Reload for 38/55

[6901]

A friend of mine has asked me to reload for his 38/55. He has 160+ cases and will buy me the dies.
He uses his Winchester 94 on deer every year and does a bit of plinking. He would do more if he wasn't scrounging the old Imperial factory loads that do best in his gun!
My question: He wants a jacketed 255 grain reload. I have zero experience with this cartridge. How difficult would it be to duplicate the old Imperial round?
My concerns are:performance on deer ( he loves the way that 255 grainer makes venison!)
and point of impact/ accuracy. That gun throws the old Imperial load exactly where you are looking.

I do actively load for 22 hornet,223, .243, 30/06, 303, 54R, 8mm and 45 Long Colt so I have a kernel of knowledge but know some people here have a cornfield full!

Many thanks

[ColColt]

New Winchester or antique? If relatively new or even some of the Commemoratives you can check out Hodgdon's website.

http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

[Outpost75]

In an antique 1894 Winchester, to approximate the ballistics of blackpowder ammunition, using smokeless powder, use the #375248, cast 1:25 tin/lead, sized .379"and load 22 grains of 4198, 24 grs. of RL7, 26 grs. of 3031, 30 grs. of 4895 or 33 grs. of 4064, RL-15 or Varget.

These loads will approach 1400 fps in a 26" barrel and will give good performance on game without hollowpointing. These are only starting loads if you compare to data in the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbok 4th Edition, but the people who worked up those loads shot only for pressure and velocity, the don't test accuracy, the so-called "accuracy loads" never having been tested ON PAPER, but being those which produced the smallest velocity and pressure variation. Their loads are typically based upon hard commercial alloy and have no basis in practical hunting use.

The manual publishers at Lyman either do not understand the velocity limitations of plainbased bullets with soft hunting alloy, for which the cartridge was designed, or they don't care and just push the "numbers" for whiz-bang! purposes only. In general, bore leading begins to impair accuracy of plainbased bullets as you go much above 1400 fps., using Scheutzen and blackpowder type alloys of 8-12 BHN which expand and perform properly on game, as these cartridges were originally intended. Hard bullets are poor choices for hunting unless you use a heavy bullet for the caliber with a flat point of at least 0.7 of the bullet diameter.

[Prodigal Son]

I'm shooting a Lengendary Frontiersman with 265 gr. with 21 grs. Of SR 4759 by the book it's supposed to be 1560 fps groups good too. 3 touching@ 55 yards yesterday but the tenon in the dovetail broke yesterday so I put it up have to go to work for a month until I can get back home. Great cartridge!

[yooper]

Barnes makes beauties in 255 grain jacketed. Midway has the .377 diameter but is currently out-of-stock on the .375 diameter. Were it me, I'd slug the barrel (or have him do it, it's his gun) and buy the diameter you need. There's lots of load data out there and it should be no problem duplicating factory ballistics with several powders, but it would be with the Barnes bullets.
yooper

[6901]

Many thanks. This gives me a good start. The gun is 1920's vintage. I have not slugged the bore or measures a bullet from the old Imperial round but will.
I do not cast. ( I am hoping not to be struck by lighting as I type!) I do shoot cast out of my 303's and 54R's that I have a source for. I will look into the 375449 mold and see.
Thanks again.

[Prodigal Son]

Great mold. I fixed the tenon today by making a new one. Tight as a frogs behind, home for the rest of the year come hell or high water! Now back to reloading!

[MtGun44]

Groove diameters can be VERY problematic with these guns. I have an old original with
.3795 groove diam that will JUST chamber a .380 boolit, and very limited shooting shows
that it appears to be working. .377 did NOT work and that was the biggest I could
get (didn't know about beagling then) from Lyman molds. Lee mold saved the
day for me. I need to get back to that rifle and get it really developed.

I have two friends that purchased Win 94s in 38-55 a number of years back, both new,
same order. One shoots the .375 jbullets accurately, the other throws them sideways.
Huge variation in groove diam even in modern versions.

Bill

[ColColt]

My Legendary Frontiersmen has a groove diameter of .379". C. Sharps is building a 74 Sharps for me in this caliber and they told me the bore/groove diameter would be .368/.375". That should make things easier.

[bigted]

COL. do post photo's of the sharps when it arrives. I have often played with the notion of having a '74' built in the 38-55 chamber. it would be very cool I recon and would be a fun shooter.

[ColColt]

I'll post several pics when it gets here. I had the mid range Soule tang sight with Globe front w/apertures and spirit level installed and a cheek rest. Other than that, nothing elaborate.

[missionary5155]

Greetings
I have several 1894's made before 1930 and they each seem to be of a different grove. And worse is the throats. They range from .382+ down to .379+ . Then the one with the fatest throat has a tight chamber neck and will only take a .379+ diameter boolit with a little pull on the handle. Only way I can get that one to shoot half descent with smokeless is to drop the powder, add a cereal box .375 wad, fill with COW to bullet base and add the 255 grain boolit. Then it will shoot to 4 inches + at 100 yards.
With a 255 cast of 40-1 (mold lapped to drop 40-1 at .379+) then enough 3F to be compressed about 1/8 inch by the boolit base that load will do about 2.5 inches at 100 yards. Corn Crunchers have little awareness that they just got popped with a BP load either. I hunt river bottoms so all my shots are close. That 40-1 makes a nice exit hole busting through ribs. Really smacks coyote shoulders with authority. Does do alot of damage on the far exit side.
So there are some other options. I use COW (Cream of Wheat) or corn meal in any straight wall cartridge that a fat enough boolit will not fill the throat due to a too tight chamber. But you must start the load work up with COW. Do not get to a top load and decide to add COW to that load. Back off and start all over. COW changes pressure curves so do be aware..
Mike in Peru

[Dean2]

Many thanks. This gives me a good start. The gun is 1920's vintage. I have not slugged the bore or measures a bullet from the old Imperial round but will.
I do not cast. ( I am hoping not to be struck by lighting as I type!) I do shoot cast out of my 303's and 54R's that I have a source for. I will look into the 375449 mold and see.
Thanks again.

I have measured the old Imperial/Dominion Jacketed 255 grain, multy cannaleure bullets with the fairly large flat point. All measured exactly .375. The Hornady 220 Flat point in .375 behaves very similar on game.

[bigted]

I have measured the old Imperial/Dominion Jacketed 255 grain, multy cannaleure bullets with the fairly large flat point. All measured exactly .375. The Hornady 220 Flat point in .375 behaves very similar on game.

don't know how it responds on game ... I do know however that in my rifle it will clover leaf at 65 yds all day long and at 100 it will mostly hover in 1 ragged hole as long as I do my part on the trigger. 30 grains IMR 3031 behind that jaxeted bugger is maybe a bit hot tho for the older guns.