hopkins and allen advice

[Green Lizzard]

this little falling block was first chambered in 44 shot, last owner had it relined and chambered in 327 mag. all that have been fired in it were 32 h&r and 32 s&w long. head space still at .006. i am thinking of rechambering it in 32-20. i am aware that the receiver is soft sintered iron and that the barrel attatchment is somewhat iffy (thinking of soldering it) what do you guys think?

[Reg]

Picture, there are several models.

[Green Lizzard]

dont know how to do pics, the only markings on the whole rifle is (44 shot)

[pietro]

this little falling block was first chambered in 44 shot, last owner had it relined and chambered in 327 mag. all that have been fired in it were 32 h&r and 32 s&w long. head space still at .006. i am thinking of rechambering it in 32-20. i am aware that the receiver is soft sintered iron and that the barrel attatchment is somewhat iffy (thinking of soldering it)

what do you guys think?




I think that, since the .327 Fed has almost 2x the operating pressure of the H&R Mag, that it's a wonder the rifle's still in one piece (if it ever had some .327 fired in it).

If it were mine, I'd set if the lower pressure (16,000psi) .32-20 chamber would preclude chambering the higher pressure cartridges - and hope the action holds together.



.

[Green Lizzard]

pietro its never had a 327 fired in it

[Reg]

A couple of the H&A's did in fact have a very strong breeching system but most used a slip in barrel with a single locking screw to hold the whole thing together.
Even if the barrel had a threaded shank it would still be very iffy in my book with the 327 or even for the H&R Mag for that matter. With the slip in barrel --- no way.
One thing that most do not consider is the fact that steel will imbrittle with age. The older the steel ( or cast for that matter ) the more imbrittlement you will find.
Think not ? Just talk with anyone who works on older ( turn of the century, the other century ) farm machinery or anything from that era.

[Green Lizzard]

reg from what i understand it was test fired with h&r mag then s&w long only after, i was only thinking 32-20 (it is the takedown model) with the slip in barrel, but the more i think about it i may just leave it 32 s&w long. it was chambered in 327 mag does not mean they have to be shot in it. i do think a 327 fed mag would destroy this old thing

[NoZombies]

Stick with the .32 long! I have 3 of the H&A guns built on that action, and I've done a fair bit of work with them. The action is stronger than something like the Rem #4 RB takedown or the Stevens favorite, but not by much.

The .44 shot H&A's that I've seen were all built on the same action as the 932/junior. If in otherwise good shape, they're fine for the .32 S&W long, but I wouldn't even push beyond the factory loads for that caliber.

[KCSO]

Nothing over 32 long standard velocity, I would't even think of a HV 32-20 in one of these. 32-20 BP would be OK but how do you keep some one from slipping in a hot one?

[Green Lizzard]

nozombie what do you think of of my idea to solder the takedown barrel in?

[Green Lizzard]

kcso that was my thinking on rechambering it to 32-20 (keep someone from ever firing a 327 fed mag in it)

[badgeredd]

Personally I'd consider figuring out a way to set the barrel back and shoot 32 S&W Longs. There isn't much chance someone would hurt themselves with factory loads. ANYTHING hotter is asking for dire results. I would bet the single screw that holds the barrel in is more than adequate for 32 S&W Long and really don't see any advantage to soldering the barrel in. A friend has a early H&A that was originally chambered in 32 Rimfire and now is 32 Long. He is getting good accuracy and is somewhat amazed at how efficient the little cartridge is with factory equivalent loads and cast bullets.

Edd

PS...I would love to find another one to convert for myself...kinda thinking 32 ACP might be fun too.

[Green Lizzard]

badger i may some day do just that, for now all the brass that i have is 327 fed mag (32 s&w long loads) only thing shot in it up to this point is around 30 32 h&r mags by previous owner

[Baron von Trollwhack]

The great thing about cast boolits is the ability to shoot your cast boolits at any, including explosive levels.

In your case use the longer 32 cases to shoot milder loads deemed safe for long term use.

You will likely achiece good accuracy. BvT

[Green Lizzard]

baron thats kinda what i am thinking, guess i could just stamp the barrel SW32L and let it go. just worry down the road someone may get hurt firing a 327 mag in it

[NoZombies]

I tend to agree that there's no need to solder the barrel. While the single retaining screw is a weak point in the action, it's not likely to be as much of a problem as the block battering the receiver and the combination producing catastrophic headspace issues.

If it was me, I would pretty seriously consider having the barrel set back to prevent issues down the road. .32 long brass is relatively cheap.

[Green Lizzard]

zombie right now the headspace is .006 on a new case, will keep a check on it as testing goes along

[pietro]

kcso that was my thinking on rechambering it to 32-20 (keep someone from ever firing a 327 fed mag in it)


IMO, that's best - since the rifle may not be under your control forever, and some day (sure as shootin') an innocent will shoot whatever's designated on the bbl.


.

[uscra112]

All this advise is irrelevent until we know what size action this is. A small frame 922 or 932 action is only good up to .32 S&W Long. Medium frames were sold chambered for 38-55.

What I believe that O.P. has is a rare "taxidermists gun", made 1908-1915. Of these I have only seen the picture in the catalog, and cannot guess what frame it is on, given the poor quality of the picture. If it is indeed a taxidermist gun, any further butchery is sacrilege.

[Green Lizzard]

uscra it is a svelt little thing i suspect it is the 922 or 932 you refer to. this one was chambered in 44 shot.

[NoZombies]

All this advise is irrelevent until we know what size action this is. A small frame 922 or 932 action is only good up to .32 S&W Long. Medium frames were sold chambered for 38-55.

What I believe that O.P. has is a rare "taxidermists gun", made 1908-1915. Of these I have only seen the picture in the catalog, and cannot guess what frame it is on, given the poor quality of the picture. If it is indeed a taxidermist gun, any further butchery is sacrilege.

I have one, and have handled 3 others, they were built on the 932 action, but were of course, CF for the .44 XL shot. I've only seen one that hadn't been rechambered for .410 shells, and I seriously question the wisdom of shooting the gun with any .410 loads!

I currently have the CF block in a 932 for shooting .32 colt from one of mine.

[357maximum]

I have one of the little H&A's converted to 32Long and I love it. Look at the geometry of the gun and guess where the parts are going to go if someone ever did stick a 327Mag in there and touched er off. I would get the barrel set back so that it will not chamber the 327 or the 32 H&R for that matter......not all gun owners are as well versed as most of the folks who hang out here and you will not live forever......sooner or later that tool will end up in someone elses hand, and that feller might not know diddly.

[Green Lizzard]

kinda my line of thinking also max

[Chev. William]

Green Lizzard,
There is another way to stop someone from using a .327 Mag cartridge in your rifle. Back in the time USA changed over from using 30-06 cartridges to 7.62 NATO, they 'converted' many M1 rifles by fitting a 'bushing' in the chamber throat and a block in the Clip Well that: 1. made the chamber too short to hold a 30-06 round; and 2. made the Clip Well short enough so that an 'enblock' Clip loaded with 30-06 rounds would not go in.
A bushing made out of good steel slightly larger than the diameter of the front of the chamber long enough to set against the original chamber to throat 'ledge' to reduce the chamber length to the suitable cartridge length plus a small margin, then bored out just enough to pass the bullet but not he cartridge case diameter would 'press fit' into the chamber and stay in place through shooting and cleaning. it would take a determined effort ot remove it in the future, not some inadvertent use of a cleaning rod. Also once it is in place and you fire the rifle several times it will 'lock in any small depressions in the chamber area it is sitting in, further preventing its inadvertent removal.
As far as I know the M1 Rifles so converted never had a problem with the 'bushing' coming loose after being fired with 7.62 NATO rounds.
Best Regards,
Chev. William
P.S: This would also mean you would need to trim all your 'working' Brass to the new length and could then stamp the 'new case length' designation on the barrel. Chev. William