Uberti 1873 44 Magnum Carbine

[ironhead7544]

Found a couple of threads on this carbine but no real review. Thinking of getting one. I have a lot of 44 brass/bullets. Was looking for a 44 Special but seems not available.

Anyone out there have one of these?

Wouldnt be using 44 Mag pressures a lot except maybe for hunting. 200 gr cast at 1200-1300 mostly.

Thanks, Bob

[ironhead7544]

Bill: If I find anything I will put it here. I think I saw a youtube video some time back. Was from Europe, Germany I think. Shot a few rounds with no problem.

I did find where someone called Uberti about it. He was told the metal was specially hardened. They were unable to get case colors so it is made in a blued receiver only. I guess I may have to buy one to get any info.

Do you like your 44 Special 1873? Any problems? What cartridge OAL will work? What bullets have you tried? I would like one of those or an 1866.

[35 Whelen]

I have an 1873 in .44 Special. I shoot a 170 gr. RNFP for CAS, and a 260 gr. SWC out of an RCBS 44-250KT mould for all other things. Even though the two loads differ somewhat in o.a.l., it feeds both just fine.

I've gotten up to a little over 1400 fps with the 260 gr. bullet using W-296.

I've been eyeing one of those Uberti .44 Magnums too. Had I seen them before I bought my .44 Special, I'd have bought one.

35W

[HDS]

The 44mag version would be great platform I think for mild 44 mags and stout 44 specials.

[Norseman1]

Not to bring this thread up from the dead but...

I just got an 1873 .44 Mag Carbine tonight and when I tried to cycle one of my 1.685 OAL .44 Magnum case, 429421, 9.5 grains Unique it was too long. The Lyman manual calls for 1.710 max OAL for this bullet but 1.685 is what I have always loaded them to. I have lots and lots of these bullets and shoot them exclusively in all of my .44 sixguns. I got the .44 Magnum carbine because I have so many of the 429421 bullets and a lot more magnum brass than special. Has anyone gotten the 429421 to run in one of these new carbines? I'm the opposite of you Whelen, I wanted a Special Sporting Rifle with the checkered pistol grip in .44 Special but all of my sixguns in .44 are magnums save for one Uberti SAA in .44 Special. I have a consecutive pair of old Vaquero's in .44 Mag and wanted the '73 to go with those for CAS shooting (which I have never done yet). I didn't want to shoot tons of Specials out of the magnum revolvers and deal with leading the cylinders up or having to get more Special brass. I have literally 1000+ rounds of mag brass vs. 200 rounds of Special.

[35 Whelen]

WOW! I had forgotten about this thread. I have since bought a Uberti 1873 carbine in .44 Magnum too. Hands down, it is the slickest out of the box action I've ever operated. I've owned it for over a year and still get wobble-kneed when I see her in the laundry room gun rack! OK, now for your issue....

I'm afraid the SAAMI o.a.l. for the .44 Magnum is 1.610" and the 1873 rifles, even the old ones, have carrier blocks that are 1.610" in length. So, the o.a.l. of any cartridge in the '73's is limited to the length of the carrier. With my NOE 429421 mould this would require seating the bullet just to the front edge of the driving band.

So this problem requires some creative thinking. The quick solution would be to trim about .085" from your .44 Magnum brass, crimp in the bullets crimp groove, and be done with it. Another option would be to seat the 429421 to the correct o.a.l. then apply a crimp with a Lee crimp die. The only other thing I can think of, and it doesn't sound like a viable option for you, is to have Tom at www.accuratemolds.com (http://www.accuratemolds.com) make a custom mould for you that would cast a bullet that would result in the o.a.l. you seek. He doesn't charge any extra for custom designs, by the way.

I haven't fired any .44 Magnums through my Uberti as I really bought it to use with my .44 Specials as I typically load them a hair over book loads all the way up the Keith load that I fire in my Flat Top Blackhawk. I haven't done lots of load development yet, as the rifle so far has been a companion in the deer blind when I'm handgun hunting. Nevertheless, it's been pretty accurate with .44 Special loads, what little I've fired it.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine_zps76990426.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine_zps76990426.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine-3_zps8d3f73e0.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine-3_zps8d3f73e0.jpg.html)

Please keep us posted with your decision and results and I'd love to see a picture of your rifle.

35W

[Norseman1]

WOW! I had forgotten about this thread. I have since bought a Uberti 1873 carbine in .44 Magnum too. Hands down, it is the slickest out of the box action I've ever operated. I've owned it for over a year and still get wobble-kneed when I see her in the laundry room gun rack! OK, now for your issue....

I'm afraid the SAAMI o.a.l. for the .44 Magnum is 1.610" and the 1873 rifles, even the old ones, have carrier blocks that are 1.610" in length. So, the o.a.l. of any cartridge in the '73's is limited to the length of the carrier. With my NOE 429421 mould this would require seating the bullet just to the front edge of the driving band.

So this problem requires some creative thinking. The quick solution would be to trim about .085" from your .44 Magnum brass, crimp in the bullets crimp groove, and be done with it. Another option would be to seat the 429421 to the correct o.a.l. then apply a crimp with a Lee crimp die. The only other thing I can think of, and it doesn't sound like a viable option for you, is to have Tom at www.accuratemolds.com (http://www.accuratemolds.com) make a custom mould for you that would cast a bullet that would result in the o.a.l. you seek. He doesn't charge any extra for custom designs, by the way.

I haven't fired any .44 Magnums through my Uberti as I really bought it to use with my .44 Specials as I typically load them a hair over book loads all the way up the Keith load that I fire in my Flat Top Blackhawk. I haven't done lots of load development yet, as the rifle so far has been a companion in the deer blind when I'm handgun hunting. Nevertheless, it's been pretty accurate with .44 Special loads, what little I've fired it.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine_zps76990426.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine_zps76990426.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine-3_zps8d3f73e0.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Uberti%2044%20Mag%20Carbine/UbertiCarbine-3_zps8d3f73e0.jpg.html)

Please keep us posted with your decision and results and I'd love to see a picture of your rifle.

35W

LOL, I kept a tab open with those two pics from the day you got your carbine to drool over while I waited for mine.

I might just get a bunch of .44 Special brass and run them hot when I want to hunt with it. What other bullet would you recommend that would give similar performance to the 429421 and work with that OAL in magnum brass?cast
Thanks for the info. I'll get some pics up when there's better light. It came with a very pretty piece of wood on the buttstock.

[Norseman1]

I just checked my Lyman 49th edition reloading manual and it looks like I'm going to need some more .44 Special brass if I want to shoot cast bullets in this carbine. I guess that's OK because I have some tax return money earmarked for that Special Sporting rifle (20") n .44 Special if Cimarron ever gets anymore.

[Norseman1]

Seriously though, there must be a cast bullet out there that will go 1.610 OAL in magnum brass.

[35 Whelen]

I don't know of any other bullet, at least not in SWC. If you have 1000+ Mag brass, why not just trim a couple hundred?

I just measured some once fired .44 Magnum brass and is 1.275". With a required o.a.l. o f 1.610", this will allow a bullet with a nose not exceeding .335". With a .34" nose, this one comes REAL close: http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=43-250TG-D.png Fact is, I'm sure Tom could easily alter the mould to your requirements. Here's another that would work http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=43-255M-D.png but it's a WFN design. And another http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=43-270T-D.png . He offers so many different styles, it's mind boggling. I don't know if you've ever seen or used any of his moulds, but they are beautiful and the quality is astounding.
My favorite hunting bullet s the one pictured above out of an RCBS 44-250 KT mould. I love the bullet as it's very accurate and penetrates like crazy. This struck a buck in the flank running about 1050 fps and travelled all the way up to his brisket.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/bullet_zpsd62d630c.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/bullet_zpsd62d630c.jpg.html)

I'm anxious to see the wood on your rifle. I'm hoping someday to replace the wood on mine by buying a semi inletted walnut stock, fitting it and finishing it with boiled linseed oil for that traditional look. I did that to a new '92 Rossi and it gave the rifle a much more traditional, classy look.

35W

[Norseman1]

They do look nice. I like the look of the #43-255M. Thanks for the links.

I am just getting into casting after handloading for 20+ years. What configuration do you recommend getting the mold in? In the past I always bought my bullets from M&P in Vermont. He made it so affordable it was hardly worth the expense of casting myself.

[Norseman1]

I'll get some pics up this weekend with any luck. I had one other '73, a .44-40, 24" octagon barrel Uberti rifle. It seemed about as heavy and unwieldy as any 1886 I've owned. I probably don't need the 20" octagon sporting rifle in the long run. This carbine sure seems more handy. We have a lot of thick, heavy timber, steep ground where I live.

[35 Whelen]

They do look nice. I like the look of the #43-255M. Thanks for the links.

I am just getting into casting after handloading for 20+ years. What configuration do you recommend getting the mold in? In the past I always bought my bullets from M&P in Vermont. He made it so affordable it was hardly worth the expense of casting myself.

By configuration do you mean what material for the mould and how many cavities? If so, that's sort of a personal choice. He details the properties of each material on the site. I typically have them made in aluminum 2-cavity, but I do have a couple of 4-cavity moulds for my .44 Specials because I tend to shoot them so much. If I ever get another from Tom, I'm thinking about having an iron block cut. They're quite a bit more expensive, but iron is all but indestructible.

Funny you got rid of a 24" 44-40, I'm in the process of buying one in an 1866 model. You are correct in that they're very heavy, but I intend to only use this one for fun shooting and if I ever decide to NCOWS.

35W

[ironhead7544]

Guys: Thanks for the new info!

I have a 24 inch Marlin 1894 Cowboy that will take a 1.710 COL. It was set up this way at the factory. It feeds the Keith bullet perfectly. The bore requires a .433 cast bullet.

The earlier Marlins were set up for 1.610. The factory took .100 off the back of the carrier which allows more bullet types to be used.

It might be possible to use a longer bullet in the 1873 if the rifle is modified. I heard the 1866 repros in 38 Special were modified to take a greater range of ammo lengths by adding a taper in the receiver or on the carrier somehow. I would contact one of the cowboy gunsmiths.

Or you could just look for a bullet that will load to the proper length. I would suggest a wide round nose flat point.

[ironhead7544]

Norseman1: I looked at the Bear Tooth Bullets website and there are some bullets that should work. The 240 gr WFN looks to have the right nose length with a wide meplat for hunting.

[Norseman1]

I really appreciate all of the advice. I couldn't get the site to work for a few days, was it down?

In the meantime I noticed that the rear of the carrier and the receiver's matching face had dents like someone had pried the two with a screwdriver blade or something. It was visible with the action closed and locked up. It also had a scuff through the bluing on the dustcover that I was willing to live with but after noticing the dents it went back. I don't know what to do now. Get another '73 44 Mag, get the straight grip short rifle they have in stock in 44 Special if I am going to be forced to use 44 Special cases to use my beloved 429421, or wait for the deluxe short rifle with pistol grip and checkering in 44 Special due in a month or two? Or.... the Marlin 1894 is shipping again and supposedly with much improved fit and finish over the 2008 guns..

[35 Whelen]

As stated in a previous post, I had a Short Rifle in .44 Special. It was a great rifle bur was heavy to me. That's why i chose the carbine But if a person isn't planning on carrying the rifle alot, it's no big deal. Can't speak to much about the Marlins. I have a couple (.375 & 45-70) but they're the older ones with Micro-Groove rifling and I never had any luck with cast bullets. The new ones may have Ballard rifling though.
35W

[Norseman1]

I agree the '73 24 inch oct. barrel 44-40 I had was like my T/C Hawken.

I'll probably get another of the carbines in 44 Mag and hope for a better one.

[Norseman1]

The new carbine showed up last night. The only blemish is an inch long scratch where the assembler slid the forend band on the barrel. OCD I know but these aren't cheap to acquire.

I had 150 rounds of 429421 loaded in 44 Special brass over 6.0 grains of Unique so I decided to warm up the barrel a little. I have an 8x10 steel plate at about 50 yards in my tree line that I can shoot from my deck. I set the rear sight on the third elevation notch and was able to hit the plate fairly consistently offhand in the failing light. The loads are mild enough that my 8 year old took a shot with it and hit the plate with his first shot while resting his elbow on the deck rail.

i should be just over 800 fps with that load out of the carbine. I'm going to load some Skeeter loads and a few with 17 grains of 2400 as well when I empty some more brass :) I have more Unique on hand than 2400 right now so I'll probably load 50 or 100 @ 7.5 grains of Unique. My .429 bullets are limited to 1500 429421's and a single 100 round box of 240 grain XTP's right now. I only have 200 pieces of Special brass and as stated the 429421 is too long when loaded in my ample supply of Magnum brass.

Thanks for all of the input, I appreciate the interest. I love this little carbine. I didn't think I would like the rubber buttplate vs a traditional carbine style but it shoulders nicely and is snug and secure against a wool shirt.

[35 Whelen]

Glad you got it! Please keep us posted on it!

35W

[Norseman1]

Dont mind our 200 year old pine floors.

Last pic is next to my Uberti SAA in 44 Special.

I requested plain straight grain wood on the replacement carbine. The first one had a highly figured stock that I didn't feel was right on a carbine. Love this little carbine.

I had to set my rear sight in the lowest setting to be 1 1/2 high at 35 yards with the above mentioned load. 245 grain bullet @ approx 850 fps.


160474160475160476

[Norseman1]

Glad you got it! Please keep us posted on it!

35W

Thanks!

i didn't see your reply 'til after I posted the pics.

[northmn]

Reading the article with interest. Don't the "cowboy" bullets handle the OAL length problem. Just a thought.

DEP

[35 Whelen]

Dont mind our 200 year old pine floors.

Last pic is next to my Uberti SAA in 44 Special.

I requested plain straight grain wood on the replacement carbine. The first one had a highly figured stock that I didn't feel was right on a carbine. Love this little carbine.

I had to set my rear sight in the lowest setting to be 1 1/2 high at 35 yards with the above mentioned load. 245 grain bullet @ approx 850 fps.


160474160475160476

I'm tickled to death for you!

I think your on the right track using .44 Special brass. That 17.0 gr. 2400 load should net a minimum of 1400 fps and will likely run closer to 1500.

As soon as I get a couple of other projects finished, I'll be returning to my Uberti .44 Magnum...hopefully in a couple of weeks.

Oh, the floors are nice. When we were building our house a little over 10 years ago, and my wife, without my knowledge, ordered 12" tongue and groove pine plank flooring for the downstairs. Since we live in the country, all manner of dirt, dust, gravel and whatnot are tracked in and scuffed across the floor. There are even little 1/8" circular indentions from when one of my wifes friends wore her high heel hooker shoes at the house. So, out 10 year old flooring looks to be about 50 years old.

35W

[Norseman1]

Reading the article with interest. Don't the "cowboy" bullets handle the OAL length problem. Just a thought.

DEP

I was thinking about the 429677. Has anyone tried that? The Lyman manual still shows the OAL a little too long for the '73.

I may just try crimping on the front driving band of the 429421 (like the original BP 44-40 bullets did). Like 35Whelen said it would probably give me the right length to function. The 429421 has just been so good for me I hate to change.

[35 Whelen]

Reading the article with interest. Don't the "cowboy" bullets handle the OAL length problem. Just a thought.

DEP

They would, but in my opinion they're very limited in their use. Since as handloaders we're concerned with how much of the bullet is IN the case as how much is out, using 44 Special brass makes perfect sense.

35W

[Norseman1]

I'm tickled to death for you!

I think your on the right track using .44 Special brass. That 17.0 gr. 2400 load should net a minimum of 1400 fps and will likely run closer to 1500.

As soon as I get a couple of other projects finished, I'll be returning to my Uberti .44 Magnum...hopefully in a couple of weeks.

Oh, the floors are nice. When we were building our house a little over 10 years ago, and my wife, without my knowledge, ordered 12" tongue and groove pine plank flooring for the downstairs. Since we live in the country, all manner of dirt, dust, gravel and whatnot are tracked in and scuffed across the floor. There are even little 1/8" circular indentions from when one of my wifes friends wore her high heel hooker shoes at the house. So, out 10 year old flooring looks to be about 50 years old.

35W

Thanks. Yeah, we don't worry about the kids and dogs on these floors. Same thing with my wife's family's old dining room table in the last picture. My wife remembers her mom having fits when her kids were damaging to table top. It suits our old house just fine.

I wonder if the 17 grains of 2400 would be OK in the SAA? I'm guessing that the pressure wold be a touch too high. Elmer did shoot that load in his #5 though.

I just double checked and that'd be pushing 27,000 PSI. Probably not a great idea in a SAA, even a modern Uberti.

[35 Whelen]

I wonder if the 17 grains of 2400 would be OK in the SAA? I'm guessing that the pressure wold be a touch too high. Elmer did shoot that load in his #5 though.

I just double checked and that'd be pushing 27,000 PSI. Probably not a great idea in a SAA, even a modern Uberti.

That load has always been considered a 25K psi load. I have fired it frequently in my Flat Top Blackhawk, but shy away from it in my Uberti's. In my newest Uberti .44 Special, a 5 1/2" Model P I've easily attained 1100 fps using loads with which I'm more comfortable, and powders such as Unique, Blue Dot and 2400. After having easily killing 4 deer with .44 and .45 caliber bullets running between 900 and 1000 fps, I don't seek after high velocities. The 8.2 gr. Power Pistol load will easy do 1000 fps in your 5 1/2" and 1200 in your rifle and in my experience sail through any deer on the planet.
I'm not totally averse to upper tier loads, but were I to want to use them in a revolver I'd feel better if it were a Ruger.

35W

[Norseman1]

My mistake. I think I was looking at 17.5 grain data?

I agree on the velocities needed for hunting. I also have four 44 mag Rugers (2-SBH and 2- OM Vaquero's) as well as a S&W 629 and 29 so no excuse for me to beat up the Uberti.

[Norseman1]

I have lots of Unique and 2400 on hand right now. I only have a little bit of some very old Blue Dot.

[35 Whelen]

I've only gone up the 17.0 grs. of 2400 in my 5 1/2" .44 Special Ruger. Netted 1218 fps with a 260 gr. 429421 which is plenty for anything, I think. Grouped right at 6" @ 100 yds., too.

35W

[w30wcf]

Guys,
Do you know if there is any difference in strength between the reproduction '73's in 44 Mag (37,000CUP) vs 44-40 (14,000 CUP)? It would seem to me that if there was no difference, the 44-40 could be loaded beyond the SAMMI CUP specs. The cartridge case is less robust though but I'm thinking that there would be no problem loading to the old W.H.V. ballistics (200 gr. 1,580 f.p.s.) which produced about 22,000 CUP if the strength of the rifles are the same.

Thank you,
w30wcf

[35 Whelen]

Guys,
Do you know if there is any difference in strength between the reproduction '73's in 44 Mag (37,000CUP) vs 44-40 (14,000 CUP)? It would seem to me that if there was no difference, the 44-40 could be loaded beyond the SAMMI CUP specs. The cartridge case is less robust though but I'm thinking that there would be no problem loading to the old W.H.V. ballistics (200 gr. 1,580 f.p.s.) which produced about 22,000 CUP if the strength of the rifles are the same.

Thank you,
w30wcf

Very good question and one I ponder from time to time. Here are my thoughts and observations.....

In Rifle magazine #218 Brian Pearce did a little column with loads in a 24" Uberti 1873 .44 Special. Based on other articles he's done on the same caliber, the loads he ran throughthe rifle were in the 22,000 psi range.
In Handloader #221 someone developed some loads for a 20" Uberti 1873 in 45 Colt. Again, based on some of Pearce's 45 Colt data, they were loading the rifle in the 22,000 psi range.
When on looks at parts lists for various 1873's, the part numbers of the internals, links, pins, etc., are all the same as far as I can tell. Seems to me from a manufacturing standpoint it be simplest to produce all the various calibers on the stronger frame/action. Now my experiences....

I once owned a 20" Short Rifle in .44 Special. Loaded with 2400, when I began approaching about 20,000 psi, I experienced a case head separation.

35W

[w30wcf]

35W,
Thank you very much for the information. I have often thought that the pressure against the chamber walls would help to lock the case in the chamber to some degree and reduce the case head thrust.

Regarding the case separation, how was the headspace in that rifle?

w30wcf

[35 Whelen]

W30WCF,
Over the last several years I've done quite a bit of load testing and shooting of heavy-ish loads in .44 Specials and 45 Colts. I'm of the opinion that these straight wall cases do not lock against the chamber walls UNLESS it's for a brief nanosecond. I say this because I've fired some pretty salty loads with both cartridges and never really experienced difficult extraction. It seems that the really light loads will drop their brass from the chambers, then as pressure climbs, they may need a tap, in some cases, to clear the chambers, but I've never really experienced cases that had to be pounded out of the cylinders. In the .44 Special I've fired the Keith load quite a bit in my Ruger .44 Special and honestly don't find the brass anymore difficult to extract than with my practice load of 6.5 grs. of Unique. Odd, I know, but that's just my observation.

Regarding the headspace of the aforementioned rifle, I really have no idea, as I sold the rifle to fund the purchase of the .44 Magnum. When using "normal" loads, I never saw anything that indicated excessive headspace. I attributed the separation to possible flexing of the skinny little breech bolt. But, that's just a guess.

35W