Size recommended for cast boolit 444 marlin.

[s mac]

I have just acquired a mold for my 444, a real nice NOE ranch dog that cast my alloy at .431-.432. My bore slugs .429, do you guys see any problem trying to load, shoot as cast or do I need to purchase a sizer? If so, what size would you recommend for my microgroove Marlin? Also I would like to use without a gascheck. smac

[Shuz]

I 'spose you could pan lube them and try shooting without a gas check, but I'd keep the velocity under 1200fps or you'll get leading. For me, that speed defeats the purpose of a .444. I shoot a Winnie Trapper at 1200 fps without a gas check and it does fine. When I tried shooting a hardened PB 429640 outta my .444 it didn't shoot worth sour owl manure and leaded somewhat. The velocity, tho was 2144 fps. I recently golombed onto a stock 429640 with the gas check groove, and I'll try this design again at that speed and it should work. My RD 265's and MP-433-300HP's do and they don't lead at that velocity with gas checks. By the way, both of my .444 Marlins like .432 diameter boolits. YMMV

[s mac]

I did load a dummy round, it chambered but required a bit of effort to close the bolt, not alot but more than the hornady I use to load.

[Beerd]

When you extract the dummy does the bullet nose show rifling marks? You may have to seat a hair shorter.
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[s mac]

Dummy indeed had rifling marks. More than a hair.

[longbow]

Controversial I know but I used to have an 1885 Marlin .45-70 and a Siamese Mauser converted to .45-70 and found I was getting some leading with hot loads but only in the Mauser and near the muzzle. A .410 fiber wad between powder and boolit solved it.

Loads were from the Hornady book and for the Marlin but with "J" boolits.

At the time I wasn't real knowledgeable about cast boolits but was getting good accuracy and performance except for this minor leading near the muzzle of the Mauser.

I was using all PB boolits at "J" bullet loads and velocities and mostly the Lyman 457124 385 gr.

To solve the problem I dropped a .410 fiber wad in on top of the powder. That nicely filled the air space, stopped the leading and did not show any signs of pressure problems.

I have worked up several loads using various fillers and had no problems at all. While many recommend against fillers, in my opinion if the load is worked up with the filler there is no problem.

Just an option you might want to consider. However, if you add a filler of any sort you should download then work back up using filler as you work up powder charges.

Longbow

[blikseme300]

I use the RD265 with GC sized and seated using a Lee push through die set. Lube is 45-45-10 and accuracy is good and no leading. The 444 is designed to be pushed hard so I have not tried to shoot without GC's as that would defeat to objective of a hard hitting 44.

[Beerd]

Just checked my notes.
I size my 300 grain version to .432"
My overall length is 2.555", data from Ranch Dog web site shows 2.550".
I have always used a gas check on this bullet. My load with IMR4198 approaches 2000 ft/sec.
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[s mac]

Thanks for your replies, I guess I need to come up with some gas checks. s mac

[bigted]

the 300 grain boolit from Lyman casts .431 in my mold and has the snoose to penetrate clear thru a very large ...[around 1200 pounds] moose ... and not be found. it took out the off side shoulder and the range was 45 yards. I pushed it to 1900 FPS with RL-7. these click along and thump outta my marlin short barrel. the holes in the muzzle were so obnoxious ... I removed them with a hacksaw just short of the counterbore so the crown was left intact. it still is absolutely obnoxious in the noise level but nuttin compared to those little holes in the muzzle. filing the muzzle flat and bluing it with insta blue. this is way handy and I wont ever be selling it as it fits well in the tent or boat without taking too much room to swing in the event of a 4-legged intruder with 4 inch fingernails and 3 inch teeth. I now have a marlin short barrel in stainless and 45-70 but the little 444 will never be replaced as it has a spot reserved in my fondness ... we have history together!

[Shuz]

bigted--I'm curious about the "holes in the muzzle". Could you please explain? How did they get there? What was their supposed function? Was your rifle this way from the factory? The only holes I've ever seen have been the Mag-Na-Port variety, and I will never own one of those noisy buggers!

[bigted]

yes it had those offending holes from the factory. it had a short barrel that measured at 18 inches with the holes and after snippin the holed area off it now measures at almost 17 inch's. the model is a 444P model. it has factory checkering on the straight grip area as well as the fore arm. killed my first Alaskan moose with it.

this little rifle is just the shis nis for tight places either in camp or in the brush. it hangs well for skinning moose when in the thick stuff when something more then a pistol is wanted for protection from that dinner bell that rang just before the skinning began. this is around 4 or 5 inches shorter then my Ruger #1. I have a marples peep on the receiver and a high viz front ... very nice combo.

those 300 grainers require me to use the short Hornaday Leverlution cases that were from the factory short to allow the pointed bullets to feed thru the lever action. these cases are just perfect for this boolit as the nose is just long enough that it wont work thru the action when loaded in regular length cases for the 444 marlin. well worth the trouble tho ... my what a thumper in a nice short package.

[Shuz]

those 300 grainers require me to use the short Hornaday Leverlution cases that were from the factory short to allow the pointed bullets to feed thru the lever action. these cases are just perfect for this boolit as the nose is just long enough that it wont work thru the action when loaded in regular length cases for the 444 marlin. well worth the trouble tho ... my what a thumper in a nice short package.[/QUOTE]

Or you could just seat the 429650 over the front shoulder, crimp there, and use regular length cases, eh?

[bigted]

have to check it out ...thanks.

[bigted]

yep works like a dream. now I load in the regular length cases and can shovel in 42 grains of IMR3031. a bit dirty with some kernels left in the barrel but my do these things fly. this lil bucker will skin my knuckles if I aint real careful how I hold it for shooting. these will bust rocks that are 6 to 8 inch in diameter off hand everytime when I do my part ... that is all I care about ... it isn't a benchrest rifle nohow so im happy with the Lyman gas checked boolit that throws at 325 grain from that mold ... that is bare without lube nor gas check.

the 42 grain load is having the boolit setting on the powder pretty hard so what with crimping over the last band they stay rite where they are suppose to be under recoil. this little hummer is definitely a 100 + yard thumper/ brush gun / camp buddy extra-ordinare. lite ... easy to swing ... fast on target ... plenty power ... hangs over the shoulder on a sling like a hero! I hope others like their 444 marlins like I do.

will never get rid of my 45-70's but this lil hummer has a home as long as I drag breath.

[Shuz]

What was the velocity of your 42g 3031 load?

[bigted]

don't have a clue. as hard as they come back tho im thinkin that they should be around 1800 or 1900 FPS.

[helice]

Every boolit I use in the 444 M has a different nose configuration and therefore a different seating depth. That Ranch Dog Boolit is a prime mover and of intelligent design. Once you find the proper seating depth you'll be in "sweet clover."
P.S. Your will love the 444M with cast. They were made for each other.