Gould Bullet

[StrawHat]

It has been said that the 457122 Gould bullet (330 HP) is one of the better hunting bullets for the 45-70.

I have the mold and agree with that statement.

Did Gould lend his name to any other hunting bullet mold?

I am specifically looking for a similar bullet for my 405 WCF and am unable to find one.

I recall reading in Pet Loads that it could be scaled down to 40 cal but have no inkling how to do that. Any of you bullet desiners know the way to do it?

I am not looking for a group buy, just one mold. Or something similar.

I have the Ideal mold for the 405 and it is swell, just looking for a lighter hollow pointed bullet.

Any input would be appreciated.

[felix]

SH, just scaling won't do the trick normally, and this is because the lube grooves can get too small in the process. So, you dig out the lube grooves a little and that will destroy the boolit's balance. So, the boolit has to be redesigned to have the same balance point both statically and dynamically. That is where the pot luck comes into play. If the targets are the same at a respectable distance using the same boolit energy, then the conversion was successful. ... felix

[Scrounger]

It has been said that the 457122 Gould bullet (330 HP) is one of the better hunting bullets for the 45-70.

I have the mold and agree with that statement.

Did Gould lend his name to any other hunting bullet mold?

I am specifically looking for a similar bullet for my 405 WCF and am unable to find one.

I recall reading in Pet Loads that it could be scaled down to 40 cal but have no inkling how to do that. Any of you bullet desiners know the way to do it?

I am not looking for a group buy, just one mold. Or something similar.

I have the Ideal mold for the 405 and it is swell, just looking for a lighter hollow pointed bullet.

Any input would be appreciated.

Look at the NEI catalog on their website. I think I've seen similar bullets in other calibers.

[StrawHat]

SH, So, the boolit has to be redesigned to have the same balance point both statically and dynamically. felix

Yeah, it's the redesign part that has me muled.

I was hoping someone more knowledgeable than myself, would be able to point to a lyman 4xxxxxx and say "Gould". Since I have never heard of any other Gould bullet molds I doubt that will happen.

I have also given thought to contacting a fellow caster/machinist to see if he could modify said Lyman/Ideal 405 mold to HP form.

Of course there is nothing wrong with the bullet it drops right now, +/- 300 grains and 40 caliber lumbering along at more than black powder velocities but less than factory still is a respectable and authoritative piece of lead. Just looking for something different.

Scrounger,

Thanks for the memory jog about NEI, I forget about them.

Keep the ideas coming, I am always learning from you fellows.

Thanks

[joeb33050]

It has been said that the 457122 Gould bullet (330 HP) is one of the better hunting bullets for the 45-70.


I recall reading in Pet Loads that it could be scaled down to 40 cal but have no inkling how to do that. Any of you bullet desiners know the way to do it?

I am not looking for a group buy, just one mold. Or something similar.

I have the Ideal mold for the 405 and it is swell, just looking for a lighter hollow pointed bullet.

Any input would be appreciated.

If you want to design the Gould bullet as a .40 caliber bullet, then here's how:
Draw the gould bullet, dimension it for the .40 caliber, keep the length the same.
Means, if you want bands .410", dijmension them .410". If the Gould bullet is 1" long, make the .40 bullet 1" long. Keeping the length the same keeps the BC the same.

For a detailed discussion, see "Cast Bullets For Beginner And Expert", Second Edition, at http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/CB-BOOK/
Sign in, go to "Files", scroll down to "2.2 BULLET DESIGN AND FIT" and see "How to scale a bullet up or down". It's free and describes the procedure.
Don't worry about bullet balance or static or dynamic balance. Dimension your lube grooves as you want.
joe brennan

[KCSO]

My 1953 Lyman/Ideal catalog shows a 405168 offered in HP design at 210 grains. This would be what you are looking for.

[Glen]

The Gould bullet was designed by John Barlow (the founder of Ideal) back around 1890. He designed 3 HP bullets of different weights for .45 caliber rifles -- a 300 grain, 330 grain and a heavier bullet (385 grains?). He placed these designs in front of A. C. Gould, the editor of a popular outdoors shooting and hunting magazine, as well as an avid bullet caster, and Gould thought that the 330 grain version looked just right for what he wanted in a hunting bullet. Barlow had the mould made up and gave one as a gift to Gould, and the 457122 has borne his name ever since.

I am not aware of any other bullets that are associated with Gould's name.

As for a .40 caliber version of the Gould, a close approximation could be had by taking the 265 grain 403169 and having it HP-ed. I have the 403169 HP and it is a dandy bullet. I believe that the 403169 is still being made, so this would be fairly straightforward to do.

[45 2.1]

Neither the 405168 or the 403169HP will work as is. The man asked for a 405 Win copy which is usually in the 0.412" to 0.415" range. I believe Lyman is making the 412263 again. It could be hollow pointed for a close approximation of the gould boolit or either of the above boolits could be paper patched up to fit. Jacketed 41 mag bullets would work also.

[StrawHat]

Thank You all for the input.

I did not think Gould lent his name to any other bullet but if he did, I figured someone here would know.

I have an old 412263 and may have it HPed. Of course like I said it does just fine now with a load of 5477 under it.

Obviously, I am not looking to make a magnum out of this cartridge.

I have yet to fire a jacketed bullet through the barrel and prefer the velocity to be a bit under factory.

I originally tried to get it to work with black powder but the twist is too fast for the 300 grain bullet.

I am now trying 777 in the cases but have not been to the range so hav e no results to share.

The idea of appaer jackets are interesting but probably not doable in a lever gun.

Keep lobbing ideas towards me, something might click.

Thanks again.

Hat