Rebore?

[Ithaca Gunner]

I have an 1898 vintage Model 1894 Winchester saddle carbine in .30WCF. Not in collector condition by a long shot, it's seen it's share of honest hard work and weather, but is all there as it left the factory and it's the smoothest 1894 I've ever cycled. Only thing that keeps it in the safe instead of in the woods, or on the range is the bore, it still has rifling, but it also has severe pitting.

I've been thinking about getting it re-bored, (38-55 is my first choice). Is there a barrel-smith that can do this? Or maybe have it re-barrel it with a new made barrel with the same contour and stud front sight as the original?

I don't want to sell it or trade it for another, I want to shoot this one. There it is with it's brother, also 1898 vintage, special order sporting rifle, with a perfect .30 bore.

80701

[cabezaverde]

Here you go.
http://www.35caliber.com/3.html

This guy can do exactly what you want. I have not used him, but he has a lot of satisfied customers here and on other internet boards.

[starmac]

Isn't there a member here that rebores, or religns them, I'm thinking Taylor maybe.

[richhodg66]

If it were me, I'd relign it. I've never had it done, but am told a good smith can do it to where you have to look very, very closely to tell and then you'd have a good shooter that's more "original" than a rebore would allow.

[Ithaca Gunner]

I hadn't considered having it relined, I figured relining was for .22rf's and black powder guns.

[richhodg66]

Check around, but it seems I've heard of them being able to do it for .30-30 class cartridges.

[Ithaca Gunner]

I don't doubt you, I just hadn't considered it for center fire smokeless cartridges myself. It would most likely be my best option for keeping the carbine as original as possible.

[richhodg66]

There was a guy I know on another orum who had a High Wall done a couple or three years ago by a fella in Tennesee and he was real happy with his work. I'll see if I can find out the name of the gunsmith who did it.

[TXGunNut]

Just got a rifle back from JES, great work and a good man to deal with. I'd be hesitant to rebore a rifle as nice as yours, would probably opt for the reline.
Silly question, how's it shoot? I hear some badly pitted bores actually shoot. I have a 32-20 Colt DA that shoots quite well, bore looks like the proverbial sewerpipe.

[6pt-sika]

I hadn't considered having it relined, I figured relining was for .22rf's and black powder guns.

All of the reutable reliners I've talked with said they would gaurantee their work for cast bullets only . So if one wants to shoot jacketed they are better of reboring if they can .

A few years back I looked into relining a couple Marlin 1895CB's to 38-56 and 40-65 . The cost was going to be something in the $300 range and hope they didn't bugger the finish or reblue was added on top of that !

Recently I started thinking about a couple chamberings in the Ruger #1 I would like . First and foremost taking a Ruger #1B in 7mm REM MAG and making it a 8mm REM MAG . For that it was going to be about $300 for the rebore and whatever it cost me to rent the chamber reamer and we would do it in the shop I work out of .

I still think I'll eventually do the 8mm REM MAG thing and perhaps a Ruger #1B in 22-250 to 260 REM and or 6.5-06 .

[wrench man]

If you think you want a 38-55 call JES (the link above) and talk to him!, great price, excelent work and lightning fast turn around for a gun smith!

[TXGunNut]

If you think you want a 38-55 call JES (the link above) and talk to him!, great price, excelent work and lightning fast turn around for a gun smith!

Yep, what he said! I like an old rifle that's "been there, done that". Would be a shame to let a slick old action sit in the safe or hang on the wall because of a bad bore. Still hesitant to do something like that to a 100+ year old gun, but it' s your gun and I might just do the same thing.
Thanks for sharing, please keep us posted.

[bob208]

I don't know why every one has to say it has no collector value. that carbine would be welcome in a lot of collections. have you shot the gun ? I would go with the reline . but not the rebore.

[rbertalotto]

I've had JES rebore three rifles to 38-55 for me. All three atre amazingly accurate. He charges $225 including return shipping and you'll have the rifle back in a couple weeks. Simply can't be beat.

The 38-55 is an inherently accurate cartridge. It held the benchrest record for many years. Black Powder or smokeles..both shoot great. Cast or jacketed..ditto!

His work is superb and far better bore finish than we have been seeing from some current manufacturers........

[GabbyM]

32 Win Special is another option.

[Ithaca Gunner]

Just got a rifle back from JES, great work and a good man to deal with. I'd be hesitant to rebore a rifle as nice as yours, would probably opt for the reline.
Silly question, how's it shoot? I hear some badly pitted bores actually shoot. I have a 32-20 Colt DA that shoots quite well, bore looks like the proverbial sewerpipe.

It averages about a 9" pattern at 100yds. As I said, it does have rifling, but it's fuzzy and washed, no sharp lands at all, it's just sort of there, and one pit in particular that looks like you could hide a VW in it. It doesn't tumble boolits though, cast or jacketed.

If I go with the re-bore it'll be .38-55, I've considered .32 Spl. and .32-40, but I want something big to use cast with for hunting, ( I don't have anything between 8mm and .45-70 right now). Midway has .38-55 brass in stock, I can get a good mold from Accurate in a few weeks time. If relined to the original .30WCF, I would plan on using my RCBS 30-180-FN mold and shoot cast, lots and lots of .30WCF brass laying around here. Right now it's a coin toss, relining to .30WCF would stay true to the rifle's markings and factory history, .38-55 would be a lot of fun and make a very effective hunting rig. .30WCF would cost what it is to reline it, .38-55 would cost the price of the re-bore plus mold, dies, sizer die, and brass.

I'll make some calls Tuesday and decide from there. J E S looks very good right now, but I do wnt to explore the reline option also.

Many thanks for the helpful replies!

[Ithaca Gunner]

I don't know why every one has to say it has no collector value. that carbine would be welcome in a lot of collections. have you shot the gun ? I would go with the reline . but not the rebore.

The reline isn't out by a longshot, Bob! I'm going to explore both possibilities and I can see the definite advantages in relining it over re-boring it to .38-55. If I were assured I could use jacketed with a .30WCF reline, my mind would already be made up, it came from the factory in .30WCF and letters to .30WCF. .38-55's in 1898 did not bear the Winchester "Special Smokeless Steel" proof either, so I see your point.

I need to make some calls on Tuesday. Thanks for your input Bob, and any future advice you have to give would be much appreciated. as much as I would like it to be a .38-55 for my current pleasure, it was built as a .30WCF and the man who bought it in 1898 wanted a .30WCF as his working gun. I will look into relining first, but would like to have the option of shooting jacketed also.

[KCSO]

You need to go to JES for the rebore. The 30 30 isn't a good cantidate for reline because of the way the barrel is tapered and the shape of the chamber and the chamber pressure . In the 30-30 you nee to make a liner that is tapered with a thicker section over the chamber and in the 94 you don't have much meat to work with. You can develop cracks in the bore or the chamber due to the higher pressure. Re line works best for low pressure rounds. I have done it on thicker barrels but wouldn't do it on a 94.

[rbertalotto]

[QUOTE][You need to go to JES for the rebore. The 30 30 isn't a good cantidate for reline because of the way the barrel is tapered and the shape of the chamber and the chamber pressure . In the 30-30 you nee to make a liner that is tapered with a thicker section over the chamber and in the 94 you don't have much meat to work with. You can develop cracks in the bore or the chamber due to the higher pressure. Re line works best for low pressure rounds. I have done it on thicker barrels but wouldn't do it on a 94. /QUOTE]

What he said! And it will be well over $400 to get it done close to right.....and a few months to get it back............

[Ithaca Gunner]

An option I haven't mentioned, (like a dummy I forgot the guy's name and business). I seem to remember a custom gunsmith in Fla? that specializes in restoration and makes a very close copy of old Winchester barrels and installs them. Probably expensive, but I would like to check if anyone has his information.

[MtGun44]

If it was mine, .32 Win Spl would be the answer.

Bill

[Ithaca Gunner]

I considered the .32Spl. first, but with that one deep pit about half way down and only .013" separating the two, I'm thinking something bigger would be better and I've always admired the .38-55 anyway. Thanks for the reply, Bill. I believe a .32Spl. with cast would do well, and leave more steel around the boolit.

[bigted]

I fully understand the "need" for a 38-55. I had much the same desire and landed an old 93 marlin so chambered. wouldn't shoot worth beans so I did get it relined with Taylor here on the forum. great job and fast turnaround for me. no mar's on any finish and the rifle shoots lights out. I don't know about the dimensions of your barrel but I have heard nothing but great things about Jess. I doubt that he would bore out a rifle that would make it un-safe nor un-useable with any load that would be prudent in any other 38-55 win.

my "need" for a good reliable 38-55 has been fulfilled and I am very happy with my re-line of this "collectable Marlin". I don't give two $#!^^'s about collecting but instead I desire shooting these rifles that were intended to be tools of a way of life then ... AND NOW !!!

if a re-bore lives in your want/need dept. then by all means do what you want as nothing else is going to scratch that itch. allow nobody to dissuade you in the task at hand so you can enjoy the rifle that you already own and are familiar with. a love affair with a weapon is way more "collectable" then any money worth can ever replace. ... I say GO FOR IT!

[woody402]

I plan on getting a gun rebored to 35/30 soon. I had a marlin set aside for the project but my father in law wanted it so I have to find another marlin. I have a set of dies on the way. I was originally going the 38-55 but changed to the 35/30 since I really like 35 calibers.

[gnoahhh]

If one wanted to maintain the originality of the rifle, one could simply have a new barrel (any caliber) fitted and save the original shot out barrel if a new owner wants to have restored to originality.

[Ithaca Gunner]

If one wanted to maintain the originality of the rifle, one could simply have a new barrel (any caliber) fitted and save the original shot out barrel if a new owner wants to have restored to originality.

I thought of that, and I remember a shop, (Fla?) that makes reproduction vintage Winchester barrels, but can't remember the name of the shop.

[Dan Cash]

John Taylor of this forum does a superlative reline. He did a .30-40 M1895 Win for me. It shoots like a hero.

[Ithaca Gunner]

I'll have to shoot him a PM. As much as I like the .38-55 I think it would be best to keep the original .30WCF in this gun.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

So the bore looks bad, how does it shoot?

[Ithaca Gunner]

So the bore looks bad, how does it shoot?

Poor, about 6-8" "group" at 50yds. The boolits do go in straight though, it doesn't key-hole them, Jacketed or cast. Aside from the pitting the rifling is eroded pretty badly.

John Taylor is backed up at this time, and at $400.00 to re-line it, I'm going to keep checking into having it re-bored to .38-55.

[TXGunNut]

38-55 sounds like a good plan, was going to buy a Rossi & have it bored out to 38-55 until I remembered I had a nice 375 Big Bore stashed around here somewhere. Midway has the Lyman 375449 in stock now, just off backorder. Mine came in last week.

[Ithaca Gunner]

I saw your big bore in another thread, NICE! I saw one at a gun show like yours a few years ago, priced right, but I hesitated and when I went back it was gone. Oh well, I got a deal on an Ithaca 37 on my way out, so I felt better on leaving the show...:bigsmyl2:

[woody402]

I'm going to send a gun out for a 35/30 shortly. I kind of post my project gun to my father in law. He liked it so he has it now. Now I need to find another gun to send out.

[OverMax]

If all you want is a shooter. Anyway you go about it. Be it a re-bore or new barrel install. It's all good. But I would ask the gunsmith if changing its original caliber to another (30-30 to a 38-55) will require modifications being done to the rifles (levering action?) That Sir would be my prime concern as I'm sure you already have that in mind too. Good luck with your project.

[Ithaca Gunner]

I know it's been a while, but I just got off the phone with Jesse of JES reboring. A 38-55 it will be, 5 groove, 1:15 twist, .376". Total cost with priority delivery, $265.00. It's going out to be done next week. He said if any tweeking needs done to the action, he will take care of it, no charge. Sounds like a great guy to deal with!

[TXGunNut]

Good call, and you're a good judge of character. Jessie is indeed a good man to do business with. Looking forward to a report when you get it back.