? from newbie to cast

[Ledslnger]

Been reloading forever, but never done much in the way of cast. A few pistol rounds here and there over the years, but not much and no rifle rounds at all.

I bought some .30 cal cast bullets while at the LGS a few weeks back. They are at my dad's where we reload together, think they were Sutter brand or something like that. I didn't see much on the box except diameter. We reloaded them up this weekend. They were 165 grains and I threw 15gr of Reloder 7 behind it with Winchester primers.

Took them out today and ran some through my new setup, which is a TC Pro Hunter in .300BLK with 16.5" barrel, with Warne rings, and Bushnell Trophy XLT scope. I started off at 50 yards and had no consistency at all. A shot 9" off bull at 10 o'clock, then one 4" off bull at 4 o'clock, then one 3' off bull at 7 o'clock, etc. etc. I thought it was scope or rings first of course, but they were tight. Then I shot a few jacketed 110gr. jacketed bullets and saw a group, so it was the bullets.

I called the Gun Store where I purchased them and let him know I got no consistency at all from them. He proceeded to tell me I was probably pushing them too fast and probably leaded up my bore. That they were meant for Cowboy Action shooting with a .30-30 only. The bullets gave no suggested velocity or warnings on the box.

If I slow them up and drop the charge I doubt I will see a change in accuracy. What do you guys think?

[Bohica793]

A few questions:

Did the cast loads lead your barrel?
You state you loaded these with 15 grains of Reloder 7 - did you try any other loads?
Where did you get your information for the powder charge to use with the bullet?
Have you slugged your barrel? How does it compare to the diameter of the cast bullets?
You "saw a group" with the 110 grain bullets, but you do not specify any information regarding these - powder? charge weight? factory ammo?


Just throwing components together is no guarantee of accuracy. Far from it, in fact. If the cast round you are attempting to use is not the correct diameter for the barrel you have, accuracy will suffer significantly. Powder charge, either too much or too little, will affect accuracy. This is why most of us when working with a new boolit will start at a minimum load as designated by published specifications and work up in fixed increments to a published maximum load and measure the results in terms of accuracy, leading, pressure signs and other criteria.

When it is all said and done, it may be that this particular boolit is not right for your particular weapon but based on the available information I would have to guess that IATFB.

[Ledslnger]

I left my .30 cal cleaning stuff at my dad's, but I don't believe there was any leading in the barrel.
I have not tried any other levels of powder. I asked a friend what he was using in his AR with cast boolits. Similar weight bullet, same powder, but I dropped the powder 1 grain down to start.
I have not slugged the barrel. Diameter stated .309 on the box.
My info on the 110gr bullets actually blew away on a windy day. I remember they were 110gr and it was Lil gun powder, thinking 13.8 grains but not positive. Could look it up at my dad's but I am not there currently. I finished dialing in the scope with these bullets. I shot about several rounds on pulled them into the bullseye. Showed the accuracy that I know is possible with this setup.

[leeggen]

Way to many variables to even come close to an answer. So you think the TC Pro Hunter will shoot the same load as your freinds AR ? well welcome to the real world, get a reloading book, prefferably the loading cast bullets and see how many mistakes you already made before you make more. Not trying to be a buthead with you, just trying to get you to understand what you have done right so far--- asking questions on cast boolits forum should have been 1st place to check.
CD

[capt.hollis]

I left my .30 cal cleaning stuff at my dad's, but I don't believe there was any leading in the barrel.
I have not tried any other levels of powder. I asked a friend what he was using in his AR with cast boolits. Similar weight bullet, same powder, but I dropped the powder 1 grain down to start.
I have not slugged the barrel. Diameter stated .309 on the box.
My info on the 110gr bullets actually blew away on a windy day. I remember they were 110gr and it was Lil gun powder, thinking 13.8 grains but not positive. Could look it up at my dad's but I am not there currently. I finished dialing in the scope with these bullets. I shot about several rounds on pulled them into the bullseye. Showed the accuracy that I know is possible with this setup.Sounds more like a leaded barrel to me. Do you have a bore light? Leading in barrels can be at the chamber, mid barrel, or end of barrel, so sometimes you may not see it with the naked eye. In that Blackout I'd slug that barrel, and size to .310 because Id bet that barrel measures at .309 if you slug it. Also you need to gas check that bullet.

[Ledslnger]

My dad started me reloading when I was 3 years old(yeah I was just rolling cases on a lube pad, but it was my start). 40 years later I think I know there are lots of variables. I know a Pro Hunter will shoot the same load as an AR if we were talking jacketed. Both are 16" barrels and I am fairly positive the same twist rate. I have never seen such inconsistency with jacketed bullets. I always get better initial groups with jacketed stuff. My friend was getting good groups with roughly the same load. I went 1 grain less of the same powder, since it is a different rifle and I like to be smart and play it safe. And, when I am looking at new handloading manuals I have never noticed any specifically for cast boolits. I try to buy a new manual quite often. Think I have picked up 3 in the past 2 years. Any suggestions on a cast reloading manual?

[Bohica793]

Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook 3rd or 4th Edition.

[Ledslnger]

If the barrel was leaded up I don't believe I would have gotten two good groups with the 110gr jacketed would I? Again, new to cast so I have never experienced a leaded up barrel. It looks bright all the way down to me.

[500MAG]

I would agree with Capt. Hollis. The boolits should probably be sized to .310. It's not the leading that causes the inconsistency it's the fact that the boolit is causing leading that causes the inconsistency. If the boolit is sized wrong, too small, it will not shoot accurately and it also causes leading. The reason they are asking about leading is because if there is leading it tells you the boolit is not sized properly. I'm sure you can find someone to sell you some lee312-155, I think that is a good mold, from what I have read, for the 300blk.

[Wayne Smith]

1) You neglected to mention that the "AR" that you are comparing is also chambered 300BK?? That little detail matters greatly.
2) Until you slug your barrel and measure the slug with a micrometer, we cannot truly advise you. Do a search on slugging your barrel if you are not familiar with the concept.
3) A boolit cast with the 30-30 in mind should be perfectly adequate in the 300BK simply because you are approaching the same velocities. I have gas checks on my 30-30 boolits.

[gwpercle]

Be sure to clean your barrel well before shooting cast through it.
Developing a cast boolit load is sometimes a chore with all the variables, buying cast bullets of unknown hardness and the first charge selected usually don't give optomial results....you got to work them up and try this that and the other. Most of us cast to controll the bullet size and hardness.
Just don't get discourged, keep trying different things and to find "The Load" your rifle likes. I bet there are others who experimented long and hard to find "the load". I will tell you cast boolit load development may not be easy but it is very satisfying when it all comes together. Just don't expect instant gratification.
Gary

[338RemUltraMag]

Ok going on my limited knowledge of your set up...

First is powder, I would try 16.5 gr of H-110 with that boolit, the TC pro hunter is one strong action and will take any sane 300 BLK load. Second, I would size that boolit to .310-.311 whichever fit in the chamber, heck if .312 will chamber then use that size boolit, you want that boolit to fit the throat of the rifle not the bore, the 300 BLK has a long throat to handle long bullets so sizing to fit the throat is paramount. Third, did you flair the neck of the case? If not you most likely shaved the soft boolits and THAT would cause the problems you are seeing.

Without more info that is the best I can do, I hope this helps!