Has any one had 25ACP Encore of Contender bbl made

[GARD72977]

Just wondering if anyone has had a bbl made in 25acp. I seen the group buy for the 25 acp 44gr hp boolit. Just thought this would be a good little gun to target shoot with. Would like to hear from someone that has done it.

I have had a 9mm in mind but this may be more fun

[dk17hmr]

I have wanted a contender rifle barrel in 25acp for a long time. Someday I will get one..... should make a great little rabbit gun.

[texassako]

Anybody know where a reamer for one could be rented? The cost of buying a reamer is what has kind of held me back from such a project.

[GARD72977]

MGM list it in thier chamberings for contender and encore

[Hamish]

I smell a GB,,,,,,,,

[Kermit1945]

Hmmmm. Interesting. I've thought about .32 S&W (short) in a rifle barrel as a nuveau rook rifle. Still playing with that idea. Also have a very nice little sidehandle Crackshot in .32 RF I've thunk of chambering the same. Molds are out there.......... A .25, huh?

[Ehaver]

Anybody know where a reamer for one could be rented? The cost of buying a reamer is what has kind of held me back from such a project.

http://www.reamerrentals.com/default.asp

[texassako]

http://www.reamerrentals.com/default.asp

I have looked there, no .25 acp or at 4D that I have found.

[GARD72977]

25 acp listed here

http://matchgrademachine.com/Chamberings-Available.html

[btroj]

Why not get a straw and some dried peas........

[mikeym1a]

If you are looking for a barrel, Track of the Wolf has a .25 barrel 'liner'. It is as big as a regular .38 pistol barrel. You can get it in any length you want. Lothar Walther also can make you one in .25acp bore and groove, in any length you want. I have one of each waiting for inspiration and attention. Remember that it is different from the .25 cal rifle. Don't have the specs in front of me, seems the groove dia on the ACP is .250, while the rifle is .257. I was thinking of reworking an old AR7. The Walther barrel is about the right diameter for this. And I was thinking of making a cartridge based on the .32S&WL necked to .25. Again, still waiting for inspiration. [smilie=1:

[GARD72977]

some benefits of going with a 25acp over a 22lr would be control of components. I like the idea of being able to load subsonic. Having a larger diameter bullet traveling slower will making plinking more fun because hits will be easier to spot. When small game hunting the missed shot will not travel nearly as far. Is a 25acp needed ABSOLUTELY NOT. To be honest if there was only a 22lr, 30-30, and 45-70 nothing else would be required in North America. We have all these other calibers because we want them

Im thinking I would like to have a encore rifle barrel with target sights to shoot 25 or 50 yds just for fun.

[mikeym1a]

I like the idea of the .25acp in the AR7. It just appeals to me. OAL is about the same, and diameter of the round is not much bigger, so should work in the magazine. The Encore, not so much. For some reason, they just never appealed to me. I'd like to find an old Hopkins and Allen falling block in 25 rimfire, and convert it. to me, that would be the trick. Oh, I know, if wishes were horses.......................[smilie=s:

[quilbilly]

I had a Contender carbine 18" barrel made for 9mm Luger and love it. It did take a while to develop the right load because I had to get rid of some pre-existing notions. Recoil is nonexistent and IMO it will take down anything under 100 pounds at under 100 yards. Incredibly economical to shoot. You should experience the same with your 25 ACP. I call it my rook rifle but it will do a lot more than knock down rooks.

[Jupiter7]

You're not the only one I guess:

http://edstc.com/hot.html

Scroll down to pistol barrels, 25acp in stock

[Ledslnger]

Why not get a straw and some dried peas........

No doubt, I would rather go with an airgun. A guy was shot by a robber in MN a few years back with a .25, guy was wearing a leather vest and not one of the rounds penetrated it. LOL

[GARD72977]

That's interesting. Im really wanting one for a encore. I think Im going to just sell the contender. They are just too light as a rifle. I may wait until I have this figured out though.

Its a toss up between a 25acp and a 25-20wcf. They have nothing in common! Been looking at the 25-20 because it would shoot lead well and be reasonable flat for plinking and informal target shooting, Im a coke can fanatic. 9mm is also in the running. I think I just want something



You're not the only one I guess:

http://edstc.com/hot.html

Scroll down to pistol barrels, 25acp in stock

[Chev. William]

If you are looking for a barrel, Track of the Wolf has a .25 barrel 'liner'. It is as big as a regular .38 pistol barrel. You can get it in any length you want. Lothar Walther also can make you one in .25acp bore and groove, in any length you want. I have one of each waiting for inspiration and attention. Remember that it is different from the .25 cal rifle. Don't have the specs in front of me, seems the groove dia on the ACP is .250, while the rifle is .257. I was thinking of reworking an old AR7. The Walther barrel is about the right diameter for this. And I was thinking of making a cartridge based on the .32S&WL necked to .25. Again, still waiting for inspiration. [smilie=1:

The .25ACP SAAMI specification for Bore is .243" -0.0"/+.004" and for Grooves is .250" -0.0"/+.004".
I have a Lothar Walthar "Pistol Barrel Blank, .25ACP/6.35mm Browning" in C-M Alloy Steel that measures 23.4" length, bore slugs .242", Grooves slug .249" as measured with a dial caliper over a Soft Lead Ball that was forced through the barrel, there is about .001 tolerance on measurements due to NOT being at S.T. & P. in a controlled Lab. Environment. My 'shop' was at about 86 Degrees at the time.

Please also look at the posts on .250/6.35mm groove diameter rifle cartridges lengthened .25ACP cartridges.

This includes the .25 Stevens RF and .25 Stevens Short RF, some tentative named cases called .250ALR, .250ALS, .250ALRM, .250ALC, .250ALRx Basis, the Winchester or Remington called "25-10RF" chambers and the conversions to CF by various users.

Best Regards,
Chev. William

[mikeym1a]

No doubt, I would rather go with an airgun. A guy was shot by a robber in MN a few years back with a .25, guy was wearing a leather vest and not one of the rounds penetrated it. LOL

With little boolits, placement is everything. Should have shot his eyes out, and then just tip-toes around him! I've wanted a high powered air gun for ages, but, I can buy a firearm for the cost of one of those compressed air guns. Unless I could make it myself, I'd never be able to afford it. Interesting Idea, though. I kinda like the repeating air rifle that went on the Lewis and Clark expedition. It shouldn't be too hard to replicate, what with the drawings they have. The breech mechanism was facsinating.

[GARD72977]

This is just a niche gun. I guess I have to justify it to myself so I could spend the money. I don't think it has anything to offer in the way of hunting or self defense. I have bought a lot of guns that had great uses but ended up just shooting lead bullets at targets. I thinking of buying a gun that is intended to shoot lead bullets at targets.

[Chev. William]

Adding "Fuel to the Fire": The .25 Stevens RF/ 25-10 RF used a case length of 1.124", Round it to 1.125" for modern replacements, and fired an INSIDE Lubed .251" diameter 63gr. Lead bullet at about 1000fps to 1100fps, was reported as having Good target performance up to 200yards Off Hand and an Excellent "Pot Meat" caliber, much better than the .22 Long rifle as it did not destroy as much meat. it did have a 'high trajectory' but the .32 Long RF and .32 Long colt were even higher and not as good either in distance nor in getting "pot Meat". This is by writers in 1890's, when the cartridges were BP loads and the target shooting of the time was mostly at 200 yards OFF Hand, or even longer distances almost all with Iron Sights, not Optics. The 25 Stevens did make the transition to Smokeless Powder loadings and was produced at least up until the conversion to War Production in 1942.
Several posters on this (Cast Booits) Forum, and other Forums, have detailed some of the conversions from RF to CF using various methods to get back to shooting the .25 as a 'Squirrel Gun'.
There are also those who use a machined brass case, a .22 Caliber Blank, some BP, and a Cast bullet to keep them firing as RF rifles.
As to .32 Long RF/.32 Long Colt (NOT .32 S&W Long!) there have also been conversions and even one poster who machined out .32 Long Colt cases to hold .27 Caliber Powder Tool Load (Grade 3), both with and without extra BP, to fire in his antique Revolvers and multiple barrel pistols with documented success. According to him the .27 Cal blank rim does get hit by the .32 Rim Fire firing pin tip, when centered in his modified .32 Long Colt Cartridges.
NOTE: There are 12 Power Levels standardized in Power Tool loads from Grade 1, the weakest, through grade 12, the strongest, and in at least three different Calibers, all Defined by the body diameter. There is information on the internet giving the power levels, their color codes, and the strength of load described in fps. But I have not found what the 'fps' is pushing out the tool.

[Ledslnger]

A power tool load was the parent case for the .17 WSM I believe. And, lots of stuff has changed since the 1890s.....except the performance of the .25 caliber. Less damage to the meat IF you stopped the animal you were shooting at because the bullet didn't penetrate well I am sure. Lots of new .22 cal bullets now, so there is no way a .25 can compete with the new .22 rounds out. Look at Aguila's Sniper SubSonics...wow they hit a lot harder than any .25 cal.

[GARD72977]

I started this thread because I want to hear form some one that has a barrel and reloading for it and shooting. I love all the negative responses. The theme is a 25acp is not a good cartridge because......... Well I have to say you are right. But T/C has done lots of useless cartridges for years and people have come up with a reason to buy them.

If I wanted a 22lr I would just shoot one I already have.

What I was really wanting to hear is the reloading part (not for function in a pistol) I would like to know if it the tiny capacity is over sensitive to powder charge variation. How hard is to seat the bullet. What is the accuracy form a rifle barrel. I am assuming that a turrent press would be needed since dillion does not make a conversion for the 25acp

I was shooting my 300-221 rimmed at the range one day and a guy let me know that the 300 whisper was too much sugar for a dime. I should just buy a 32-20 and be done with it. He has one and it is great. I wonder if all the guys buying the 300 blackout know what this guy did?

Sorry for the rant but Im not shooting anyone in the forehead or even squirrels for that matter. Just want something to pop coke cans with. If it works for small game thats great.

[texassako]

What I was really wanting to hear is the reloading part (not for function in a pistol) I would like to know if it the tiny capacity is over sensitive to powder charge variation. How hard is to seat the bullet. What is the accuracy form a rifle barrel. I am assuming that a turrent press would be needed since dillion does not make a conversion for the 25acp

I will relate what I have found and leave out the pistol parts. I load on a single stage and not sure who has a progressive for the little case. If you have nimble fingers, it is not bad. It is sensitive to charge variations. I throw my charges with a rotor style pistol powder measure with an adjustable drum that will accurately throw these little charges. I picked the powders that gave me the most consistent throws. Bullet seating has been pretty easy with my 2 molds just using the Lee die set which gives me enough flair on the case mouth. I have a LBT 31gr mold that is actually an air rifle bullet and the Ranchdog which is actually oversize for a proper .25 ACP chamber and bore. I would love to see what the LBT would do in a rifle since it is very accurate and really scoots with a full case of Clays out of a short barrel. The little LBT bullets:

81242

[Chev. William]

I started this thread because I want to hear form some one that has a barrel and reloading for it and shooting. I love all the negative responses. The theme is a 25acp is not a good cartridge because......... Well I have to say you are right. But T/C has done lots of useless cartridges for years and people have come up with a reason to buy them.

If I wanted a 22lr I would just shoot one I already have.

What I was really wanting to hear is the reloading part (not for function in a pistol) I would like to know if it the tiny capacity is over sensitive to powder charge variation. How hard is to seat the bullet. What is the accuracy form a rifle barrel. I am assuming that a turrent press would be needed since dillion does not make a conversion for the 25acp

I was shooting my 300-221 rimmed at the range one day and a guy let me know that the 300 whisper was too much sugar for a dime. I should just buy a 32-20 and be done with it. He has one and it is great. I wonder if all the guys buying the 300 blackout know what this guy did?

Sorry for the rant but Im not shooting anyone in the forehead or even squirrels for that matter. Just want something to pop coke cans with. If it works for small game thats great.

Check out the web site "Ballistics by the Inch" as it gives information on shooting several calibers, including three loadings of .25ACP, through barrels of 18" down to 2" in one inch increments. The Factory loads seemed to level off in speed at around 16 inch to 17 inch length of barrel. And, yes, there IS more potential performance out of the .25ACP Provided it is loaded and fired out of a Locked Breech Long Barrel. In the Blow-back actions of 2 to 2.5 inch barrels it is limited to 17,400psi Max Pressure loads.
Most loading data uses Fast Pistol powders ot get performance out of the short barrels, slower powders may give more overall performance out of a Rifle length due to the longer and higher area under the pressure / time curve before the bullet leaves the muzzle.

[ebner glocken]

I started this thread because I want to hear form some one that has a barrel and reloading for it and shooting. I love all the negative responses. The theme is a 25acp is not a good cartridge because......... Well I have to say you are right. But T/C has done lots of useless cartridges for years and people have come up with a reason to buy them.

If I wanted a 22lr I would just shoot one I already have.

What I was really wanting to hear is the reloading part (not for function in a pistol) I would like to know if it the tiny capacity is over sensitive to powder charge variation. How hard is to seat the bullet. What is the accuracy form a rifle barrel. I am assuming that a turrent press would be needed since dillion does not make a conversion for the 25acp

I was shooting my 300-221 rimmed at the range one day and a guy let me know that the 300 whisper was too much sugar for a dime. I should just buy a 32-20 and be done with it. He has one and it is great. I wonder if all the guys buying the 300 blackout know what this guy did?

Sorry for the rant but Im not shooting anyone in the forehead or even squirrels for that matter. Just want something to pop coke cans with. If it works for small game thats great.

Dillion does not make a conversion kit for a 550 but elite ammo does make a shell plate for the 5.7x28 FN (almost 100 bucks after shipping). If memory serves it's the same shell holder. Never tried a 25acp in the plate, then again never had much use for a 25acp. This sounds like a fun little project but w/o a doubt falls into the "because I can" school of thought.

Ebner

[GARD72977]

I am leaning away from this for now. It gets to be a expensive venture in uncharted territory. If I get back to this it will be with a turrent press. I have a custom muzzleloader to pay for next week. I may sell something im not shooting and invest in this project. I will be watching the group buy on the 25 HP mold. May go ahead and jump in on that.

[Chev. William]

inadvertent double post deleted by the author.

[Chev. William]

I started this thread because I want to hear form some one that has a barrel and reloading for it and shooting. I love all the negative responses. The theme is a 25acp is not a good cartridge because......... Well I have to say you are right. But T/C has done lots of useless cartridges for years and people have come up with a reason to buy them.

If I wanted a 22lr I would just shoot one I already have.

What I was really wanting to hear is the reloading part (not for function in a pistol) I would like to know if it the tiny capacity is over sensitive to powder charge variation. How hard is to seat the bullet. What is the accuracy form a rifle barrel. I am assuming that a turrent press would be needed since dillion does not make a conversion for the 25acp

I was shooting my 300-221 rimmed at the range one day and a guy let me know that the 300 whisper was too much sugar for a dime. I should just buy a 32-20 and be done with it. He has one and it is great. I wonder if all the guys buying the 300 blackout know what this guy did?

Sorry for the rant but Im not shooting anyone in the forehead or even squirrels for that matter. Just want something to pop coke cans with. If it works for small game thats great.

OK, here is my thinking on the .25ACP in longer barrels (than the typical 2 or 2-1/2 inch long pistols). They should work and factory loads will give somewhat faster muzzle velocity. It is possible to hand load and seat bullets for the .25ACP and the cartridge, due to its small net volume, is somewhat sensitive to charge type and weight.
From experiments I have found a Magtech manufactured case will hold 5.0 grains of loose fffg Black Powder level full to the rim of the case, and about 4.0 grains if room is left to seat a bullet. Bullets commercially available at the moment:
35 Grain jacketed hollow point.
50 Grain full metal jacket round nose.
50 Grain "Ranch Dog" design Round Flat Nose Cast Lead.
For this case these have also been found to be the best tradeoff in bullet weight and case capacity.
Smokeless Powder Charge sensitivity is definitely a problem with the small net case volume, and that can and does vary with the manufacturer of the case used.
In a Pistol, the powder selection necessarily is limited and favors the faster burning powders to get useful velocity out of the stubby pistol barrel, but is limited also by the Blowback type action.
in a Rifle, especially one with a strong locking breech, it should be possible to enlarge upon the powder selections and the pressure level that you load to.
Moving up from the 14,704psi limit of CIP, or the 17,400psi limit of SAMMI, should be done carefully but is possible in a Rifle, with its more fully supportive and Locked Breech.
I would suggest that anyone thinking of experimenting with pressures and powder charges get the Software "QuickLOAD" as it allows quick and simple variations on Powder and charge to be calculated for pressure limits, muzzle velocity, and many other characteristics, just make sure you set the Bullet, case volume, and other parameters to match the Case and Bullet you plan to use. the program does have 'preset values' for a .251 50gr bullet and a .25ACP case although the volume listed i son the low side of the range, that is "conservative" as the pressure calculated will be higher than would happen in life. As an example: the Net Case Volume is preset at 4.7 grains of water. Magtech cases have a net case volume of 5.05 grains of water. Changing this one parameter will change the calculated pressure with a given charge and powder.

The only powder, charge, and load I am going to list is this:
GOEX fffg Black Powder, 4.0 grains charge, over a small pistol primer, and capped with a Magtech 50gr FMJRN or Cast Lead 50gr RFN bullet.
This is NOT for use in semi-automatic pistols! You really do not want to go through the BP Cleaning process with a Semi-Automatic Pistol.

Best Regards,
Chev William

[dangerranger]

Quite a few years back My grandad had a 25 acp chambered rolling block. It was his squirrel rifle. Its perforance was very much like a 22 mag but in those days the 22 mag only came with round nose lead bullets. He had this rifle made to take advantage of the better bullets. Now I think 22 mag is made with a good selection of hunting bullets. I shot the rifle a couple of times, and it was accurate, easy on the shoulder, and on the ears. Grandad died in 67 so it was a couple of years before that when I saw it last. But Ill ask my uncle if he knows what became of it. He shot jacketed HPs out of it. The longer barrel made a big differance over the 2" barrels we normaly think of when we think of 25 acp. You have me thinking I may want one built up for myself! DR

[mikeym1a]

Somebody had a pic of a handful of very nice looking boolits. I presume the were .25s. Where might a person get such a mold? I have the urge to experiment....:-D

[bearcove]

I think a 38 spl would be better