died some years back.

[CastingFool]

The first handgun I fired that I could hit anything with was a Mod 19 with a 6" barrel. Couldn't afford one then, can't afford one now.

[9.3X62AL]

There is a theme running through this thread......"13.5 grains of 2400 under #358156". It is a very fine load, it duplicates the performance of the W-W 158 grain JHP load that served as my my old shop's duty round in 357 for a lot of years, and will not harm K-frame 357s one iota. Both the Win OEM round and the reload give 1225-1235 FPS from my 4" 686, and have dispatched untold numbers of varmints over the years. Most 6" barrels will likely prompt 1300 FPS or so, and in my BisHawk's 7.5" tube it runs 1350-1375 FPS.

[2shot]

I have the SS twin brother to the model 19, a 4" 66. I have settled on the Lyman 358429 and 7 grains of Herco as my go to load. This 358429 out of my mold, lubed and sized weighs 175 grains cast out of 20-1 alloy and goes an honest 1100fps out of my 4" tube. No leading and plenty of thump for deer size game inside 50 yards. YMMV


2shot

[dualsport]

Is that front sight in the OP's picture a factory sight? Looks like my K38.

[9.3X62AL]

I've seen a A LOT MORE "Baughman ramp" front sights on 6" Model 19/66, but the "Patridge" front sight seen in the OP photo shows up from time to time. Not common, though.

[Rodfac]

I just happen to have the same model and barrel length...mine is a 1972 gun that I bought in Del Rio, TX. Lately, I've been casting from a new Lyman #358156 GC mold for the past few days, and hour or so at a time, working up a supply to feed my three .357's and two .38 Specials. The alloy I've been using is 1:3 Pb to wheel weights with no tin added. The bullets drop out perfectly, both of them at .358+"...it's a good Lyman mold and the first new Lyman I've bought in probably ten years. I cleaned it up then started casting and was getting good keepers after the first 20 or so warmed up the mold.

BTW, I bought that 19 in '72, and it came with a Patridge front sight on it. When we moved to Connecticut sometime later in the early 80's, I ran up to Springfield one afternoon and had the gunsmith shop change it to the red insert ramped Boughmann...glad I did too, it's a far better holster gun now and I can seen no difference in the quality of the sight picture.

I've been swirl lubing nearly all of my recent casts, and this new one is no exception. A single treatment of slightly diluted 45-45-10 from White Label, before I seat a Hornady gc. I also lube while setting the check with 50-50 and do it all on a Lyman 450. For sizers, I'm using Lyman's .359" with a 429 top punch. Accuracy is all that I could hope for. 25 yds gps are running at or below 2" from three .357's: a new Smith M60, a Ruger Flat Top 50th Anniversary, and that Smith 19 with its six inch bbl. All three have throats so close to .358" that I can't tell the difference.

My load in .357 Magnum brass, (Starline brass, not nickled), is 6.8 to 7.5 gr of Herco. I chrono'd today's efforts and here are the results from that 6" barreled M19. All velocities are the average of six shots.
358156 gc with 6.8 gr of Herco = 1058 fps
358156 gc with 7.1 gr of Herco = 1111 fps
358156 gc with 7.5 gr of Herco = 1148 fps

I usually use Win 231 or HP38 for all my light to medium loads, but found an 8 lb. keg of Herco during the panic months, for a very reasonable price. I've been working up loads with it since. Oddly enough, I've found that it meters better than Unique, though my Dillon 550B's measure, and an ancient RCBS Uniflow. Deviations are usually less than a tenth of a grain.

Last Saturday, I helped a dad and 12 yo son track a buck the boy had wounded. It was a 3+ hour trail up through the wild roses and a cpl of creeks, but I finally walked up on him, and finished the job with a single shot to the back of his neck. It was a 9 pointer, probably up close to 175 lbs, dressed and I used my 3" model 60 Smith with that same 358156 gc'd bullet with the 6.8 gr load. From the shorter barrel today's chrono testing says it was doing just over 900 fps when it hit, broke through the spine and exited into the creek bank after passing through an add'l 7" of neck muscle. Penetration, at least at 20 feet, it's got in spades.

HTH's in your quest for a good load for that good looking M19 you've just acquired...remember the caution, I worked it up for my guns, and found it safe as I loaded it. You should consult a good GOOD manual before trying to duplicate it. Best Regards, Rod

[9.3X62AL]

Herco powder is a real "sleeper" as a multi-purpose fuel. It does great work in all of my straight-wall revolver cartridges, in 12 gauge and 28 gauge field loads, and it does meter better than Unique in both an RCBS measure and in my MEC 600 Jr. charge bars.

[james6600]

Rodfac how did they change the front sight? I just went and looked at mine and it appears to be machined as part of the barrel. And thanks everyone for the replies this has become an interesting thread for me with a lot of good information. James

[FLINTNFIRE]

Have had a few of those , currently have only 2 with the 6 inch slated for the son in the navy when he turns 21 in a few months , loading the 359640 mihec hollow point in .357 with wc820 , and 3.5 grains of promo under the lee 158 grain r.n. and s.w.c. , the shorter 4 inch barrel looks to be a 19-5 , the 6 inch is a 19-4 with sheriff 112 stamped into left side frame .