BFR 500 JRH Anyone shooting one?

[missionary5155]

Greetings
Anyone shooting a BFR 500 JRH ? I am looking to get one and wanted to do some homework first.
I do not like the "Long cylinder" BFR's. I like my caliber 454. It fits my hand well. The ballistics of the shorter caliber .500 JRH will take care of my shooting needs. So anyone here have one ? Enlighten me.
500 JRH brass. Is it made by shortening 500 S&W or what ?
Thanks !!
Mike in Peru

[Fishman]

I can't help you much but I handled a BFR in 500 JRH at the NRA convention in Houston this year and I really, really wanted to take it home with me.

[27judge]

Hey Mike I have one from Subsonic. All I can say is its a blast to shoot. Brass is made by shorting 500 S&W. Thiers quite a bit of loading info on this forum. 44man and subsonic were of great help to me . I got my mold custom from Accurate in less then 2 weeks. Reloading supplies can be tough to come up with, check Starline for 500 S&W brass. Im just starting to load for mine and have many 5 shot 35 yard 3/4 inch groups in both light and medium loads. recoil is mild in the light to medium loads and easy to handle in the heavy loads . It is a hand full. tks ken

[missionary5155]

Howdy 27judge
Thanks for that info.
Do you have to get caliber specific dies or can 500 S&W dies be used ? I realise the crimper would have to be shortened.
Mike in Peru

[mellonhead]

I can't comment on the BFR, but I have a custom FA in 500 JRH. Brass is as simple as cutting down 500 S&W brass and turning the rims. I don't think the rims need turned for the BFR. Really a great caliber. I have tossed the idea around to sell my 500 JRH to fund some other things. Let me know if its something you wiuld be interested in.

Toby

[27judge]

Hey mike I just use 500 S&W dies, the crimp works fine with the 500 s&w crimp die , My dies are lee and work great. The BFR is one strong built gun, and I owned 2 Ruger super black hawks in 44 mag. Recoil in the 500 BFR seems a good bit over over the Ruger super black hawk but its easy to handle . I think the weight difference makes it easier to handle. You need plenty of lead at 385 grain and 440 grain a lb of lead goes fast tks ken

[missionary5155]

Howdy 27judge I have a 454 BFR so am familiar with the pachage. That is what leads me towards a cartridge that fits in the short cylinder.
I appreciate the info ! Mike in Peru

[44man]

83210.500 S&W dies and cut down brass. Dies work perfect with no changes but I use Hornady dies only. CRIMP DIE DOES NOT NEED CUT! I seat and crimp in the seat die all at once and don't bother with the extra crimp die.
Jack has been out of brass for a while so Starline S&W needs bought to cut down.
I would not buy a Freedom, too light and wrong twist. You need the gun weight. I find the BFR .475 has more torque then the JRH from the bench, recoil is very close. From the bench both have done 1/2" at 100 yards so many times I can't count, 420 in the .475 and 440 in the JRH.
The picture is a group at 50 yards with the BFR in JRH.

[mellonhead]

A Freedom in JRH has the right twist! When Huntington puts a barrel on for a cartridge he created I'm quessing it has the right twist! Do you ever tire of the constant bashing of Freedom Arms?

Toby

[dmize]

I have one and I LOVE it.
I cut down 500 S&W brass and use Lee and Lyman dies. Crimp die on both had to be cut down to work.
I also have a 475 and I don't know about torque but the 500 kicks quite a bit more..

[subsonic]

Got one. Shoots good.

Here's a 25yd 5 shot iron sight group with a 440 and 29gr H110/Fed155. I'm sure it will do better, especially with an Ultra-Dot mounted.

I just haven't had much time to shoot it - too many other irons in the fire since I got my FFL.

http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x386/Dennis_Doza/E6338750-D41B-423C-A3B1-8A4A20EB467F-4371-0000089A7C273876_zps324f754f.jpg (http://s1179.photobucket.com/user/Dennis_Doza/media/E6338750-D41B-423C-A3B1-8A4A20EB467F-4371-0000089A7C273876_zps324f754f.jpg.html)

This is some loaded ammo with the 500gr Hornady XTP, H110, and a Fed155. The charge is written on each case.
http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x386/Dennis_Doza/500grxtptest.jpg (http://s1179.photobucket.com/user/Dennis_Doza/media/500grxtptest.jpg.html)

The lower right corner of the targets below shows where each shot landed. I felt the sights drift to the right on the 26gr load as I broke the trigger, so that is why it isn't in line with the others.

Velocity from my 6.25" barrel (was 8.25"):
23gr = 1126fps
24gr =1044fps
25gr = 1098fps
26gr = 1157fps
27gr = 1208fps

http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x386/Dennis_Doza/P82507352.jpg (http://s1179.photobucket.com/user/Dennis_Doza/media/P82507352.jpg.html)

[44man]

A Freedom in JRH has the right twist! When Huntington puts a barrel on for a cartridge he created I'm quessing it has the right twist! Do you ever tire of the constant bashing of Freedom Arms?

Toby
No, twist is wrong for heavy boolits. Cylinders are too short for heavy boolits. Gun is small and light. The Freedom will have 1 in 18", the BFR will be 1 in 15".
Jack does not like to convert a Freedom and prefers a Ruger. Actually the Ruger .357 max frame can take larger then the freedom frame. It can go to the .500 Linebaugh.
But no frame is as large as the BFR.
Jack does not make Freedom guns. He designed the caliber. The Freedom .475 shoots best with 350 gr boolits.

[mellonhead]

No, twist is wrong for heavy boolits. Cylinders are too short for heavy boolits. Gun is small and light. The Freedom will have 1 in 18", the BFR will be 1 in 15".
Jack does not like to convert a Freedom and prefers a Ruger. Actually the Ruger .357 max frame can take larger then the freedom frame. It can go to the .500 Linebaugh.
But no frame is as large as the BFR.
Jack does not make Freedom guns. He designed the caliber. The Freedom .475 shoots best with 350 gr boolits.

My gun was built by Huntington! He is the one that made it a 500 JRH! He used one of his octagon barrels! It also has enough room to run my 460 grain LFN's! Anyways I'm done talking about it!!!!

Toby

[44man]

My gun was built by Huntington! He is the one that made it a 500 JRH! He used one of his octagon barrels! It also has enough room to run my 460 grain LFN's! Anyways I'm done talking about it!!!!

Toby
You are talking a conversion by Jack, not factory. Do you know he will open the frames to fit a cylinder? I talk factory guns with Freedom. You have a custom by one of the best so why do you dispute when Jack made your gun?

[bigboredad]

Because you didn't ask you just spouted off your usual dribble about FA without knowing all the facts. Wow what a suprise

[gandydancer]

What's that saying about experts?

[missionary5155]

Good morning
Thank you everyone for all the advice and information that you have freely and kindly passed on to me over the last several days. Really it was a big help.
Through it all I looked into the 475 Linebaugh also. Investegated and comparred ballistics and discovered there is not much difference especially when used in the BFR cylinders.
Net result... I just snaged a 475 Linebaugh BFR off GB. Has the 7.5 inch barrel. Has a 100 round count as per the origonal owner. Has a brake mounted which I understand is easy to unscrew and lay aside.
So again thank you for your kind input.
Mike in Peru

[dubber123]

I don't think you will find the .475 lacking in anything, power or accuracy. The trigger may need tuning on the BFR, but they are easy to do. The BFR's are a bargain in the bigger calibers. My brothers BFR is notably more comfortable to shoot than my F/A, but it is heavier and has 2" more barrel, that might be all the difference. Have fun.

[44man]

It is weight and size that counts. I have worked with many, many Freedoms and of all the molds I have I only have one that will fit. Beside the point, the guns shoot best with a little lighter boolit and recoil is harsh.
Having the same problem with a S&W in .500 I have been working with. Friend bought too small a revolver with a too short barrel. Recoil does not bother me much but 10 shots is just plain enough. Hard to work loads that way.
Worked a lot with Freedom .475's, one customer gave up in two shots, sent for the rubber grips. Got to 1/2" at 50 yards with a 350 gr boolit. My 420 fits but the Lee 400 has to be crimped high on the groove or it will lock the gun. None of my other boolits fit.
No matter what you think, the gun is limited.
It's OK if you don't like what I say about them but you need to admit the limits.

[dubber123]

I have never had the LEE 400 lock up my F/A, but then again, I could never get it to full power with the tiny crimp groove on it. It is a very accurate boolit though. The best groups from my 4-3/4" F/A, without the bone ugly Goodyear grips, (shameless jab), has been with an LBT 440 gr. WFN. Never had one move from crimp, even though it chronographs at over 1,300 fps. I have never shot it past 200 meters, but it is certainly not displaying any lack of stability to at least that far, so the twist seems sufficient for my use. I did try the 440 at 800 fps, and accuracy did fall way off. The LEE shot around an inch at 50 yds. at a chronographed 500 fps., (Super light Trailboss load), so stability with 400 grainers isn't an issue.

[gandydancer]

I have had my FA sense 1996 454 & 45 colt cylinders 7.5 bbl using H110 & a sierra 200 grain J bullet in the 454 I have gotten 2040 FPS at a 105 feet ASL recoil not bad at all with that lite Boolit. But lots of flash. nailed a lot of chucks with that and slower loads with bigger Boolits. have not used very many cast in the gun. have not used the gun much in the last 10 years. the rightist Bros have taken over my hands in that time. as for accuracy? I think its as good as any thing in its class. better than most. as for the BFR? when I first saw one I through it was a fat Ruger I'm sure its a well made revolver and shoots great. I'm betting there was a few infringements on that one.. and better than the FA?------NO. as good?------maybe.

[44man]

I have never had the LEE 400 lock up my F/A, but then again, I could never get it to full power with the tiny crimp groove on it. It is a very accurate boolit though. The best groups from my 4-3/4" F/A, without the bone ugly Goodyear grips, (shameless jab), has been with an LBT 440 gr. WFN. Never had one move from crimp, even though it chronographs at over 1,300 fps. I have never shot it past 200 meters, but it is certainly not displaying any lack of stability to at least that far, so the twist seems sufficient for my use. I did try the 440 at 800 fps, and accuracy did fall way off. The LEE shot around an inch at 50 yds. at a chronographed 500 fps., (Super light Trailboss load), so stability with 400 grainers isn't an issue.
The Lee did shoot pretty good and we shot them full power. The silly CG's on them held but the boolit had to go to the very top of the groove before crimping or the cylinder would not turn. We did not want to trim any brass short.
My 420 will fit but accuracy was in the two inch range, any other boolit I have will not fit.
The limits are there so you need to know what mold you buy and jacketed will usually have two crimp grooves.

[TCTex]

The Lee did shoot pretty good and we shot them full power. The silly CG's on them held but the boolit had to go to the very top of the groove before crimping or the cylinder would not turn. We did not want to trim any brass short.
My 420 will fit but accuracy was in the two inch range, any other boolit I have will not fit.
The limits are there so you need to know what mold you buy and jacketed will usually have two crimp grooves.

What powders did you try?

[44man]

What powders did you try?
I only use 296. It has proven best. H110 is the same. We really got the Freedom to shoot good, but were looking for at least 1/2" at 50 meters, found it. It will shoot decent with a heavier boolit IF IT FITS but for the long ranges we were shooting, not good enough. We were shooting 400 yards to 500 meters (547 yards.)
The twist problem is related to boolit weight for distance. For closer ranges it does not matter much. The gun is great for to 100 yards and hunting.
However, if you shoot a heavy boolit slow, it will not do a thing. You just need spin it up.
Twist is not understood enough. Same in the .44. Everyone wanted light loads with heavy boolits---NOT TO BE! The slower twist NEEDS a higher velocity with more spin. The problem is a short cylinder needs the heavy boolit seated deep, reducing powder space and increasing pressures. Here come the LIMITS!
The Freedom .475 was wonderful with a lighter boolit but they did not carry well at long ranges.
Go backwards in calibers with the Freedoms. The .22 is the most accurate revolver made, look at the .17 with a 1 in 9" twist. the .32, .357 and .41, .44, all are perfect. The .44 sp too slow, the .45 Colt too slow and the larger calibers need shot to max. The large Ruger's are too slow and need shot very hot.
These are just mechanical problems so you only need match a boolit.
If anyone thinks they can shoot a heavy boolit with Unique from ANY gun, there is a need for a 4' square target.
I have a problem with MANY makes of revolvers, just understand what yours needs and don't stray far.
It is like the S&W .460, super gun with a gain twist that you can work with. But a fool sends it off to be cut to 4", OH MY, what has he done to the twist?

[TCTex]

LOL. It was a simple question, but you answered my question.


FWIW, H335 is my favorite powder for the 7-30 Waters and shoots great with a 139 SPBT or SST. If I shoot a 140 NBT with H335 I would be lucky to keep a 4-5 in group. If I change powders and use Varget with the 140 NBT all the sudden I rewarded with sub MOA groups again.

I understand that certain powders have proven perfect projectile propellants, particularly with specific bullets. However, from my experiences, some times I need to change my powder/primer combinations to shoot a particular bullet.

Not saying 296/H110 will not shoot well in my 480 Ruger, it is just that AA#9 shot better with my bullet of choice.

[TCTex]

It is like the S&W .460, super gun with a gain twist that you can work with. But a fool sends it off to be cut to 4", OH MY, what has he done to the twist?

I had to read that twice to catch it. LOL. Ya, cutting a 8in barrel down to 4in would all but take out your twist in the rifling. However, if it wasn't my gun-LOL, that would be a cool experiment.

Duane

[dubber123]

I suspect after experimenting with 800 fps. 440 gr. loads that accuracy would certainly drop off once that velocity was reached. My full power loads run 1,327 fps. average, and I don't know at what range the velocity would go low enough to be unstable. I'm pretty content with being able to hit at 200 meters with a 4-3/4" iron sighted handgun, so anything beyond that I'll leave to the BFR. boys.. :) I shot less than 50 385 grain boolits early on, and found they kicked harder than the heavies, and shot worst in my gun. The 440 grain mold was simply ordered with a nose that fit in my F/A, and it has never caused an issue. I'd have to look at my notes, but I think 50 yd. group average was in the 1.5 to 1.75" range, occasionally going under an inch, using the factory iron sights. Having issues getting under 2" at the same distance with a longer barreled, optics equipped gun has me a bit baffled.

[mellonhead]

I have no problem with heavy bullets in my Freedom Arms 475's. I have a 5" and a 6" barreled 475. They have both shot 12-16" groups at 425 yards with iron sights. That was with a medium dose of HS6 and 410 grain LFN's.

Toby

[dubber123]

I have no problem with heavy bullets in my Freedom Arms 475's. I have a 5" and a 6" barreled 475. They have both shot 12-16" groups at 425 yards with iron sights. That was with a medium dose of HS6 and 410 grain LFN's.

Toby

Much farther than I have shot.. Maybe I have a little more range than I thought. The WFN profile of my 440's probably wouldn't help me though. If I was doing much 200 meter plus shooting, I might have to investigate another nose profile.

[44man]

Much farther than I have shot.. Maybe I have a little more range than I thought. The WFN profile of my 440's probably wouldn't help me though. If I was doing much 200 meter plus shooting, I might have to investigate another nose profile.
No problem with a WFN, you are in the correct velocity range.
My 420 gr is a WFN and we could keep them on a 6" swinger at 400 yards. I run this one at 1350 fps.
I have used 83% meplats at long range, just spin them up.

[TCTex]

I am going to have to play around with H110 again. My 4 5/8ths SBH in 44 shooting IMR 4227 with a 245 K or 265 RD and my 5in SRH in 480 shooting a 385 "Dick special" with AA#9 both did better with the lower velocity loads. The more I try to "push" either o those loads the more the groups just open up. The 44's are not heavy for caliber, but the 475 isn't light. LOL

I may play around with a few more powders with H110 "taking point."

[44man]

I am going to have to play around with H110 again. My 4 5/8ths SBH in 44 shooting IMR 4227 with a 245 K or 265 RD and my 5in SRH in 480 shooting a 385 "Dick special" with AA#9 both did better with the lower velocity loads. The more I try to "push" either o those loads the more the groups just open up. The 44's are not heavy for caliber, but the 475 isn't light. LOL

I may play around with a few more powders with H110 "taking point."
Recoil and barrel rise might be affecting you.
I had a lot of trouble on deer with my 7-1/2" BFR in .475 when I first got it. I was doing great at the range, breaking 1/2" to 5/8" at 50 yards, then got there at 100 as I got used to the gun. But I was shooting over deer or taking hair off the top of them. I found it was ME, relaxing too much for deer. I learned to talk to my stupid self---HOLD TIGHT solved it. Without knowing, I was shooting different. I now shoot at them the same as I shoot on the range. You must hold TIGHT, just short of shaking.
You will be relaxed with light recoil but in truth you should not be. Hold the same for all loads, all guns.

[TCTex]

Recoil and barrel rise might be affecting you.
I had a lot of trouble on deer with my 7-1/2" BFR in .475 when I first got it. I was doing great at the range, breaking 1/2" to 5/8" at 50 yards, then got there at 100 as I got used to the gun. But I was shooting over deer or taking hair off the top of them. I found it was ME, relaxing too much for deer. I learned to talk to my stupid self---HOLD TIGHT solved it. Without knowing, I was shooting different. I now shoot at them the same as I shoot on the range. You must hold TIGHT, just short of shaking.
You will be relaxed with light recoil but in truth you should not be. Hold the same for all loads, all guns.

I think your spot on. I think there is a commen misconception on grip out there. I am at least familar with what you are saying actively shootly my TC (Ristol) batery. My firm grip is staying the same, the groups are just opening up. With 2400 the groups acrually get tighter when increasing velocity on the 44 Mag, I just use 4227 because it is the most accerate load for my SBH. It may not be a good powder for steel shooting, but neither would my 4 5/8ths SBH.

Now my 9.5 SRH in 44, the harder I push the 300 XPT with H110 the more accurate the load is.

I think grip is a topic very applicable to this post BYW. I imagine any imperfection in grip would by magnified with the larger bullet diameter and weight.

Duane.

[44man]

Grip is so very important. I grit my teeth when anyone says "it rolls nice." One fella was cutting himself with the hammer using a Bisley. The revolver should raise your arms, not rotate the gun. But that is half the story because without some strength, it will also raise your arms faster.
Holding the grip tight also tightens the forearm muscles and wrist. When the gun comes out of recoil, your hand should be in the exact same place on the grip.
The very best with a SA is a low hold, try to keep your finger in as straight a line to the trigger as you can and do not grip high so your wrist bends down, it can cause wrist injury. Seems to give a running start to wrist twist.
Super smooth, shiny grip panels are an abortion.
About the 300 XTP, great bullet. I used 20.5 gr of 296 and a Fed 150 primer in my SRH.
Now a 4-5/8" barrel is not bad in the .44, might need a few tenths of a gr more powder to reach spin. For my larger calibers like the .475 and JRH I use 7-1/2" but 6" is also very good.
Gun weight will make you shoot better.
I met my match with a friends S&W .500. He bought a light version, not the big underlug heavy one. Neither of us can control it. He shakes his hand after every shot.

[pal82]

Bringing this thread back to life.

I just got a 500jrh bfr last week. I looked for one for 4 months. I had almost given up. Got the 440gn lee mould. Due to lack of "official load data" I'm going to take this slow. I've never ran with a "wild cat" before. I made up two loads, 5 rounds each:

7gn trail boss, WLP, 440gn lfngc, 1.800 oal (that where the crimp groove is), starline 500mag brass trimmed to 1.399. Five shots and you couldn't wipe the smile off my face. Shot way high, ordered a tall front sight.

27gn H110, same as above. chronographed 2 shots. avr 1125. first 3 shots read >2000fps, a was standing too close to chrono. Recoil wasn't as harsh as i expected. Velocity was less than I expected.

[jaydub in wi]

PM me your e mail address, and I will send you what data I have.

[paul h]

(snip)

Not saying 296/H110 will not shoot well in my 480 Ruger, it is just that AA#9 shot better with my bullet of choice.

Odd, I've found H-110 lit off with a CCI-350 to provide exceptional accuracy in the 480 with bullets from 390-460gr. Maybe an issue with the lighter bullets, but with the heavies H-110 has worked very well for me.