suggestions for a 30-06 pb mold ...

[rfd]

no gas check, will be loading light and probably well under 1500fps, plain base only, 170 grains or so ... ?

i know lyman has their 311410 130 grain pb mould, don't have a clue as to performance, and it's probably too light in mass weight.

[Outpost75]

If you want to go with a production, rather than a custom plainbased mold, the RCBS 30-150CM or Saeco 630

85092

85093

However, in my own '06s, I'm using the HM .312-160-5 from the current group buy, without the GC and have been getting great results with anywhere from 6 to 8.4 grains of Bullseye or 12 to 13 grains of #2400

850948509585096

[Ben]

I'm not certain that you'd be happy with a Lyman 311410.

I owned 3 of them, not a one of them shot a decent group in my 308 Win. or 30-06 rifles.

[rfd]

how 'bout a gas check boolit - i can get the g/c base reamed out to p/b. lyman 311291 good?

[Ben]

A 311291 would be a great choice............Ask me how I know ??

___________________________

This was written in a post about a year ago.
___________________________

I have a 2 cav. Lyman 311291 that has all the " right numbers " on the nose dia. readings and drive band mic readings. I had sent the mold to Erik for HP work on the front cavity of the mold. The bullets out of the front cavity can be flat pointed, cup pointed, or deep hp'd. The front cav. of the mold continues to keep the orig. factory g/c shank which fits my .014" AL gas checks very well.

Here is a link showing the cup point 311291's that come from this mold :

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?133711-311291-Cup-Point

I decided today that I'd remove the gas check shank on the rear cavity ( closest to the handle hinge pin ) and make a plain base bullet out of that cavity.

I'm well pleased with the results.

Now,...... to get some decent weather to go out to the range and test them.

The nose on this one is a nice round .301 ".

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/011-22_zpsf94637eb.jpg

Here is the bullet after it has been pushed through a Lee .311 " " Push Thru " sizer.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/003-39_zps364d26ad.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/007-26_zps3f92491b.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/005-26_zpsd460e4d4.jpg

I took the bullets that I cast today & sized them to .311" , lubed them with Ben's Red and lightly rolled in Lee Liquid Alox . They are drying in the photo below ( the LLA will give the nose some lubrication as it makes its trip down the barrel ) . This
routine has provided some pretty accurate plain based
.30 cal. bullets for me in the past :

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v494/haysb/Capture_zpsccc5701e.jpg

[Outpost75]

You could ream out the GC heel, but I would try the mold first without the GC and ensure it shoots well before putting any additional effort into it. If the rear driving band casts large enough to seal the throat, it will shoot fine without the GC in suitable mild loads using soft leads no to exceed 13 BHN, at velocities up to about 1300 fps. The only reason to more out the GC heel to make a plainbased bullet only is because the base band is too small.

These are two molds, an RCBS 30-180FN and an NEI 30-152 which had undersized bands and were reamed to plainbase by www.hollowpointmold.com Both shoot under 2 inch ten-shot groups at 100 yards in my .30-'06s now and I also use them in my .30-30s.8509785098

[rfd]

thanx ben, thanx fellers - just ordered the lyman 311291 ;)

[Ben]

rfd

I'm not trying to steer you toward or away from a Lee mold, but if you want to " wet your whistle " with plain base .30 cal. cast bullets, this might be an economical way to try it out.

My friend Ken has shot some of my plain based .30 cal. bullets.
He has enjoyed shooting tight groups and saving a little bit on powder and the additional cost of gas checks.

He wanted to order a Lee, .30 cal. mold with the express goal of removing the g/c shank in one of the cavities. I suggested the Lee. 180 gr. g/c version.

I told him that I'd help him with the project. I used a HSS , 5/16" drill bit that is razor sharp.

The bit cuts a super clean and concentric hole.

The project went well today. Kens bullets are miking .3115" with a .300" nose. Should be some good " numbers " for him.

Ben

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/001.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/002.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/003.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/005.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/010.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/011.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/012.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/018.jpg

[Ben]

Deleted

[rfd]

awesome, ben! thank you!

[Ben]

My friend Ken wanted to go to the range
today and test his plain base Lee 180 gr. bullets.

The bullets were sized .311" with both lube rings
filled with Ben's Red and then the entire bullet
rolled in thinned LLA. Once the bullets were dry
they were loaded in 5 round lots and fired.

10 rows of 5 ea. in the box, all rows had the same bullet,
the Lee 180 gr. Plain base sized .311.
Each row with a different propellant or different charge weight.
The OAL of the loaded round allowed each bullet to lightly
engrave with the nose of the bullet into the rifling.
CCI Large rifle primers were used.

Here are the results.
I'll have to post these photos of the test targets
in two different post to be able to display all 10 targets.

Ken's Ruger # 1 Stainless, 30-06
was used to test the plain based bullets today. 3 different
shooters were used with the targets being at a measured 50 yards.

BTW.....Row 6 shows a good bit of promise. We'll have to shoot
that load some more.

Thanks,
Ben

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/023.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Photo0884.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row1.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row2.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row3.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row4.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row5.jpg

[Ben]

Looks like we may have to load up more of row # 6. It was fairly impressive.


http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row6.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row7.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row8.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row9.jpg

http://i1155.photobucket.com/albums/p545/Ben35049/Row10.jpg

[rfd]

great results! i've got all of those powders, plus i'd wanna test out trail boss and aa5744, too ...

[rfd]

lyman's cast 4th edition shows the pb 130 grain 311410 using 19 to 23.5 grains of aa5744, 1404 - 1786 fps.

[Outpost75]

I never had much luck with 5744. I always got vertical stringing and erratic velocities, even with magnum primers.

In mild plainbased loads I've had great results in the '06 with Bullseye, WST, SR7625, PB, #2400, these work. I've shot thousands of them over the years.

You will save yourself alot of work if you do your initial charge establishment firing only 10-shot groups. Fewer shots in a group don't tell you much, unless you shoot not less than 25 consecutive rounds without excluding any data. A single ten-shot gropup can tell you alot because there are no "lucky" ten-shot groups. If you get a round 10-shot group with good central density in the 2 to 2-1/2 inch range or less at 100 yards, first crack out of the box, using iron sights in an accurate military bolt rifle, then you are onto something. If the ten-shot group is over 3 inches you don't waste your time fooling with that combination anymore.

Here is what visually culled only, not weighed or sorted bullets from a gang mold will do at 100 yards when shot out of a National Match '03 Springfield with Lyman 48 peep rear and Lyman 17A front aperture. Bullets were lightly tumbled in Lee Liquid Alox, loaded as-cast and unsized, velocity of this load is about 1250 fps. No case filler was used. No attempt made to orient the powder charge, just shove them into the magazine with a stripper clip, crank the bolt and bang off each 5-shot string in about 30 seconds, reload, then do it again. Wait 5 minutes between each 10-shot group, repeat.



85105

[Outpost75]

lyman's cast 4th edition shows the pb 130 grain 311410 using 19 to 23.5 grains of aa5744, 1404 - 1786 fps.

You will get best accuracy with plainbased bullets keeping the velocity below about 1400 fps. No Lyman accuracy load published was ever shot by them on paper, they simply indicate which load gave the most uniform velocity and pressure. Working up loads by shooting over a chronograph instead of shooting groups on paper is mental masturbation. Once you get a load that shoots good groups CONSISTENTLY for 50 or more consecutive rounds, without leading, THEN is the time to chronograph it so that you know where the "sweet" spot is. Because when you use different cases or primers or powder from another production lot, or change from summer to winter, things won't be the same, so you adjust and return to your benchmark.

[rfd]

thanx - i'll save my aa5744 for the big gun, 45-70.

[Ben]

I must be doing something wrong.......Me and 5744 just never seem to work well with each other.

Ben

[rfd]

maybe not for little 30 cal lead, but works quite well for me in 45-70 with 535 grain postell boolits. some of the long range s/s folks use it with better than good results, too.

it's all good, if it works for ya. ;)

[rfd]

i started using .03 and .06 under boolit wads with my 45-70 and got better groups @ 100 yards (aa5744 and 535 postell). i use a fred cornell wad punch die and veggie wad sheets.

anyone use these kinda wads for a 30 cal pb boolit?

[rfd]

not an over-the-powder wad, an under-the-boolit-wad (as long as the boolit doesn't go deeper than where the case neck meets the end of the bottle neck. the wad is a tad (.002") wider than the boolit's base diameter. it gets forced into the case during boolit seat and stays there under it, not on top of the powder charge.