Aluminum boolits

[junkman1967]

Anyone ever cast aluminum into boolits? Just curious

[capt.hollis]

I don't think that'd be a great idea.

[WallyM3]

That'd be a mighty warm drop.

Depending on alloy: 850F to 1250F (approx.).

[Stephen Cohen]

I read that the American military did some trials with aluminium projectiles, it was claimed velocities of 6000fps were obtainable. I very much doubt they would be much use for anything. Caliber was 30/06.

[TheGrimReaper]

Would be neat to turn all my empty coke and beer cans into projos!!!

[rmatchell]

I might be wrong but i think some cannon shells have been cast aluminum

[Wally]

Aluminum would be hard to cast and is much less dense than Lead---it could be swagged, but it is a poor substitute for lead. Zinc would be better.

[dondiego]

Don't try casting aluminum in a Lee mold! You will get a surprise.

[bangerjim]

Arnold encountered a gun that spit Al boolits in the movie (I believe) "Eraser". But, then, that was military sci-fi.

They would be VERY light and would take probably way more powder than your case would even hold to get velocities you need/want.

Al is normally injection molded by specialized automated molding machines or, as I did in one of my Metals Engineering Technologies classes in college, cast in cope & drag molds using ultrafine casting sand and forms of what you want to cast. The temps would be beyond the reach of most hobby casters....as noted above.

Yes, aluminum is very prevalent. But leave it for boats, beer cans, and screen doors! :bigsmyl2:

banger

[bhn22]

Don't try casting aluminum in a Lee mold! You will get a surprise.

That sounds like bitter experience talking...

[dondiego]

That sounds like bitter experience talking...

Not really but it just seems that if you are pouring molten aluminum into an aluminum mold.............

[Smoke4320]

Not really but it just seems that if you are pouring molten aluminum into an aluminum mold.............

but if you use the English version Al-lew-minium and pour it into a unubtainium mold you will have something :) :) or maybe nothing

[oldpapps]

Good thought but....

Comparatively very low density, would loose velocity, momentum very fast. Aluminum oxide is a great abrasive, just what I want to push down my barrel. Hardness could be adjusted so, no aluminuming (sort of like leading). Less to get going, so great velocities for short distances.

Gold would be great except it could become very costly quick.
Copper, copper alloys, would work. Oh, that's right Kalafonia already uses that.
Iron filings (or any other heavy/er material) set in some epoxy could work.

I think I will stick with lead and sometimes put a coating on it or it into a can of some other metal.

Keep thinking.

Enjoy,

OSOK

[JakeBlanton]

Might be interesting to see a plot of the trajectory of such a bullet. Wiffle Ball trajectory, perhaps? :)

[WiederladerTV]

Don't try casting aluminum in a Lee mold! You will get a surprise.

LOL...with this you can modify a 452 mold to cast some nice 9mm boolits ;)

[dverna]

I read that the American military did some trials with aluminium projectiles, it was claimed velocities of 6000fps were obtainable. I very much doubt they would be much use for anything. Caliber was 30/06.

I thought I read somewhere that it was impossible to drive a bullet faster than 4700 fps due to the way smokeless powder burns???

Don Verna

[Hickory]

Aluminum is the material of choice for projectiles in the rail gun and can reach velocities at 6000+ fps.

[MtGun44]

Lots of shrinkage, high temps, low mass, PITA all the way around.

Bill

[Jayhawkhuntclub]

My dad has always pronounced it loonamon, FWIW.

I think one of the big problems with loonamon bullets would be the lack of mass. Seems they would slow down in a hurry

[Shiloh]

WOnder if galling would be a problem with aluminum boolits.

Shiloh

[Thompsoncustom]

When Casting zinc bullets I add as much aluminum as it will take seems to work like Tin in lead and really helps with fill out but never tired a straight aluminum bullet.

[old beekeeper]

Never had any experience with aluminum, but can tell you, I did cast some zinc bullets, I had one steel mold and saved aside some zinc wheel weights and got them hot enough to pour, was not at all impressed with them, and they left some funny looking stuff in the bore of my .357 marlin. So much for experimentation. Think I will stick with lead wheel weights. By the way, I am finding more and more zinc and other stuff in wheelweights that I get from my sources, the bid dealerships are getting worse with mostly steel and some kind of conglomeration that is painted to match the wheel covers. I guess the "green" thing has creeped into the manufacture of wheel weights and lead is becoming a persona non grata.

Beekeeper

[andreadavide]

With some friends we made some 9mm alu bullets turning a round bar in a lathe.
@15 yards they are even fun, but not worth the hassle.

[BAGTIC]

A light aluminum bullet would require less powder to reach equal energy levels. The problems is that a bullet's BC is proportional to its density so it would loose velocity very fast. A typical aluminum casting alloy would have a density about 24.5% of lead so its BC would be about 24.5% of the lead bullet. Such a bullet whether of aluminum, zinc, or some other substance might actually have some value for extremely short range use. For example for police use it would quickly loose velocity and energy making bystanders safer from stray shots. Considering that the vast majority of shots fired are misses this might prevent a great many injuries/deaths to people 'down the block' or 'across the street'. Most effective shots by police are at very short ranges where lightweight bullets would still be fairly effective.

[BAGTIC]

When Casting zinc bullets I add as much aluminum as it will take seems to work like Tin in lead and really helps with fill out but never tired a straight aluminum bullet.

What effect does the aluminum have on the hardness/ductility of the zinc bullets? I have some experience with the commercially cast Zee Bullets and wonder how the zinc/aluminum alloys would differ.

[JakeBlanton]

A light aluminum bullet would require less powder to reach equal energy levels. The problems is that a bullet's BC is proportional to its density so it would loose velocity very fast. A typical aluminum casting alloy would have a density about 24.5% of lead so its BC would be about 24.5% of the lead bullet. Such a bullet whether of aluminum, zinc, or some other substance might actually have some value for extremely short range use. For example for police use it would quickly loose velocity and energy making bystanders safer from stray shots. Considering that the vast majority of shots fired are misses this might prevent a great many injuries/deaths to people 'down the block' or 'across the street'. Most effective shots by police are at very short ranges where lightweight bullets would still be fairly effective.

From what I've read of reports of police shootings, although their hit ratio tends to be rather low, surprisingly you don't see a lot of bystanders getting hit either. The phrase "couldn't hit the broadside of a barn" comes to mind. :)

[Thompsoncustom]

What effect does the aluminum have on the hardness/ductility of the zinc bullets? I have some experience with the commercially cast Zee Bullets and wonder how the zinc/aluminum alloys would differ.

Well I don't have a hardness tester so I'm not sure on the exact hardness of any of my zinc alloy bullets but there all crazy hard. Adding alum to zinc is like adding tin to lead you don't have to do it but it helps the alloy flow and bullet fill out.

Zamak 3(alum and zinc) according to WIKI has a Brinell hardness of 97

I plan on getting a better heating source or improving the one I have this year and trying some Zamak 2 casting for a rifle of mine. Zamak 2 has a hardness of 130 brinell. I ran the number though quickload and I think I can push a 70gr zamak 2 boolit out of my mosin nagant at just over 4000fps should be great for punching steel.

[Dale in Louisiana]

I thought I read somewhere that it was impossible to drive a bullet faster than 4700 fps due to the way smokeless powder burns???

Don Verna


Uh, the armor-piercing fin-stabilized projectile for the M1A1 Abrams leaves the muzzle at 5250 FPS if I recall correctly. We used to shoot a training round from the M60A1's 105mm gun that was 4850 FPS.

dale in Louisiana

[Dale in Louisiana]

In the Seventies the Army wanted a training round that would emulate 105mm APDS-T, a saboted armor-piercing round that leaves the muzzle at 4850 FPS. Due to the velocity and ballistics characteristics of the real round, very few ranges would allow for shooting the full load due to the fact that it would go miles and miles if it ricocheted or failed to hit a backstop. The tungsten carbide projectile was a little monster, ballistically speaking.

They came up with a training round that replaced the tungsten carbide projectile with one of aluminum. Out to 2000 meters it was ballistically identical to the real round, but the aluminum as much lower weight and velocity dropped off very fast after that, giving us something we could practice with on regular ranges.

The Germans make plastic training ammo for small arms that does a similar function, i.e., ballistically identical at short ranges. I have 500 rounds of their 7.62x51mm here at the house.

dale in Louisiana

[dkf]

I would think you would have to die cast aluminum under pressure to get uniform bullets without load. Better off machining them on a CNC lathe out of bar stock IMO.

[Garyshome]

You would need to turn them rather than cast. Anyone have a lathe handy? How about an aluminum jacket? Too hard for the barrel.

[mikeym1a]

In the Seventies the Army wanted a training round that would emulate 105mm APDS-T, a saboted armor-piercing round that leaves the muzzle at 4850 FPS. Due to the velocity and ballistics characteristics of the real round, very few ranges would allow for shooting the full load due to the fact that it would go miles and miles if it ricocheted or failed to hit a backstop. The tungsten carbide projectile was a little monster, ballistically speaking.

They came up with a training round that replaced the tungsten carbide projectile with one of aluminum. Out to 2000 meters it was ballistically identical to the real round, but the aluminum as much lower weight and velocity dropped off very fast after that, giving us something we could practice with on regular ranges.

The Germans make plastic training ammo for small arms that does a similar function, i.e., ballistically identical at short ranges. I have 500 rounds of their 7.62x51mm here at the house.

dale in Louisiana

Is that german practice ammo plastic cased?

[Dale in Louisiana]

Is that german practice ammo plastic cased?

Yep. The bullet and care are one piece of injection-molded blue (the NATO standard for training ammo) plastic. When you shoot it, the bullet detaches at an engineered weak point. They won't function an M-1A.

I have a case a buddy of mine picked up in a Louisiana training area of a similar care (fired) in .50 BMG.

dale in Louisiana

[koehlerrk]

Hmmm, yes, an all-aluminum projectile would make for a fun short-range round... Might have to investigate this further...

[Dale in Louisiana]

Hmmm, yes, an all-aluminum projectile would make for a fun short-range round... Might have to investigate this further...
Might be a fun job to tool up one of those little mini-lathes. With some simple tooling, you should be able to convert aluminum rod stock into some spire point bullets. I think I'd do most of the body at bore diameter with a couple of driving bands at groove diameter plus a thousandth, for starters. Then, with a smidge of pistol powder?

Interesting.

dale in Louisiana

[Elkins45]

How about long, sub-caliber projectiles to minimize frontal area and maximize BC? You would need to shoot them with sabots, of course. Sort of like shooting javelins.

I suppose we could cast them with fins/fetching and shoot them in smoothbores like the Abrams.