451 volunteer rifle

[milcol]

I recently picked up a .451 PH volunteer rifle,it came with a lyman mold 457121av,is this the correct mold or should I get the 451114 mold.
Thanks

[DIRT Farmer]

I do not have my mould chart with me but can tell you that the rifle takes a 451 in grease grove. Paper patch the Volenteer takes a swadged core 001 larger than the Pedersoli Gibbs, at least mine does. I have had decent (hunting)groups with the Lyman 439-186 patched with printer paper.

[Nobade]

I am jealous! I have been looking for one of those rifles for years. Yes, the .451" mould is the right one if you want to shoot grease groove boolits.

-Nobade

[451whitworth]

either will work. I use the 457121 & 451114 in my PH Volunteer sized to .450" along with a few other styles. Does your rifle have Rigby or Henry rifling?

[milcol]

It has the Henry rifling.

[heelerau]

Gents I to have just picked up a Parker Hale .451 Volunteer, I had a quick look the other day as it will be at the dealers for a few more weeks whilst the paperwork goes through and I can finally pick it up. I thought on quick examination it had Henry Rifling, but may not, may be of the late 70's manufacture. The mould it comes with is a lyman 457-621, this bullet has a very long ogive, and 3 grease grooves. No other gear like swages comes with it. My mate who has given me this rifle used 73 grs of FFg goex, and an alloy bullet of may be 16 to one lead to tin. I will start with this load and see what paper patched bullets are available.
Cheers
Heelerau

[Tatume]

Congratulations on acquiring an excellent target and hunting rifle. Mine is my favorite muzzle loading rifle.

Lyman 451114 is the correct mold for the Parker-Hale Enfield Volunteer. They can be hand lubed and loaded without sizing, which is how I prepare mine for hunting. A tight fit is needed to prevent the bullet from migrating away from the powder charge during a day of hunting.

For range work they can be sized as small as 0.450" and shoot just as accurately. Sized bullets are much easier to load, although the unsized bullets are not hard to load either.

I recommend getting the correct mold. The larger mold was intended for the Whitworth rifle. While it may be possible to load and shoot them, bullets cast from the Lyman 451114 are more satisfactory.

You will enjoy your rifle.

Take care, Tom

[johnson1942]

heelerrau, for a paperpatched bullet just get a pushthrough reduceing sizer and reduce your cast groove bullet to the pp size you need. it will shoot just as good as a smooth sided bullet with a cupped base. same mould two diff bullets with the help of a resizer. also if for some reason they come out a hair on the too small diam size that can be fixed also. just roll them a little between two clean sharp flat files. that will knarl them nice up a few thousands. their you go have fun.

[Rattus58]

I recently picked up a .451 PH volunteer rifle,it came with a lyman mold 457121av,is this the correct mold or should I get the 451114 mold.
ThanksThe 457121 is a 45-70 mold of 470 grains or thereabouts. The 451114 is made for the .451 and is 450 grains, or thereabouts. I size my bullets for the volunteer at .452, whether a slimmed down 457 bullet or whatever as cast .451 bullets I have. I use wads with my volunteer and I also shoot a sweet 470 grain bullet fashioned after the 457121 but a .451with gas check and a more rounded nose. The upshot with my volunteer is that they all shoot superbly from that gun. The most forgiving and accurate gun I own.

[heelerau]

Gentlemen, have not been on this forum for awhile, am still waiting on my additions to my license before I can go pick up my 3 rifles. I am pretty sure that the rifle is Henry Rifled. Will order up the Lyman 451114 mould. I will post when the rifles arrive, just as a matter of interest, will try the mould it comes with, and will also mean time order a couple of platinum lined nipples for same. thanks all for the kind responses to my query.
Kind regards
heelerau

[Tatume]

Note that the Parker-Hale Enfield Volunteer uses musket caps and the correct nipples have English threads. The more common Italian copies use a metric thread nipple that is not interchangeable. I have not found platinum lined musket cap nipples with the correct 5/16"-18 tpi thread.

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Search.aspx?search=parker%20hale

[heelerau]

Tatume, I reckon Buffalo Arms seem to have the correct platinum lined nipples, 5/16 x 18 thread listed, I will double check before ordering them. They are pretty dear, guess platinum is real expensive.
Cheers
heelerau

[451whitworth]

I have an Italian made 451 Volunteer & Whitworth that use 5/16-20 threads on the nipples while my English made PH's are 5/16-18.

[Tatume]

All of the Italian Volunteers I have seen use 8-1.25 mm thread nipples. This is extremely close to 5/16-20 English threads. Eight millimeters is 0.315" and 5/16" is 0.313", while 1.25 mm thread is 20.320 tpi. I believe the Italian Volunteers all use metric thread nipples, but the sizes are just converted to English for convenience.

The Parker-Hale Volunteers are true 5/16"-18 tpi English threads.

[451whitworth]

well Tom, that makes sense. I always thought that 20 TPI was a strange choice but since my Pedersoli guns are not metric but all 1/4"-28 I didn't really think about it much. I just compared my 1.25 pitch gauge vs. 20 TPI gauge and the first 4-5 threads do line up but when you get to thread 6 the difference becomes visible.

[heelerau]

Gentlemen, tomorrow morning I finally pick up my Parker Hale Volunteer .451 and Navy Rifle. It has been a 7 week wait for the paperwork to work its way through. Will try them out next Saturday, it will be off the bench and only at 100yds, and will try the original owners loads. I will in due course as discussed in this thread purchase the correct mould, and later try paper patched bullets as well.
Cheers all
heelerau

[heelerau]

Gentlemen I banged off 13 rounds from the .451 today off the bench at my mates farm rifle range. I used 73 grains of FFg goex with a waxed card over powder wad, cleaned between shots, used a drop tube to charge with powder. The rifle shot very high. At 50 yds I had to aim at the bottom edge of the target to get it to print at about the 5/6 ring at 12 o'clock, I had to use the same point of aim at 100yds off the bench. It came with only 1 adjustable for windage rear sight blade. The rifle has been bedded, and all bands and tang were tight without being ridiculous. Considering I did not weigh any of the bullets and they were shot unsized as I do not have a sizing die at this stage, it grouped well enough, would have been 8 ring group. I would expect much better once I get properly sorted out with the correct bullet mould etc. The recoil was surprisingly mild to what I expected. I did put a new cone on the rifle as the original one was gas cut badly. Lube was 5/1 beeswax to unsalted lard, the projectile was pure lead. The rifle did not foul, and loaded easily each shot.
I may have to make a new sight blade with a much deeper cut to drop the point of aim, I have only the one insert for the hooded front sight, and I don't know whether they come in various nights, as wether the rifle would have had a set of interchangeable rear sight leaves. Can anyone confirm whether there were different leaves for 50 to 100yds. I suspect the rifle would be bang on at 200 with its current sight configuration, and yes the ladder was fully depressed, and there appears to be no fine elevation adjustment on the existing leaf, windage only.


Cheers


heelerau

[heelerau]

Gents fired at 200yds the other day, got 10 scoring shots out of 13. Nipple is badly gas cut, so will order a new platinum lined one and try the same load again and see it it tightens up. Still have to aim at the bottom of the white to print high in the black.

Cheers

heelerau

[Rattus58]

Gentlemen I banged off 13 rounds from the .451 today off the bench at my mates farm rifle range. I used 73 grains of FFg goex with a waxed card over powder wad, cleaned between shots, used a drop tube to charge with powder. The rifle shot very high. At 50 yds I had to aim at the bottom edge of the target to get it to print at about the 5/6 ring at 12 o'clock, I had to use the same point of aim at 100yds off the bench. It came with only 1 adjustable for windage rear sight blade. The rifle has been bedded, and all bands and tang were tight without being ridiculous. Considering I did not weigh any of the bullets and they were shot unsized as I do not have a sizing die at this stage, it grouped well enough, would have been 8 ring group. I would expect much better once I get properly sorted out with the correct bullet mould etc. The recoil was surprisingly mild to what I expected. I did put a new cone on the rifle as the original one was gas cut badly. Lube was 5/1 beeswax to unsalted lard, the projectile was pure lead. The rifle did not foul, and loaded easily each shot.
I may have to make a new sight blade with a much deeper cut to drop the point of aim, I have only the one insert for the hooded front sight, and I don't know whether they come in various nights, as wether the rifle would have had a set of interchangeable rear sight leaves. Can anyone confirm whether there were different leaves for 50 to 100yds. I suspect the rifle would be bang on at 200 with its current sight configuration, and yes the ladder was fully depressed, and there appears to be no fine elevation adjustment on the existing leaf, windage only.


Cheers


heelerau

You can't raise the front sight post???

[heelerau]

Rattus, I have now fitted a nice Pedersoli tang sight with some windage adjustment. Shot an 8 ring group at 100 off the bench, realise this is pretty poor, but just the other day my new platinum lined cone arrived and has been fitted, also got a .451 rotary wad punch. I am not going to use new wads, I just want to see how the group goes with just the new cone, before changing anything else. Will go to the range this Thursday. I now have a sensible point of aim for 100 yds. Pretty pleased with the new tang sight.

Cheers

Heelerau

Heelerau

[heelerau]

Gents,
today shot my Volunteer off the bench at 100m. Had one misfire first shot, second cap got it away. I put 10 rounds down range and basically shot a 7 ring group. I used the new .451 wads cut with my new rotary wad punch. greased felt wad over powder, card wad on top, then wipe. Guess following the instructions was a good idea !!! I am a bit slow. The last few shots were all in the 9 ring. Still 73 grs of Goex FFg, I did not wiegh the projectiles, just eyeballed them. Next go round I will weigh them into groups of 1/2 grs variation. The point of todays excersize was to get the rifle fireing reliably. Now I can start to work on group size. The last 4shots were all 9 ring, so feel that may be promising
cheers
Gordon


.451 8th Feb 2015http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P1010424.jpg (http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P1010424.jpg.html)

[heelerau]

either will work. I use the 457121 & 451114 in my PH Volunteer sized to .450" along with a few other styles. Does your rifle have Rigby or Henry rifling?Gentlemen, have just got back from the range. Shot the .451 using this time 80 grains of FFg Goex, beer coaster wad over powder, wet wipe, dry wipe, same bullet, thumb seat, using the 5 to 1 volume beeswax to lard. Scored 93 at 100m off the bench. Very bright day, had to aim off at 60clock as don't have enough adjustment so some stringing. Had no miss fires for the 13 rounds, best 10 to count. The last 5 shots were all in the 10 ring, either at 3 or 9 oclock. Club captain said he had not seen a Volunteer shoot so well. Anyways that is enough skiting from me. The trick seems to be the cleaning, but I have now fitted the rifle with a ramrod and shot with this in place. A mate brought some of the same bullet as mine, with a lube mix of synthetic oil and beeswax, with some 70 grain charges of FFg Wano. I shot a 5 shot group on another target and shot a 9 ring group, this rifle seems to be quite forgiving?. I did not notice any more recoil with the increase from73 to 80 grains, and have found her very comfortable to shoot. Next time I will have a go at the 200m target. I suspect the bullet that I am using as the ogive is not bore size may fail at the much longer ranges of 300m plus and may look a the postal bullet. http://http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P1010450.jpg (http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P1010450.jpg.html)

[PAT303]

What club did you shoot at?. Pat

[heelerau]

Perth Muzzleloading Club, was for many years with the Adelaide Black Powder boys before coming west in '90.

[PAT303]

Well I'll have to come up and we can have a volunteer shoot off,you've met Doctor Leo then,top bloke. Pat

[heelerau]

Pat, you are on, 50cents a shot, 10 best winner take all !!!

cheers

gordon

[Zouave 58]

A quick comment about the lined nipple; if the issue is erosion causing an eventual shift in point of impact due to variation in ignition, then beryllium nipples might be a cheaper solution as they are both rust proof and highly resistant to erosion. They do have a tendency to batter over time and in some rifles with small powder chambers in the bolster the ignition channel needs to be widened and the bottom of the venturi counterbored. I've used them without modification in standard civil war muskets but they must be modified for either a 1841 Mississippi rifle or a Remington Zouave. Just a thought...

[Silfield]

I have been using beryllium nipples in my Volunteer for a few years now and they tend to last a very long time. Last time I brought a couple they were about £9 each.

[heelerau]

I bought a Platinum lined nipple from the US, for about $60 US. I have a beryllium nipple on a little leman rifle which I have had for 35yrs, admittedly I don't shoot it hell of a lot.

[heelerau]

Gents, have now got a set of Lyman Mod 17 inserts from Lee Shaver, have fitted one of the posts, I note it is a little taller than the one that came with the rifle, so hopefully will have a more sensible sight picture at 100m. It has been suggested that I should try one of the front sight apertures, will have the set with me at the range so will give that a try as well. We are shooting out to two hundred meters on Sunday. Zouave, I have been thinking about opening up the vent directly below the nipple. Just a tad. I am unable to remove the vent screw in the bolster at this stage. I give it a good blast with the air compressor when cleaning, and have a sharp piano wire nipple prick as I do have the odd misfire when firing the first few shots.

[heelerau]

Gentlemen, Happy New Year , trust you all had a Merry Christmas as well.
Yesterday, I took the Volunteer back to the range after a hiatus of several months. 85 grains Goex FFg, this time a waxed felt wad over powder, beer coaster wad on top, wipe with a dampened flannel patch via a proper fitted ribbed brass jag, which allowed the bore to be cleaned to the top of the wad. I lowered the rear sight a couple of turns and brought the group pretty well central. It took me two adjustments hence the 3 shots in the white at about 1'oclock. It was a hot bright still morning. 13 shots, 10 to score at 70. Range 200m. I could lower the rear sight another 1/4 turn and that should bring it completely central.
A mate from the Canada's is sending me some postal bullets both in pure lead and 20/1 lead tin. I suspect this bullet should perform much better than my current one which has a long unsupported ogive.

Cheers

Gordon...http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P1020007.jpg (http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P1020007.jpg.html)

[dromia]

In my experience the orignal PH Volunteers have to be the easiest muzzle loading rifles to load and shoot for, just drop in the powder, an overpowder wad, drop down a soft alloy Lyman 451114PH sized to 0.451" lubed with any BP lube mixture and it will shoot well.


This is a typical 100 yard group from my 3 band volunteer, the rifle will do better but is handicapped by my diminishing shooting ability and eye sight and I am handicapped by the open sights.




http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/adamsutherland/Parker%20Hale%20ML%20August%202015/IMG_7393.jpg

[Bad Ass Wallace]

Mine is an early model with square Rigby rifling. As others have said the easiest m/z to tune for and get really good accuracy. Just a few things that make me curious, I cast my boolits from 1:40 and shoot as cast even though the rifle came with a push through sizer. The bullet mould that came with it casts .451 x 506gns with 3 generous grease grooves and I just finger lube with SPG.

I clean after each shot and use a 36" brass drop tube to place the 85gns Wano 2P into the chamber area. This proceedure has reduced group sizes from 4-5MOA to 2.5MOA

I see on your bookshelf an interest in "Zulu". (My uniform is a repro of 1st Moreton Regiment with Queensland Artillary had badge!)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/Maj%20Wallace%20amp%20Part_zpsusci27qj.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BAWallace/media/Maj%20Wallace%20amp%20Part_zpsusci27qj.jpg.html)

[heelerau]

Mate, could you please post a photo of your bullet? ZULU, a great film, I remember watching it whilst holding my own Martini Enfield in 577/450 !

Cheers

[dromia]

I use a drop tube too, to get the powder into the patent breech, I also run a barely damp patch down when seating the wad followed by a dry patch just to keep bore condition consistent. I size the bullet to 0.451 but only to lube the bullet, if I dip lube them as cast they shoot just as well, the sized and lubed bullets are just cleaner at the muzzle and easier to load, they just drop down the barrel.

I find the Volunteers very forgiving rifles and shoot well out to medium distances with little preparation, longer distances require more effort in being consistent and I batch weigh my bullets for anything over 600 yrds.

A Rigby rifled example is all I need to complete my Parker Hale muzzle loading collection.

I've had many Parker Hales through my hands over the years and have finally settled on these examples for my shooting collection. They are all original British made PHs.


From left to right: .577" 1861 Carbine, .577" 1858 Naval two band, .577" 1853 three band, .451" Henry rifled Volunteer two band, .451" Henry rifled Volunteer three band, .451" Whitworth hexagonal rifling.




http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/adamsutherland/Parker%20Hale%20ML%20August%202015/IMG_7392.jpg

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Tatume, I reckon Buffalo Arms seem to have the correct platinum lined nipples, 5/16 x 18 thread listed, I will double check before ordering them. They are pretty dear, guess platinum is real expensive.
Cheers
heelerau

It is indeed, although one could be made with platinum tubing from a jeweler's supplier at considerably less cost than sothime I have seen. Personally I would use stainless steel, which the Track of the Wolf website tells us are hardened 416, a cutlery steel. Some others may not be. They don't look at all glitzy, especially after a little use. They are available in the musket thread to use No11 taps, and this would be my choice. I don't believe there would be anything wrong with the ignition, and I think there would be less chance of the pressure lifting the hammer and causing faster erosion of the nipple.

Nipple threads are usually a very close fit, to exclude fouling and rust, so it is preferable to get the right one. It is possible to adjust a nipple thread pitch slightly by screwing in the wrong nipple until it sticks, tapping it until it shifts the threads, and then repeating the process until it is screwed in all the way. But 1.25mm. and 18tpi seems a it much for that, and this isn't a desperate case.

Nipple taps are available, but I would only use one of these if it was going to remove all of the old thread.

[heelerau]

Mate I did get a platinum lined nipple from Buff Arms, and seems to be lasting fine.

[Nobade]

Impressive gun collection you have there!

-Nobade

[dromia]

Impressive gun collection you have there!

-Nobade


Thank you.

[OhioBeekeeper]

I love my Volunteer. I shot a doe with it during Ohio's Deer Muzzleloader season a couple weeks ago using 85 grains of Graff FFFg, a card wad, and a 540 grain bullet originally cast for use in the Gibbs Rifle. Not much of a challenge though at around 30 yards.

[fgd135]

Nice shootin' Gordon, makes me want to head out to the gun club and shoot my own Volunteer--but with temps near 0° F right now and snow a bit deep, I may wait a couple of months...btw I have had good accuracy with both the 451114 and a 530 grain Postel style sized to .451", in pure lead. I'm just using a milk carton overpowder wad, lubing bullets with SPG. No leading, but as you, I'm wiping between shots.


Gentlemen, Happy New Year , trust you all had a Merry Christmas as well.
Yesterday, I took the Volunteer back to the range after a hiatus of several months. 85 grains Goex FFg, this time a waxed felt wad over powder, beer coaster wad on top, wipe with a dampened flannel patch via a proper fitted ribbed brass jag, which allowed the bore to be cleaned to the top of the wad. I lowered the rear sight a couple of turns and brought the group pretty well central. It took me two adjustments hence the 3 shots in the white at about 1'oclock. It was a hot bright still morning. 13 shots, 10 to score at 70. Range 200m. I could lower the rear sight another 1/4 turn and that should bring it completely central.
A mate from the Canada's is sending me some postal bullets both in pure lead and 20/1 lead tin. I suspect this bullet should perform much better than my current one which has a long unsupported ogive.

Cheers

Gordon...

[heelerau]

Gents,
finally got the trial bullets from my mate in the Canadas, came by dogsled !! It is a lee shaver bullet, 500 grain, from Buffalo Arms. Will get to try it Sunday, at 200m off the bench. Here is my last target, also at 200 m off the bench, an improvement, will have to drop the rear sight a tad to dead centre it. I realise it is still not a great group, but things are improving, mainly my cleaning technique. The 3 shots in the white at about 1 o'clock were my sighters, after which I adjusted the rear sight . The day was hot and still, little wind and ver bright. 80 grains of FFg Goex, waxed felt over powder, beer coaster wad over waxed wad. All bullets dropped to the top of the powder charge with just the weight of the range rod.
This target has been shot with my current bullet, 3 groove, long unsupported ogive.


Cheers

heeler http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P1020007.jpg (http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P1020007.jpg.html)

[heelerau]

Gents, a mate on the American Long Rifle Forum, a very kind and knowledgeable chap, sent me some of these bullets and a sizer die, even though he used different Lyman numbers going back to the late '50s and '60s, I am pretty sure this bullet is the same as the Whitworth 457121PH 475 grain. anyway once again a cold blowy day, I shot 13 rounds and got the best group yet. As this bullet is nearly 100 grains lighter than my regular bullet I set the bull into the top of the ring on the front sight, so aimed off with its inherent vagaries. I still do not have a good scope for this range, but did get a few shots spotted after I had already put 3 down range, which were within 2 inches of each other ! So I just shot for a group. Looks like by the way the rifle is shooting close to point of aim, so bullet weight has not made much of a difference. Same charge of 85 Grains of Goex FFg. Counting the best 10 shots, discount the 3 shots in the 3 ring, bar one slightly wide shot in the 7 ring it is at worst a 9 ring group, with a few 10s at a guesshttp://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P8210013.jpg[/URL[URL=http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P8200012.jpg.html]http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P8200012.jpg[/URL[URL=http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P8200011.jpg.html]http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af241/heelerau/P8200011.jpg (http://s1012.photobucket.com/user/heelerau/media/P8210013.jpg.html)

[Good Cheer]

I've got one of those molds but nothing to shoot it in. Maybe I should fix that!

[srk]

175739

Hi
PH Volunteer
This was second group.
75grs 3f with Lyman mold/bullet 100yds
I mostly shoot at 200yds, so I am going to change front sight to a globe with level
I have that type of front sight on my Gibbs.
Great accurate guns

[heelerau]

SKR, is your rifle a Whitworth Parker Hale Volunteer?

[srk]

Hi
Not sure what you mean by Whitworth PH Volunteer?
It's a PH Volunteer.
I shot/tried 2 loads at 100yds.
First was 70 grains 3f Goex.
It was more to the tune of a pattern, then a group.
I then went up 5grs to 75 and shot the tighter group.
Believe it or not, the shot out of the group was actually a hang fire!
Cheers

[srk]

PH as in "Parker Hale"
And Volunteer as in "Volunteer"
Not sure how else to put it.
Which is how this thread started.
Need anything else clarified

[Tatume]

... is your rifle a Whitworth Parker Hale Volunteer?

Please allow me to clarify, I meant my comment for Heelerau.

Perhaps you meant a Parker-Hale Whitworth or Parker-Hale Volunteer?

[dromia]

The Parker Hale Whitworths have an hexagonal rifled bore and the Parker Hale Volunteers have Henry or Rigby rifling.

That is how Parker Hale classified them.

[heelerau]

The Parker Hale Whitworths have an hexagonal rifled bore and the Parker Hale Volunteers have Henry or Rigby rifling.

That is how Parker Hale classified them. as Dromia said !! Cheers I put it poorly.

[fiberoptik]

The Parker Hale Whitworths have an hexagonal rifled bore and the Parker Hale Volunteers have Henry or Rigby rifling.

That is how Parker Hale classified them.

So what is Henry or Rigby rifling any ways?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[fgd135]

So what is Henry or Rigby rifling any ways?


Rigby rifling is constant-depth and twist rifling (as opposed to progressive-depth and/or progressive twist) with narrow rounded lands and wider grooves, vaguely similar to Metford rifling.
Alexander Henry rifling is constant depth and twist with distinct triangular lands between flats. Martini Henry rifles are the best examples of this type, with 7 lands and grooves. Some of the PH Volunteers use it as well, SN begins with letter "H".

[heelerau]

Henry rifling works really well with paper patched bullets, I am hoping in due course to find out that works with the Rigby rifling.

[Lowpower]

I just picked up an Alexander Henry, the was from euroarms, new, unfired. The bore reads .451. It is a 3 band rifle. To be honest I'm not quite sure where to start. I shoot ML round ball and also a Browning BPCR in .45-70 and a Meecham 40-65. A friend told me to use conical bullets in the 520 gr range I'm not so sure I can ram those things down the barrel.

Old thread I know but it's exactly the kind of info I need. Thanks.

[Nobade]

Paper patched bullets. Patched to .001" under bore diameter. Depending on the paper you use it will start about .443" or so. Get Randy Wright's book on the subject to get yourself up to speed.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

[Lowpower]

Nobade,

Thanks for the reply. I just got home from a trip up to Spokane, Wa. where I'm taking to contractors about making changes to my retirement abode. I'm looking for the book online, now.

My bore dia is written on the barrel but I suppose I need to mic it? It shows .451 so from what you're saying I need to get to .450 with the patch. I guess I need to find a mold that drops .443-4 bullet. That's a start.

[Nobade]

Exactly. Try Buffalo Arms for that book. They also make good moulds for your rifle.

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

[Lowpower]

I looked on Buffalo Arms but everything they have for sale is backordered. I went to SageBrush and bought 50 ea. , money, paper patch .443 , 520 gr. I figured instead of buying a mold that I might not like I'd try some bullets that should work then buy mold. I've been buying from Buffalo Arms for years...Great group of folks and they're only a half hour from where I'm moving to for retirement.

[Saxtonyoung]

Not sure if your interested in plain Conicals or not but maybe a dozen years ago I made muzzleloader with a Green Mountain 45 Caliber black powder cartridge barrel with 1-18" twist and was shooting Lyman 457121 Witworth bullets sized to .450 and was having excellent accuracy out to 250 yards using a peep sight.

[Saxtonyoung]

Another great bullet would be the Lyman 451114 Volunteer bullet . I have the mold and cast a few bullets but have yet to shoot it. Mine cast a pure lead bullet right at .451 and approximately 450 grains.

[ResearchPress]

A friend told me to use conical bullets in the 520 gr range I'm not so sure I can ram those things down the barrel......
Grease groove or paper patched bullets will work fine if properly sized to just under bore size. There shouldn't be any need to force the bullet down the barrel or you risk deforming the base. With the relatively deep Henry rifling try pure lead to start with - you need the bullet to expand to the rifling. You could maybe try lead/tin alloys later.

Lighter bullets ok for short range, but you may wish to try around 530 grains if working out longer - I got good results (match winning) with a Parker-Hale Volunteer and grease groove bullets out to 600 yards.

David

[Tatume]

The Lyman 451114 bullet works extremely well for hunting with my Parker-Hale Volunteer, and kills like lightning. For practice I size them to 0.450" and they slide down the bore easily; little more than the weight of the ramrod is required to seat them. When hunting I use them as cast, which at 0.452" requires some force for seating. I do this because I don't want the bullet to move off the powder charge while carrying the rifle over the course of a day. Comparison shooting indicates there is no difference in accuracy or point of impact. At 450 grains the bullet is light for long range target shooting, but for hunting it is ideal.

[heelerau]

Gentlemen, I have been shooting my Volunteer with the Lyman 451114 bullet at 200m for some time now and am shooting consistent 8 ring groups. Have to do a bit more tinkering to see how much tighter it will go. I am using pure lead with greased felt wad over powder and card on top. My rifle has the early Rigby style rifling

[Tatume]

In my experience the Parker-Hale Volunteer shoots better with no wad or card. Just powder and the lubricated bullet.

[Moonax]

I just bought a Parker Hale Volunteer rifle with Henry rifling the mold the guy gave me is Lyman 454112 the bullets Mike out to 454 and will not start down the barrel. Today I ordered a push through sizer 450. Can I size the 454 down to 450 with the sizer ? I ordered some 450 Volunteer boolits from Track of the Wolf but can’t find a 451114 mold anywhere.

[Good Cheer]

Yes sir, you sure can.
Finger lube the grooves full and give her a try.

[25/303]

I am in the process of purchasing a Rigby rifled PH and am looking forward to the new world of development ahead.

[725]

Any chance of a photo of all this. It's a very interesting story.

[omgb]

OK, I'll start by saying I loved McCleod's Daughters and Sea Patrol. Great Aussie theater! I must admit however, that I favor Marmite over Vegemite. I buy it by the tub via Amazon here in the states. No one in my house will eat it except for me. Makes me pass wind like a Clydesdale though. Pity my wife! Anyway, I'm sorry to hear that buying a ML is such a hassle down under. I remember back in the 70s when it wasn't. I suppose if I told you that for MLs here in the states, with the single exceptions of NJ and IL, you can just buy them via the mail. At least for now. PH made some great rifles. I hope yours gives you many years of trouble free and highly accurate shooting.