Bird shot loads for revolvers

[RugerFan]

As always…..

**Take great caution when working up hand loads. What is safe for my guns/equipment isn’t necessarily safe with yours**

Just thought I would sit down and tap out my method for putting together revolver birdshot loads. I started doing this almost 25 years ago, but I’m sure I’m not the first to figure this out. I’ve loaded these for .44 mag and .41 mag, but I would think it would work well for most any large caliber revolver.

1. Prepare brass just as you would for loading boolits to include flaring the case mouth.

2. Run gas checks though a sizer at bore diameter or slightly smaller (2 checks per cartridge). A Lee push through sizer works well for this.
https://i.postimg.cc/SN6f1Wc5/Gas-check.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

3. Powder selection: Many fast burning powders can work well. Look at published cast boolit data and choose a starting load for light bullets. Currently for my .41 mag I am using 8.0 gns of Salute (Russian Unique). The lead shot and 2 gas checks come to about 110 gns.

4. After charging the primed case with powder, gently rest a dowel or fat punch on top of the powder and make a mark even with the case mouth. This will ensure you won’t be trying to compress the powder in the next step and will get consistent seating depth.

5. Using the punch, press a pre-sized gas check (cup up) to rest on top of the powder. Stop when you reach the mark on the punch.
https://i.postimg.cc/DyrS36jr/Cup-up.jpg (https://postimages.org/)
https://s20.postimg.org/4l2b36pfx/Punch.jpg (https://postimage.org)

6. Fill the case almost full with lead shot (I use #7 ½).
https://i.postimg.cc/Ghvxg6Wd/Shot.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

7. Place the 2nd pre-sized gas check cup down on the shot and apply a standard roll crimp.
https://i.postimg.cc/nc4JhPtL/Crimped.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

Sometimes the top gas check will buckle somewhat. This is ugly, but usually holds. When loading .44 mag shot loads you can use an UNSIZED .416 cal gas check on top as the outside diameter on Gator checks is about .423” and seats well without buckling.

This year I have taken 5 spruce grouse, 4 ptarmigan and a snowshoe hare with my Ruger BH .41 mag. Ranges varied from 5 to 15 yds (Yes, the birds up here are dumb and let you get that close). At 15 yds the load has enough energy, but the shot pattern is getting rather thin and it’s easy to miss at that distance. Under 10 yds it’s pretty deadly.
https://i.postimg.cc/J4NS3H07/Ptarmigan.jpg (https://postimages.org/)https://i.postimg.cc/ncqNKRTQ/Spruce-grouse.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[wch]

When I started doing this years ago for a 41 magnum revolver I used foam from a grocery meat tray, seating the bottom one on top of the powder charge, adding shot (I used #7 1/2, too) and sealing the top wad with a thin film of silicone caulk.
I had chamfered one case to use as a cutter and opened the base so that I could use a push dowel to get the wads out of the cutter.

[flounderman]

I have done this for years but the gas check over the powder, I use with the cup down like the gas seal on a shotgun wad. Elmers glue can be used to seal the overshot gas check.

[Spawn-Inc]

i've done it with the 500 mag, but used to slow of a powder so it didn't work to good. i've since fire formed 7.62x25mm brass to my glock 17's chamber and use 5 gr of tightgroup for 70gr of #9 shot. it cycled the action properly, but i only tried it once. i have some loaded for tomorrow.

[BNE]

Thanks, I had not seen this method.

[ElDorado]

This is the same way I load 45 Colt shotshells for snakes. I also size my gas checks, but I seat the first one with a 44 mag seating die, and I fill a 1.6 cc Lee scoop with #9 shot. I use Unique, too. It's a great load.

[w5pv]

I was thinking about using 410 shot shell plastic shot cups cut to length in a 45 colt with 71/2 or @ # 8 shot,do any of you think this will work.

[Larry Gibson]

I was thinking about using 410 shot shell plastic shot cups cut to length in a 45 colt with 71/2 or @ # 8 shot,do any of you think this will work.

Base of the shot cups eat up a lot of shot room and are smaller in diameter of the inside of the 45 Colt cases. I seat a GC pretty much as above and cut the flanges to length to fit along the sides of the case. A small funnel is inserted which holds the flanges along the sides of the case to fill with shot. I use #12 shot since I don't hunt birds with my "snake" loads. Kind of a pain to load but I don't use that many and 10 of them last more than a couple years. Most of them are shot demonstrating them to others than on snakes.

Larry Gibson

[waco]

Very cool!

[Rodfac]

Here's how I do it....Snake Loads for a Handgun

I make up "snake" loads for my revolvers using #12 or #9 shot. In a .38 Spl or .357, they'll reliably kill snakes out to about 8-10 feet. In .45 LC or one of the .44's, they're even more effective. Here's my procedure.

1. I size and recap the empty case as normal, then load the powder charge matched to the weight of shot I'm going to use. 3.5 gr's of Bullseye works well in .38 Spl. for instance.

2. I place a piece of coffee can lid (the soft plastic type from a metal coffee can) over the mouth of the recharged case. Sitting the case upright on an absolutely flat metal surface (the anvil portion of my bench vise works well), I lightly tap the wooden block with a small hammer. The block allows the case to cut its own individual wad from the coffee can lid. No "sharpening" of the case is necessary beyond a chamfer as is normally used in reloading.

3. This wad is pressed down on the powder charge using a wooden pencil's eraser end. If you make a pin hole in the wad, it'll allow the air to escape making seating easier. You want the 'over powder wad' right down on the powder. I use two over powder wads to ensure a good gas seal.

4. I then dip the case in a tray of shot till it's filled to about 1/16" from the top, allowing for another coffee can wad to be cut and seated. I then lightly crimp the case and apply a sealant to the edge of the over-shot wad; made of Testor's model airplane paint or Crazy Glue. This helps keep the slick wad from working loose in pocket or shell loop.

Using the primed and charged case to cut its own wad sounds risky till you try it out. It's fine in reality, just be sure to use a good solid, absolutely flat surface.

These shot loads work well on snakes, or as non-lethal loads against canine attackers or in the barn where you don't want to put a hole in the roof shooting pigeons. The #12 shot is good for these purposes, but can be hard to obtain. I bought 5 lbs. 20 years ago and haven't made a dent my supply yet. My friends and I have put the final chapter to half a dozen rattlers and copperheads using the above assembled loads. Leading has not been a problem in the snubbies we've used to date.

As to using cardboard for wads, I could never find an effective wad cutter. The sharpened case method didn't work at all...The soft plastic wads I use are thin enough, not to limit the amount of shot I could fit in the smaller cases and were effective as a gas seal. Be sure to weigh the shot in the first one you make up, to be sure of a safe powder charge. The pattern at 8 feet for a .38 Spl. using #12 shot is about a foot across, but does have some holes in it, presumably from the rifling. For that reason, if I'm fishing down in the Carolinas, I carry a M-36 Smith Chief's special with 3 shot cartridges and two hollow points. I shoot twice at the snakes, then check for damage. If they need finishing, I've got the last round and the two HP's.

Best Regards, Rod

[JMtoolman]

I have also made shot loads for the 44 Mag. out of 30/40 Krag brass. Cut to cyl. length or about .010 shorter. Full length size in a 44 mag die, then run full length into a 44 seating die. I used to load with a charge of bullseye. I seated wads about the same as everyone here, and cut a rectangle out of a milk carton that would just wrap around the inside of the case once. Filled up the case with #11 shot, capped it with a wad and crimped the case. The 30/40 case lets you get quite a bit more shot in the case. You can also use 303 British cases the same way. I used to anneal the case mouth before loading so the crimping would be easy. I have shot birds out of the air with them! The plastic slides on the rifleing and doesn't throw the shot as much as a bare bore does.
The toolman.

[Scharfschuetze]

Nicely done post Rugerfan.

I have a supply of plastic shot cups for the 38 Special/357 Magnum and that makes loading those calibres pretty easy.

I make my own 41 Magnum shot shells out of 30/30 brass cut to the length of the cylinder and with the rims turned down to fit inside my S&W Model 58's star. When they fire form to the charge hole on first firing, they swell a bit at the web, but they seem to last forever and they seal the charge holes well.

For the 45 ACP, I use 308 Winchester cases and a special form die set by RCBS to form the cases. There is an extensive thread on the 45 ACP shot loads elsewhere in the fora. Back when we still carried the 1911A1 in the service, I always took a few magazines of 'em with me and they provided meat for the canteen cup on several assignments.

[Newtire]

I have also made shot loads for the 44 Mag. out of 30/40 Krag brass. Cut to cyl. length or about .010 shorter. Full length size in a 44 mag die, then run full length into a 44 seating die. I used to load with a charge of bullseye. I seated wads about the same as everyone here, and cut a rectangle out of a milk carton that would just wrap around the inside of the case once. Filled up the case with #11 shot, capped it with a wad and crimped the case. The 30/40 case lets you get quite a bit more shot in the case. You can also use 303 British cases the same way. I used to anneal the case mouth before loading so the crimping would be easy. I have shot birds out of the air with them! The plastic slides on the rifleing and doesn't throw the shot as much as a bare bore does.
The toolman.
Another guy I know makes the cases out of .444 Marlin brass shortened down and resized. I'm going to have to try that. I like the idea of the shot wrapper. I find also that the .410 shot cups are too loose fitting and take up too much room. The wrapper is like the original Winchester Mark 5 loads for shotguns. I like it! Haven't used Bullseye in the .44 yet. What kind of charge are we talking if you don't mind?

[Randy in Arizona]

I made 6 of them from some 303 British brass that extended clear to the front of the cylinder.
IIRC all I had to do was file the rim diameter down until it fit the cylinder, cut to length & fireform.
Without a long wad column it can approach the short range effectiveness of a .410 shotgun.
Cleaning the crud out of the rifling wasn't too bad.

71

[RugerFan]

First grouse of the year!

https://i.postimg.cc/02YTKcdn/ruffy.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

[5Shot]

First grouse of the year!

https://s20.postimg.org/lx8cerggd/ruffy.jpg (https://postimg.org/image/6oif0zmrt/)image hosting over 10mb (https://postimage.org/)

Nice! Taking some out with me this weekend.

[dkf]

My test loads in .44mag with power pistol and #8 shot went well.(Ruger Redhawk 5.5") Groups were nice at 7 yards with a lot of shot in on the area of a paper plate and I could easily fit 150gr of #8 shot. Only problem I had with them is they hurt when you shoot them. Not the recoil, but the shot bouncing off the rubber backstop at the range, coming back and pelting me in the face. Good thing I was earing glasses.

I was using the fiber and aluminum GC shotshell sets that Sage Outdoors sells.

[RugerFan]

I was using the fiber and aluminum GC shotshell sets that Sage Outdoors sells.

I was wondering how those worked. Let us know if you kill anything with those loads.

[Sur-shot]

I thought that is what meat trays and egg cartons were for, making shot shells. Also cut off an old case at the base with a cut off wheel and wrap it with about a half inch strip of duct tape so I can get fingers on it, to twist it. sharpen the edge, cuts right through and works with a wood block and a mallet if you want. Push wads out with a new pencil never sharpened. Powder; fast burning, Bullseye, shot, #9 or smaller, double wad the bottom, use pencil to compress like a ram rod, and wad the top with a dripped wax water proof sealer on top after a crimp is added to assist in loading. A 50 round box of these lasts about 10 years. Problem is, you forget where they are when in a hurry and just shoot the snake with a solid and be done with it. :-)
Ed

[bouncer50]

I have also made shot loads for the 44 Mag. out of 30/40 Krag brass. Cut to cyl. length or about .010 shorter. Full length size in a 44 mag die, then run full length into a 44 seating die. I used to load with a charge of bullseye. I seated wads about the same as everyone here, and cut a rectangle out of a milk carton that would just wrap around the inside of the case once. Filled up the case with #11 shot, capped it with a wad and crimped the case. The 30/40 case lets you get quite a bit more shot in the case. You can also use 303 British cases the same way. I used to anneal the case mouth before loading so the crimping would be easy. I have shot birds out of the air with them! The plastic slides on the rifleing and doesn't throw the shot as much as a bare bore does.
The toolman. Why use 30-40 or 303 for the 44 cal. I used 30-30 brass a lot cheaper and common to find. I would save the 303 to make 410 shot shell for your 410 shotgun.

[dkf]

I was wondering how those worked. Let us know if you kill anything with those loads.

I was putting the fiber card on the powder and pushing it down with a rammer I made. The check was put on top of the shot. The check did move around a bit on top of the shot. I think I'm going to add some more shot so the check is a little higher in the case so the crimp holds it better. I was thinking of also trying to dripp on some paraffin wax to help hold the check in place and to ad somewhat of a seal.

[trapper9260]

I put 2 cards, I cut from a cracker box over the powder I take a wooden dow that fit in the case and push the cards in place and then I put one over the shot.and crimp it light and use wax I dip the case in to seal the card for the over shot. I dip it 2 times first time I dip and then remove all the heavy wax off with a small flat screw drive and then dip again and just remove off the case and then done.

[mart]

RugerFan,

Good post and pictures. Thanks for the tip on sizing the gas checks. I started using the same method (without sizing the checks) 20+ years ago for snake loads. I lived in eastern WA at the time and the only handgun I had was a 41 mag. I remember I had a little difficulty seating the unsized checks. I'll give those a try with the sized checks. Thanks

Mart

[Ballistics in Scotland]

There isn't much danger in this kind of reloading. Long before pressures become dangerous, you would get unacceptable shot patterns, through excessive muzzle pressure or shot fusing together.

The first gun I ever owned without air coming into it was the Webley 9mm. rimfire shotgun. It gave pretty good patterns with only a single-layer moulded cardboard cup wad, open end facing rearwards. I don't think calibers like this are nearly as sensitive to quality of wadding as larger shotguns.

I'm doubtful about the use of gas-checks. The pattern is liable to pass around the one at the front, and the one at the rear won't be left behind as quickly as a lighter one. I'd be more inclined to use card or waxed felt. If a wad punch doesn't cut cleanly enough (which one sharpened to a thin edge should), spinning the punch in a lathe or a drill-press should do so. A lathe or a drill with a hole down the spindle would let you knock it out with a metal rod. Over the shot I would use a thinner, frangible card sealed with wax.

[RugerFan]

There isn't much danger in this kind of reloading. Long before pressures become dangerous, you would get unacceptable shot patterns, through excessive muzzle pressure or shot fusing together.

The first gun I ever owned without air coming into it was the Webley 9mm. rimfire shotgun. It gave pretty good patterns with only a single-layer moulded cardboard cup wad, open end facing rearwards. I don't think calibers like this are nearly as sensitive to quality of wadding as larger shotguns.

I'm doubtful about the use of gas-checks. The pattern is liable to pass around the one at the front, and the one at the rear won't be left behind as quickly as a lighter one. I'd be more inclined to use card or waxed felt. If a wad punch doesn't cut cleanly enough (which one sharpened to a thin edge should), spinning the punch in a lathe or a drill-press should do so. A lathe or a drill with a hole down the spindle would let you knock it out with a metal rod. Over the shot I would use a thinner, frangible card sealed with wax.

Shooting paper to check patterns didn't reveal any issues. I even stacked up a bunch of empty pizza boxes and was surprised at the penetration achieved (at approx 10 yds). Interestingly enough, the gas checks even penetrated several layers. I thought the checks would have slowed down quicker. Many folks use other materials for the cups (cardboard, plastic, styrofoam, etc). I have used plastic disks as well. Easy to experiment and go with what works. These loads have been deadly on small game for me.

[NavyVet1959]

I've used .357 mag cases with a wad of paper towel (about 1" square) pressed tight over the powder and then shot (or spent primer cups) filling the rest of the case, and some wax on the top to hold everything inside of it. Good enough for rats and such.

I recently tried the same thing with a single-shot .22LR rifle using the .22 power loads (nail gun blanks). The base wad, shot, and front wad were shoved in from the muzzle after the power load had already been chambered.

[Norske]

Doesn't Speer still sell those blue plastic shot cylinders for handgun calibers? I loaded some in the past, but never came across a rattler in the field so didn't use them.

[RugerFan]

Doesn't Speer still sell those blue plastic shot cylinders for handgun calibers? I loaded some in the past, but never came across a rattler in the field so didn't use them.

Yes, but only in .357, .44 and .45 cal. Doesn't help if you have a .41 mag, .475 Linebaugh etc.

Besides, gas checks and similar materials are much cheaper that the Speer capsules.

[Dryball]

Great post. I can't remember where I read it (maybe even here) but someone was making shot cups (similar to Speer) out of milk jug plastic. They even had instructions and pics.

[NavyVet1959]

Here's the pattern I got with 55gr of shot muzzle loaded into a .22 rifle with the paper towel wad over the .22 power shot and over the top of the shot.

http://images.spambob.net/navy-vet-1959/muzzle-load-22-shot-480w.jpg

I'm not sure what caused the large hole on the left side though. Maybe torn by something else? Maybe one of the paper towel wads?

[Cold Trigger Finger]

My problem is squirrels. The #9 shot CCI45 ACP isn't getting enough penetration at 30 feet. If it hit a bone close to the skin it would break it well . But , body hits lacked penetration. I'm gonna try #6 shot.

[MT Gianni]

Great post. I can't remember where I read it (maybe even here) but someone was making shot cups (similar to Speer) out of milk jug plastic. They even had instructions and pics.

See the sticky at the top of this subforum.

[Alferd Packer]

Great post. I can't remember where I read it (maybe even here) but someone was making shot cups (similar to Speer) out of milk jug plastic. They even had instructions and pics.

You are right.
Gearnasher here on cast bullets has a system for making the shot cylinders from plastic milk jug material.

[sniper]

I recently bought a couple of boxes of 357 Maximum brass to make snake loads for my 357 Magnum. (Bigger payload!)They are too long to chamber in 357 cylinders, and it is recomended to size the case mouths in a .222 Remington die, so the cases fit. I had planned to use Gas Checks for over-powder and over shot wads, but reality struck. Can't put a 35 caliber gas check into the resized case mouth! Drat! I figure full caliber soft plastic powder wads can be bent to fit into the case after it's sized and powdered, then case mouth size plastic over-shot wads can be glued in to secure the load. Am I on the right track here, or is there something I haven't thought of that will rise up and bite me in the hip?[smilie=b: Orrr...My Speer shot capsules stick out of the case longer than the Maximum brass, so will the shot load be about the same:shock:?
I haven't bought the .222 dies yet, so is this something that should be filed under "It seemed like a good idea at the time"?

[owejia]

Have done full length shot loads for my 1937 Brazilian revolvers. The throats in your 357 mag cylinder should be about .357 so what ever sizing die will size them small enough to slide into the throats should work. For my 45 acp revolver loads I size down .308 LC brass to fit into the cylinder throats and cut them to almost the full length of the cylinder. I use a thin card board wad over my powder, but also use a 410 shot wad to hold the shot, the wad is cut just short enough for a clear plastic wad [cut from 1 gallon ice cream buckets] to seat over the shot and put a roll crimp to hold every thing in place. A cutter can be made from a 357 mag brass hull sharpened on the end and deprimed so you can use a paper clip or small nail to press the cut wad out of the brass. Have made bee killer loads out of the 357 maximum brass to use in a older s&w revolver that I bored the throats out so the Maximum brass would fit full length in the cylinder, these are loaded with walnut media and a card board over shot wad is glued in using clear finger nail polish. Could load these with lead shot also and clear plastic overshot wad and roll crimp to hold every thing together. I prefer to roll crimp over the lead shot to get enough resistance to get a full burn on my powder charge. With the clear plastic overshot wads you can see what is loaded in your cartridges.

[jmcghee]

Been wanting to make birdshot loads fo a while . I bought 357 max brass to try. Was thinking of using .32 sizer for for clyinder lenght shells Also 444 brass, with a 41 sizer. Thought I would have time to do this since i retired. Mamma decided she need a new kitchen, No time now lol