303 savage

[starmac]

two questions here.
#1 has anybody formed 303 brass out of anything popular??

#2 what could you bore out a 303 barrel to if you had one with a bad bore??

The reason I am asking is I have in the past run into some nice 303s with bad barrels for a song, may never again,but these have mostly had octagon barrels and could have been nice rifles, if you could bore them out.

[runfiverun]

I believe you can make it from 30-30 brass.
they were just 308 diameter barrels.
mr savage knew velocity would sell and he needed to beat the 30-30 to make a go of it.
so he just used 311 diameter bullets in a 308 barrel giving just enough more velocity/pressure to look better than the Winchester round.
as far as a re-bore 32 cal, 8mm, 338, 348, or 358 could be easily done.

[nekshot]

yes I formed some from 30-30. I only used them for sub-sonic shooting. They simply seemed too loose to use full throttle. A 303 barrel is inviting a 30-40 reamer. I get my brass at Grafs and becareful not to lose any. I heard of 30-30 brass being a successful fit but for me I did not trust it above lite loads.

[gnoahhh]

I wouldn't use .30/30's in a .303 unless I was desperate. .303's have been formed from .30/40's and .220 Swifts by swaging them to shape- another last ditch scheme that works fairly well but is a lot of work. Best just to buy the PRVI's from Graf's and be done with it. Jamison's used to make it, and probably still do, and is good brass also.

[texassako]

#2 what could you bore out a 303 barrel to if you had one with a bad bore??




I like digging through the books for what-ifs. I came across a little number in Ken Howell's book called the .408 Winchester that has almost the same rim, head, and length dimensions as the .303 Savage, but straight cased for a .406" bullet. Winchester even submitted it to SAAMI for use in the 94 during the '60s. A few mentions here: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?117857-400-Winchester/page2

[john hayslip]

The 303 Savage is a case for which there is no easy solution, if any at all, if you don't have the correct case. It was a true 308 bore and has the same water capacity as a 30-30 so any 30-30 data would work, except the 99 is stronger than the other lever actions and would probably take a little more. Mine is a takedown and is probably not as strong as a fixed barrel.

[gnoahhh]

The takedown won't be any weaker than a solid frame.

[Knight Templar]

Remington 220 swift will work if your extractor will grab the rim you may also have to turn the necks. That is what i used for years.

[gnoahhh]

A couple years ago I submitted some polite requests around the internet for .303 Savage brass and got flooded with stuff- all good American made brass, including a few boxes of virgin W-W stuff. Probably enough to keep me going for 20 years. I did buy some PRVI brass from Graf's just in case though.

As for boring out, I have a ratty .303 takedown barrel in .303 that I've been contemplating having it bored out to .35 by JES, and open the chamber neck to .35 and having a .303/.35 wildcat to add to the other 3 barrels I have going onto my Model 1899 Custom project. (.22HP, .25/35 AI, .30/30 all for one gun, so far. A .35 would round it out nicely.) It's a heavy 1899A barrel and there's enough meat in it to take a .35 bore, but it will necessitate a second fore arm as the other 3 barrels are 1899H Lightweight carbine barrels.

That's something the Original Poster needs to consider if boring out to .35. The carbine barrels aren't thick enough for a .35. The Rifle, and Short Rifle, barrels will stand it though.

[300savage]

In a pinch you can cut about 1/4" off a 40 S&w and slide that down over your 30-30 brass to the rim and it will work.
After the first firing it won't ever come off.
Kind of redneck solution, but it works well if you have an easy way to cut off the 40's.

[stocker]

John Barsness wrote an article several years back in either Rifle or Handloader detailing how he formed cases from either 30/40 or 303 Brit. Involved making a spindle that fit the neck of the case, holding it an electric drill chuck and filing the web area down to proper diameter while it spun. Think he said it only took a few minutes per case and he had proper case fit after running through a sizer and trimming to length. Hornady recently (in the last year or so) did a run on loaded cartridges (150 grain) and you might still find some on the market if you search.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I've been using .303 Savage brass by Prvi. Graf's has it. About like a .30-30. A little easier to load cast due to the long neck. I've heard of the .220 Swift conversion and just using shortened .30-30 brass. I've heard of the Hornady .303 Savage cartridges, maybe Graf's or Midway? Lee makes dies, the Prvi brass from Graf's is the current best solution. I have solid and takedown versions of .303 and .300 savages, no difference in strength. The take-downs can also be very accurate - 1 MOA at a hundred plus minus. My 6lb featherweight 20" barrel goes under 2" at 100 yards. Lyman receiver sight - good light and no wind with 155
grain cast flat-nose Gas Check 18gr very old H4198.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

Before you worry about the barrel, try shooting it after a thorough cleaning. It is surprising how well some bad looking barrels shoot.

[Duckiller]

I have a .303 Savage cartridge that was fired in a 303 British. About 15 years shooters next to me had a new SMLE and went to a LGS for ammo. They ask for 303 and got 303 Savage. Had very little recoil and wasn't too accurate. I am not an expert in reforming brass, but I would think it possible to make Savage out of British brass. May have to anneal necks and shorten a bunch.

[M99SavNut]

I too have a .303 Savage case which was fired in a .303 Brit - recognized right away what it was when I saw it laying on the ground at the range. Swelled out a bunch at the base, almost no neck. People should learn to read, then apply the learning, especially when working with things that involve controlled detonations.

Grafs had primed .303 S cases last time I looked, and I bought some of the unprimed ones when those were still available. They are quite a bit heavier than either the Norma .303 S cases (available from Huntington Die Specialties, but pricey) or the original Winchester or Peters cases.

I also tried the .220 Swift/.303 Savage conversion, but without notable success as far as I carried it. One of my .303s has a rough barrel, but it shoots OK with j-word projectiles, and haven't tried cast in it. I second MLG's suggestion of a thorough cleaning, as a rebore would require custom dies to reload.

I've also read about some of the old-timers who ran a .30-30 reamer into the .303 barrel and then fired whichever ammo they could get their hands on at the time. Created a double shoulder and bulged the .30WCF case, but pressures were apparently low enough that case splits weren't a problem.

There's a lot of things to play with on one of these rifles, and the M99 is a good, strong base to start with. Keep us posted on what you work out.

[300savage]

Seriously, I have made many 303 cases out of 30-30 and a short piece of a 40 cal neck slipped down over the case. It takes up the slack in the chamber in the web area , and then it gets fire formed permanently in place.
Or you can do it the hard way.

But hopefully you can just buy some..

[nekshot]

300avage, thats good to know. I will give it a try as I am down to 18 pcs of brass. How much did you have to back off powder from lesser capacity or was that not affected?

[300savage]

Sorry it took me awhile to get back to you, split my pelvis last night and am in the hospital this morning.
I just started with a mid range load and had no problems.

[docone31]

Sounds like some real recoil though.
Hope you be ok.

[gnoahhh]

300avage, thats good to know. I will give it a try as I am down to 18 pcs of brass. How much did you have to back off powder from lesser capacity or was that not affected?


Geewillikers, just buy some PRVI brass and be done with it!

[brstevns]

Maybe he is on a fixed income and cannot afford any at this time.

[gnoahhh]

Indeed possible, and note I didn't mean it to be a brash statement! (Although it may have sounded as such. Not many around here are of as limited income as I am, I know of pinching pennies in order to buy good brass.)

[nekshot]

300savage, ouch I felt it in body when I read of your situation. I pray for a quick recovery!

gnoahhh, no hurt on my account, yes I am regretfully on a fixed income. I fell off a silo when I was 12 and somehow worked thru the pain for 40 years and then it all caught up to me. I have had 3 operations and need 1 more. So I am not complaining because God has been good to me and I was not paraylized but with one in college and another soon there I have become somewhat of a cheapscape. I am going to look about getting some more correct brass for the 303!

[451whitworth]

Maybe he is on a fixed income and cannot afford any at this time.

we're all on a fixed income. there's only so many hours in the week

[nekshot]

451, so very true and this president and "our" govenor are sure trying to keep it fixed!(slightly off thread, sorry)

[gnoahhh]

I have a line on a stash of old (but good) American brass for the .303 Savage. If it comes through I'll contact y'all because I really don't need any more at the moment.

[uscra112]

John Barsness wrote an article several years back in either Rifle or Handloader detailing how he formed cases from either 30/40 or 303 Brit. Involved making a spindle that fit the neck of the case, holding it an electric drill chuck and filing the web area down to proper diameter while it spun. Think he said it only took a few minutes per case and he had proper case fit after running through a sizer and trimming to length. Hornady recently (in the last year or so) did a run on loaded cartridges (150 grain) and you might still find some on the market if you search.

This can be done, but it's not as simple as it looks. Done incorrectly, you get a thin "belt" just above the web that can generate frequent head separations. (I've done this type of conversion, including the extremely drastic one that makes .22 Lovell from .223 brass.) Believe me, if there's any commercial brass to be had, you don't want to be making it this way.

[stocker]

This can be done, but it's not as simple as it looks. Done incorrectly, you get a thin "belt" just above the web that can generate frequent head separations. (I've done this type of conversion, including the extremely drastic one that makes .22 Lovell from .223 brass.) Believe me, if there's any commercial brass to be had, you don't want to be making it this way.

uscra: I don't have the magazine any longer and after thinking about your comment Barsness may have sized them prior to the thinning thus removing the metal primarily over the web rather than the thin area in front. If any one can track down the article it would clarify what I remember.