Guess this might do it -------------

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Well, out to test some loads with a different powder and the 465gr WFN in my RUGER 45/70.

Not that my good to go load of 47.5gr of H335 at 1650fps isn't doing the job, cause it is in spades, but just to see if I could tweak the groups a bit tighter.

Had the list of test loads for 3031 and found with the lowest load I planned to test that I had a major case capacity issue. Wouldn't fit, simple as that.

So, abandon that idea and give RL7 a try.

A respected poster, said that the RL7 would not likely do well with this bullet weight, but Oh Well, I'll give it a try.

Now, not needing more velocity here, but if it came with better groups, I guess I could live with it.

Believe me when I say that a 465gr WFN is plenty and extremely deadly - at 1650fps - on game up to and including the 2 elk I have taken with that load.

Well started testing the loads, the first group with 43gr of the RL7 went two inches and the groups started to open up from there to as big as 4".

Hmmmmmmm? Was thinking that maybe I was past the sweet spot for this rifle and boolit .

Not close to pressure issues, so may as well test the rest of the series when what to my wondering eyes should I behold, but the groups beginning to decrease in size.

I guess I could live with groups just over 7/8" w/46gr RL7 and just less then 1890fps.

Anyway, plan to run some more tests this afternoon/evening with .3gr variations above and below the 46gr level and see if this shows good results.

As said, don't need the increase of velocity, but smaller groups are always welcome.

By the way, the Lyman cast bullet book shows a max load of the RL7 to be 48gr - in the RUGER #1 - with about a 485 gr bullet, and my velocities with the 465 are showing a fair bit higher results then the book would lead me to expect.

More info after this next shooting/testing session.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[helice]

Being without a 45-70 (horrors) I can only speak of the 444 Marlin. I have found excellent results with multiple boolit weights using Re-L7. It has become my go-to powder. I must confess that the 300 WFN is my longest boolit so I know zip about its performance with "the long and the mighty." Glad to see that you finally got what you were looking for. Dang- I'd never complain about a 7/8" group. Nice report, looking forward to more. CDOC.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Helice,

Be leaving within the next hour for the friend's range.

Hope the results are close to that seen on Thursday.

I know without testing to confirm results you can quickly be lead down the primrose path.

However, seeing the results for the targets leading up to the results, I feel reasonable confident that the 4 - 5 shot test groups with a .3gr spread, will cover and possibly fine tune Thursday's results.

Going to be the pits if this works, as I am reasonably well stocked with the H335 I have been using and almost out of the RL7.

Plus the fact that the "Custom Dial" for my new Leupold CDS scope is made for the 1650fps velocity.

If these work out, will need to see if I can find some RL7 and talk to the techs at Leupold and get a new dial made.

AS said earlier, don't really need the increase of velocity but it would be hard to pass up better groups.

Interesting, with the rifle zeroed at 100yds, turning the CDS dial to the maximum range setting or 275yds. puts the point of impact, 14" high at 100yds.

With the early elk season starting next week. am not likely to get a chance to test the ranges beyond 100yds on paper.

CDOC

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Well, the second round to testing is completed, and it appears the great group was a fluke.

That group was with 46gr of the RL#7 and today I shot, 45.7, 46, 46.3 and 46.6 grains and even though there was some shots clustering nicely, it didn't happen for the 5 shots of each group.

Now, with the earlier tests using only 3 rounds per group, it makes one wonder if a 4th and 5th shot had gone down range, would those shots have greatly opened the groups as seen today.

Guess it is really not relevant at this point as todays groups were not only not good, but were not consistent, other then consistently bad.

So, not a really big thing, just proves the importance of good testing and verification .

This also bares out what Bruce - BABore - said about RL7 not doing well with the heavier Boolits. So far, with my dealings with Bruce, he seems to have the habit of being correct a large part of the time.

Back to the 47.5gr of H335 and watch out deer an elk, as I'm ready for ya!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[TXGunNut]

Good job! I've been fooled by 3-shot groups before, I don't use them for load testing anymore. Some folks swear by 10-shot test groups. I read a very good explanation of this over on TFL a few years back.
Glad you figured it out, I'm thinking you supected your old H335 load was the best all along. RL-7 works great under my RD 460-350 but I guess it just doesn't like the heavies, will put that in my load notes.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

TXgunnut,

Sure didn't need the increase in velocity, but as said earlier, I'd have lived with it if the confirmation tests had proved out the first groups.

By the way, Bruce - BABore - is the same one who put me on to the H335 load behind his 465gr WFN, complete with the charge weight.

I just had some other powders, and felt I needed to check em out.

However, I'll load up some more of the 47.5gr H335 loads and whoa to any elk that gives me a reasonable shot any where within 200+ yards.

Just as a side light, have been testing a new RUGER Amereican 30/06 during the same sessions as the 45/70 tests, and my oh my that is a fine shooting rifle.

First series of test loads in this rifle pointed the way, and yesterday's session confirmed those results. 61.5gr of RL22 behind a 165gr Hornady Interlock is just doing very fine. Consistent, shot after shot.

If I was interested in putting out the effort, I believe the rifle would be a consistent, sub M.O.A. shooter as the load listed above shoots right at an inch or less and this is the only powder I have tested.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[TXGunNut]

As you may recall my 350 gr RD boolit is not setting any speed records either, suspect it leaves my Guide Gun loafing along at about 1800 fps. 45-70 wasn't built for speed; didn't need it then, doesn't need it now. I was actually looking for a milder load but that's where this boolit/powder combo came together in this rifle.
I've been shooting Hornady's #3040 spire point 165 gr for quite a few years myself, old rifle loved it over a stiff charge of Varget, current rifle likes it over a milder charge of H4350 @ about 2700 fps. Solid performer on paper and critters both. New rifle likes it's big brother, Hornady's #3070 180 Interlock spire point but I don't enjoy shooting it and I'm sure the critters I hunt won't notice the difference.

[Idaho Mule]

Hi CDOC, good report there. Glad to see someone else doesn't trust 3 shot groups. I've been playing with a certain .356 Winchester and had the first 3 of a group touching, but the shots 4 and 5 opened it up to over 2.5 inches. That is still a viable load for my application so I will keep playing in that range.
good to hear you're still kicking, we are about to start chasing elk too. Hope to get it done with kind of quick if we can. I need to get with you and have breakfast again some day-- my turn. JW

[TXGunNut]

I just had a scope teach me a lesson about 3 shot groups. It would put 2-3 rounds where I wanted them but would throw a flyer every 3-4 rounds. Pretty sure I sold a good rifle because of a questionable scope. I feel 5 rounds is minimum, prefer two 5-round groups.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Morn'in Mule, Long time since I've heard from your direction. ------- Bunch of water under the bridge in that time, with the wife needing a brain surgery to remove a couple tumors, one of which greatly compromised her sight.

They were VERY low on the scale of possible malignancy, but if they have not been found and removed, she would have lost all of her sight.

So, have been working towards a, "new normal," and this past week was the first time I have been out shooting since the May 13th surgery.

Have new phones that have LARGE buttons and they talk to you when a button is pushed, I now have a cell phone so Sharon can get in touch with me, we have a reader thingy that puts printed info - books, magazines, knitting instructions etc. etc. on a monitor, and the TV which is now the monitor was replaced by a much larger screen.

There is a Talking book service - federal program for the blind - which is then through the state library system. The player which is on long term loan is very user friendly and that really helps her pass the time.

The phones and cell phone should make it so I can get out - VERY EARLEY MORNING - for the early elk season. With the hot weather, unless something is down, I'll be home by about the time she is ready to get up and going.

Anyway, loaded up a bunch of the 465gr WFN ahead of the 47.5gr charge of H335 last night, so I'm ready to put something on the ground.

The new Leupold "CDS" scope on the 45/70 seems to be doing OK. Do Need to get out and test it at different dial ranges.

I did, as required for the system to work correctly, zero the rifle at 100yds, then just for fun cranked it up to the max dial distance of 275yds and with the 100yd zero, it then hits 14" high at 100yds.

later,

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot